From the Richmond Times Dispatch:

The state Republican Party will require voters to sign a loyalty oath in order to participate in the March 6 presidential primary.

Anyone who wants to vote must sign a form at the polling place pledging to support the eventual Republican nominee for president. Anyone who refuses to sign will be barred from voting in the primary.

During a brief meeting Wednesday at the state Capitol, the State Board of Elections voted 3-0 to approve three forms developed by the election board’s staff to implement the loyalty pledge requested by the state GOP.

Is that even legal?  I thought that Virginia primaries were open to any registered voter, regardless of party.   If Republicans want to keep their votes ‘pure’ it seems to me that they should have a convention primary.  That’s a little easier to keep the ‘riff raff’ out of. 

I expect there will be legal challenges.  If I were a Republican, I would not like being held to the standard of voting for anyone who happens to win the nomination.  In fact, that was one reason I left the Democrats.  I didn’t like having to pledge a vote. 

If Republicans want to keep their primary pure, then they need to change the state laws so that one must register as either a Democrat or Republican to be able to vote in a primary (or some other combination for third party Independents).  Until that happens, I would say that any registered voter should get to vote in an election.

From  the State Board of Elections website:

Can I vote for candidates from different parties?
   Virginia is an open primary state which means that any qualified voter can vote in either party’s primary election. Virginia does not have party registration in its voter registration process. In other words, citizens do not designate a political party affiliation when registering to vote in Virginia. The only restriction is when more than one party primary is held on the same day, also known as a dual primary. While Virginia election law stipulates that any qualified voter may voter in either political party’s primary, no voter may vote in more than one political party’s primary on the same election day.

 If I vote in a particular party’s primary, will my voter registration records become affiliated with that party?
   No.  Voting in any party’s primary election in Virginia does not affiliate the voter with either of the political parties.  The fact that you voted in the party’s primary becomes part of your voting history but, does not affiliate you with either political party.  Voting in a party’s primary does not hinder the voter’s choices in future elections (primary or general).  (Emphasis mine)

121 Thoughts to “Republicans to require loyalty oath”

  1. The radio just mentioned that the RPV is getting A LOT of pushback and is looking at getting rid of the “oath.”

    1. Verizon is getting a lot of push back also for their $2.00 pay online fee. The nerve! They are real bastards about cutting you off within 30 days also. 10 days after the due date? Zap. Right in the middle of the night.

      Verizon just is getting too big for its britches, like netflix. Comcast is looking better and better. I never had a problem with them. I also never got zapped by them either.

  2. George S. Harris

    @Moon-howler
    Take a look at Glen Goyne. So smooth you will think you are drinking a Rusty Nail. If you want to try a different Irish, try Kilbeggin.

    As to the oath, just remember what Forrest Gump’s mother’s admonition: “Stupid is as stupid does.”

    As to the “down ticket”, if the indecision being evidenced in Iowa is any clue, what happens here in a Republican primary may be absolutely meaningless. And since there are only two candidates, does it really make any difference what happens here?

    1. sssshhhhhh@ George

      Don’t tell MoM. I don’t want him to up the ante to serve as middle man.

  3. @Lafayette

    I am still waiting to hear why I am more than 475 ft from the 50th. Why do I think that was a slam for some reason?

    I would have thought perhaps I was in the end zone but 475 feet would be in the stands.

    I could always make a macro and just keep askin’

  4. Lafayette

    Moon-howler :@Lafayette
    I am still waiting to hear why I am more than 475 ft from the 50th. Why do I think that was a slam for some reason?
    I would have thought perhaps I was in the end zone but 475 feet would be in the stands.
    I could always make a macro and just keep askin’

    It was a slam alright, but not at you. Just the fact of how once again our hoods got carved up. This HOD district at the hands of our GA. I hate being so close several districts all for the sake of politics.

    1. Am I really only 475 feet from being in the 50th district? You know, I was thinking football and being in the end zone. LOL LOL Getting ready to get kicked over the goal posts of life or something.

      Just wanted to know who was getting ready to kick me…..But I see it has already been done. GRRRRRRRRR

  5. Elena

    So the Republican Party is opposed to real democracy? Isn’t this country about freedom or have I been mislead all these years.

  6. Elena

    Even if I am a registered D or R, does that still beholden me to only be able to vote party line?

    1. I would hope that this latest move by RPV would anger Republicans even more than I or Ds. I know the ones who got pressured by the local party after the PWC primary wre pretty pissed off over being told they would support thus and such person, even though they found some of those people to be morally reprehensible.

  7. Lafayette

    @Moon-howler
    You are much further away than 475′. That’s how close I am. Also, three magesterial districts converge less than 2,000′ away.

  8. Lafayette

    @Steve Thomas
    Before I get started let me start with HAPPY NEW YEAR to you and yours! 🙂

    Now, we’ve had this discussion to some degree before. You’ve explained to me in detail how the city GOP operates. I have only witnessed conventions. I would NEVER register with either party.I’ve always voted a split ticket. Therefore, I would never dream of participating a closed party primary events. I’ve only gone to the polls and voted in open primaries. I’ve done so, because I can. I’ve supported the party in that race for the primaries I’ve voted in prior years. This year was the ONE AND ONLY exception, and that was very justified. It’s no secrect, that was for our district supervisor race. I vote for a person’s views on issues, not the party.

    So, as long as it’s an open primary, I should be able to vote without signing a pledge/oath. They are both pretty much the same in my mind, as they are both promises. But, that’s just MY opinion. I have no problem if the Commonwealth wanted to change the rules and voters register by party.

    1. Lafayette is right. The primary held this summer for supervisor didn’t interest me because it was Republican or Democrat. I supported the person who best represented my views. That race was more contentious than if it had been Democrat vs Republican.

      I also agree that if it is an open primary, anyone should be able to vote since we are all paying for the election. If Republicans or Democrats want to hold a firehouse primary or convention, I have no problem with that either and often that doesn’t exclude people who aren’t registered. I am not even sure what ‘registered’ means. You don’t register by party when you register to vote.

      When I was a Republican, I was never anything but a voter. When I was a Democrat, I sat on committee and that is what ‘registered’ me and gave them ownership of me. When I no longer sat on committee, I became an independent. One reason I did so is because sitting on committee, I was expected to support the Democratic candidate, regardless of whether I felt that person the best for the office. I didn’t like that idea. I understand why it happens though. It was just worth it to me to not have any ties that compromised my belief system.

      I don’t think Virginia will ever go to party registration via the election board. I can’t even say why. I used to be told, when I was a kid, it was too Yankee. (whatever that means) I think anything that attempts to inhibit voters from casting a ballot for who they believe is the best person for the job hurts America. Convince me otherwise.

  9. Steve Thomas

    @Elena

    No, the Republican party is upposed to Democrats trying to influence who is selected to be the GOP nominee, who have absolutely no intention of voting for any Republican presidential candidate. For what seems like the millionth time, nominations contests are internal affairs and by their very nature are supposed to be exclusive to Republicans, and Independents who intend to vote Republican. Respectfully, I find this criticism of the GOP slightly hypocritical. If they chose to hold a convention, you would be required to sign the same oath on your delegate form. This oath will appear on the form all delegate attendees must submit to attend the Manassas GOP convention on January 28th. So what about the Democrats? Can someone please tell me when the Caucus, Canvas, Convention or Primary was held to select the Democrat candiate(s) for the last PWC elections? How about for State delegate? When is the Democrat convention, party caucus, canvas, or Mass Meeting to select Democrat nominees for Manassas City Council or Mayor? When was their “Call to Meeting” published? Year after year, Democrat candidates just magically appear. Who selected Babar Lateef, Luke Torian, Jeanette Rishell? So maybe only one person filed for each of these offices. You still have to schedule a primary, caucus, convention or canvass, and announce it to the public, along with filing requirements and deadlines. Why is it that everyone seems to know all the particulars of the GOP, yet the Democrats are as secretive as North Korea? I’ll tell you why: their candidate selection process is indeed exclusive. About the only exception are statewide primaries, for federal offices, and perhaps governor. Spare me all this gobbledy-gook implying that the GOP wants to disenfranchise people. We are very open about how we operate. Anyone can vote in this primary. While I don’t support the oath for a primary, based on reasons of practicality, as a matter of principle, if you want to vote in the GOP primary, there should be an expectation that you intend to vote for the GOP nominee. So you sign the oath, with the expectation that the guy or gal you are voting for will win, unless of course your intent is to ensure the weakest possible opponent to face Obama. If this isn’t your intention, and you fully intend to support the guy or gal you are voting for, should they win the nomination, where’s the problem in signing the oath? is the oath enforceable? No. Nobody except you (and your hairdresser) will know who you voted for in the General.

    1. @Steve

      I think a few people from both parties try to negatively influence each other’s primaries but the practice is limited to a few politically immature individuals each time. I have heard both D and R talk about it and say they are doing it but I think it is mostly mouth flashing. It takes a great deal of organization to pull it off, for sure. Please don’t act like it is a one sided thing that just Democrats do. I know better.

      As you and I have discussed, the Democratic party is not strong in Prince William County like it was when I first moved here. You asked about the latest local race for Democrats? There was no need for a primary or caucus. Just one person ran for chair because the other person pulled his name out of the hat.

      They aren’t working in secret as much as there just aren’t that many Democrats. For example, if I want to put up a sign for a Democrat for say, Senate or Congress or …gasp…president, I have had to go outside PWC. I will be specific. Bruce is going to come down off the mountain and smite me for this one but I will also say it wasn’t during Bruce’s watch. I wanted to put up a Mark Warner sign. I have always liked Mark Warner. PWC had no Warner signs. I had to call his Arlington office and ask how to get one. They sent 2 over to the City of Manassas Democrats and my son walked over and picked them up for me. Good grief!

      There were no Obama signs on the Western end of the county. I got mine from Loudoun County. I saw a couple planting signs and I stopped the car on the way back from West Virginia and asked for one. I live on a very long road, probably now one of the longest in the western end of the county that isn’t a major highway. I was the only person with an Obama sign on that road. I was also the only person with a mark Warner sign, before that.

      I don’t have a problem with Republicans or Democrats going alternative routes to chose who is going to run. However, when they have a primary using materials from the public coffers, I expect to be able to vote. I don’t even mind being asked to sign a pledge or oath as long as I can vote and say no. The part that really irritates the living hell out of me was reading that if I didn’t sign the pledge I wouldn’t be allowed to vote. That gesture crosses the Rubicon.

  10. Steve Thomas

    @Elena

    “Even if I am a registered D or R, does that still beholden me to only be able to vote party line?”

    The point is moot. There is no voter registration by party in Virginia. If their was, we would have closed primaries, so you have to be a member of that party to vote in a nominations contest. In a general, you can vote for whomever you please. You are only obligated to vote your principles.

    1. Unless you aren’t given a ballot because you refuse to sign the pledge. @Steve

      That is my only problem with it.

  11. Steve Thomas

    @Lafayette
    “So, as long as it’s an open primary, I should be able to vote without signing a pledge/oath.”

    And a Happy New Year to you too!

    As I have said previously, I do not support the oath for primaries for reasons of practicality, while I support the oath on principle for conventions, mass meeting, and party canvass (firehouse primary). Believe it or not, all methods of nomination are open. However, if you have attended one of these GOP conventions in the past, you did sign the oath, when you signed your delegate form. And as I have previously said also, if you are an Independent who intends to vote Republican in any particular race in a certain election cycle, come on down to the convention. Now here is a rare criticism of the RPV: You knew Obama wouldn’t have a primary opponent, so there would only be one VA primary on Super Tuesday. Why the heck did you select a primary as a method of nomination, if you were concerned about mischief voting? So you compound this by requiring the oath? Right after eliminating 50% of the candidates who submitted signatures to be on the ballot? Was the alcohol invloved at the central committee meeting when these decisions were made?

    1. Steve, I think you have made some excellent points. Why was an open primary chosen?

      I remember the days before we had presidential primaries. In fact, it wasn’t all that many years ago. It is a lot cheaper and a lot less risky just to have a caucus, convention or firehouse primary.

      Alcohol? That sounds plausible.

  12. Lafayette

    I live in the county and they don’t seem to be as open as you city folk are. I was only at the convention to help a mutual friend. I’ve never been a delegate for anything. Remember, I questioned you about a know Independent being at that convention. I understood your explanation and like that way. However, the PW GOPers seem to be more closed minded and probably wouldn’t be very welcoming of me at a party event. However, it’s no problem if I want to attend and event for/hosted by any local R.

    It makes no sense to me either as to why the GOP has opted to go this oath route. I think that there a quite few D’s that probably will not be voting for Obama a second time. I’ve talked to a couple of those folks. So, if they are planning to vote for an R they are cut out of the process the way this. You know I’m the last person that could answer the questions above. I do find it very troublesome. Mr. Laf is a R, and he said he absolutely refuses to sign that oath, and will bypass the primary process. What a shame this is disenfranchising a person that always votes for the GOP candidate. I think we all pretty much agree this is screwed up. If Moon and I are agreeing with our new delegate, rest assured it’s a SNAFU. 🙂
    I really think the primary process needs to be reviewed or serious consideration be given to registering by party.

    1. @Laf,

      yes, for us to agree with our new delegate, something must be horribly wrong. I am not real happy to find out Cuccinelli is trying to change things midstream. Change it before or after but don’t change the laws of Virginia to accommodate someone.

      As for those not voting for Obama….I have heard that too. The answer is, who else do you have to vote for if that is your belief system? The election is a long way off. If I get disgusted with a candidate, I simply asky myself about the Supreme Court nominations….that settles me down real fast.

    2. @Laf, I was just thinking…one reason the county seems more secretive is because the organization is within the magisterial districts. The City isn’t by district or region. They are smaller. That makes it appear more open. The county, at least for the D’s, has committees for each magisterial district. I will have to say, I never saw any of our elected officials involved at any magisterial district meeting or at the monthly county meeting. It was like they operated outside that circle. Maybe it has changed. Quien sabe?

      Frankly, I couldn’t name you one person who sits on either the Democratic or Republican committee for Gainesville. I am assuming the R’s even have committees. I don’t know their organizational chart or pattern. No one seems to want to tell me either.

  13. Morris Davis

    Bay’at is an Arabic word meaning to take hands and it’s the term used to describe the al Qaeda loyalty oath.

  14. Steve Thomas

    @Lafayette
    “What a shame this is disenfranchising a person that always votes for the GOP candidate”

    I am not sure this constitutes “disenfanchisement”, as Mr. Laf is making a principled choice to not participate in the primary. Same goes for those angry that only two of the candiates qualified for the primary, and are chosing to forego voting, as their preferred candidiate will not be on the ballot. One thing few consider in their righteous anger and indignation: their preferred candidate may drop out of the race altogether, due to poor showing in the early primaries.

    True disenfranchisement would mean someone was denied an opportunity to vote. Mailing absentee ballots to serviceman late, without the opportunity for them to vote and return their ballots before the deadline…that’s disenfranchisement. Or, instituting a poll-tax, or literacy test as was common during the “Jim Crow” era (practices exercised by Democrats I might add)…that’s disenfranchisment. Members of the New Black Panther Party standing outside a polling station menacing white voters by swinging clubs and shouting racial epithets…that is disenfranchisement (oh, and who were these “responsible citizens”, clearly engaging in voter intimidation supporting? Obama) True disenfranchisement violates state and federal election law. While I don’t support the oath requirement for an open party primary, it is permitted under the party plan, and was determined to be lawful by the SBE.

    1. I would say that anything that makes a person feel uncomfortable going to the polls is disenfranchisement. The Black panthers standing around with billy clubs certainly would put me off. So would someone standing around with a camera or staring or acting like they were trying to grab up information. That dog over in Herndon (or is it Sterling) is a form a voter intimidation. The Panthers got a slap rather than being sent to the naughty corner for sure. That dog needs to be forbidden at the polling place.

      Voter intimidation doesn’t have to be obvious and in your face. It can be anything that makes a voter feel ill at ease. It is just harder to prove.

      I would feel disenfranchised if I went to vote, was asked to sign a pledge, I said no and was refused a ballot. I would not if I was asked, said no, and got to vote. I would say no regardless.

  15. Steve Thomas

    Moon-howler :Steve, I think you have made some excellent points. Why was an open primary chosen?
    I remember the days before we had presidential primaries. In fact, it wasn’t all that many years ago. It is a lot cheaper and a lot less risky just to have a caucus, convention or firehouse primary.
    Alcohol? That sounds plausible.

    Moon,
    I was not privy to the decision, as I am just a lowly local unit member, so I can only speculate. It could have been for any number of reasons. The argument most make in favor of a primary is that it gives more people an opportunity to vote. A state party convention isn’t cheap. You have to secure a venue large enough to accomodate the convention. There’s an expense for the delegates to travel to the convention, and depending on the distances they must travel, additional lodging and meals. The thing I like about conventions is a delegate is motivated. They make affirmative actions by becoming a delegate, traveling to the convention, participating in the convention, and sitting around in between events on the convention agenda. Since it does require a significant level of effort on the part of the party, and the delegate, their is a greater expectation that the nominees selected by convention were done so by the party faithful, or those who fully intend to vote “R” in the general. Plus a well done convention is downright fun. The candidates make a great effort to meet as many delegates as possible. They host parties, dinner’s and breakfasts in hopes of meeting undecided delegates.

    The open primary offers the opportunity for greater participation. Folks go to their regular polling place, cast their vote, and head off to work. This is the upside. The downside is anyone, even those who have absolutley no intention of supporting any candidate from this party in the general, can also vote. Also, folks may be voting for someone they have never had a chance to meet with, or meet with any representative of the campaign. It places most of the level of effort on the local party unit, as they have to ensure the polls are staffed, etc. Lastly, in some cases, a vulnerable incumbant is given an advantage in parimary. Someone who has angered the base of their party, can neutralize this by appealing to those outside the party to help them retain their seat. If candidate does not represent the principles of the party, and can’t survive a challenge form within the party, is not fit to represent the party in a general election, IMHO.

    So, to answer your question, I suspect RPV chose a primary, simply because it is a Federal election, and they want to make it as easy as possible for voters to participate, while preserving party funds for the general election. That said, I think requiring the loyalty oath is a mistake for this very same reason. I predict RPV will remove the requirement before the primary though.

    1. @Steve, Oh I have been to a couple of the state conventions and it didn’t turn out so great for me. Huge venue is needed. But the party absorbs the cost rather than the tax payers. (I think)

      The last one I went to is when I got stomped on and thrown down. It was only one lone wolf and certainly doesn’t represent the entire party but I have some permanent injuries from that close encounter. But that one lone wolf took his toll on my wrists and ankles. He also stomped my camera. 20 years ago I was madder over the camera. Today, wrists win hands down.

  16. Steve Thomas

    @Moon-howler
    “Please don’t act like it is a one sided thing that just Democrats do. I know better.”

    I don’t. I know quite it happened to the Dems in 2004. It doesn’t take any organizing only a decision on the part of the voter. A bunch of “lone wolves” can make a big difference in a close primary. It will happen in this primary. It happens to the party who is challenging the incumbent, and it happens more than you would think. I have had access to voter-vault. It pulls information available to the parties, and to candiates, does some nifty correlation, and spits out some very interesting and useful reports. It is intended to help candidates determine where to spend their time and money for maximum GOTV. With such a report, I can tell who votes regularly in my party’s primaries, which is an indication of whether someone is a hard “R”, soft “R” Independent/Swing voter, Soft “D”, Hard “D”. With such a list, I can also correlate this against candidate finance reports, and PAP info, to see how someone “votes with their checkbook” So, if someone votes D, D, D, D, D, D, in a primaries, and donates only to Democrats, then all of a sudden shows up and votes in a GOP primary, wouldn’t their motives be suspect? I like conventions because of the pre-filing requirement. It gives the party the opportunity to cross check the names, to ensure they are qualified voters, and just as important, not there to cause mischief. Although rarely excericised convention rules provide for challenges. A member of the convention can challenge another delegates eligibility, if there is strong evidence that the delegate being challenged has done noting but support candidates of the opposing party. This is where the oath comes in. This is one of the main reason I oppose the oath for a primary on practical grounds. It is a toothless guard dog. It’s a growl with no bite. It only tells you how much outside influence has occurred, but does nothing to prevent it. There is a place for the oath. This ain’t it.

    1. Someone here admitted to doing it. I was witness to a gang of R’s at that convention I mentioned earlier who were plotting to go vote at the D primary for Chuck Robb because they knew Ollie North could beat him. I smiled to myself and thought they might be betting on the wrong horse.

      The problem with doing that if you are a cross over for nefarious reasons is you aren’t thinking like the other party. You are thinking like yourself and that oten isn’t how things really are. Chuck Robb, as you know, narrowly defeated Ollie North and held another

      On the other hand, it seems reasonable to think that those who aren’t party members should have a say in who their elected candidates are. I often vote in Republican primaries. I don’t do it to cause a problem but to select a person I would want to represent me. The last time I did that was in August. If we follow the line that I am not one of the party faithful, does that mean I shouldn’t participate in a Frank Wolf or Jackson Miller town meeting? As long as we don’t have to register by party, I don’t feel sleazy at all. I also don’t feel sleazy if I choose to vote for a member of either party. After all, whoever is elected represents all the people, not just the members of their own party.

  17. Elena

    Steve,
    In a country where so few vote, I guess I don’t imagine that influence on either side to be that meaningful. I feel the exact same about voter fraud. I agree with your final point regarding the pledge anyway. If someone is intends to vote for nefarious reasons, a pledge does nothing. People will behave like jerks and a piece of paper certainly will have no meaning.

    I am quite troubled that my vote is public information that anyone can view. THAT is very disturbing to me. Since when did voting records become available to anyone?!

  18. Censored bybvbl

    @Elena

    I think that only the fact that you’ve voted is public info, not how you voted.

    1. @Censored

      If you vote in a primary where both democrats and republicans elections are being held, does it designate which one you voted in? In other words, 2008?

  19. I admitted to voting for Sharpton in the Democrat Primary, but did so knowing that it would have absolutely no effect. I mean, really? Al Sharpton? Of course, he got an amazing 3% of the vote…so that means I was actually a major part of that!

    But crossover voting does happen to affect primaries. Rush Limbaugh’s Operation Chaos to keep Hillary Clinton in the race longer probably succeeded. And the selection of McCain was probably influenced by huge numbers of moderates and independents voting in open primaries.

    I say to heck with it ALL! Bring back the MONARCHY!

  20. Censored bybvbl

    I’ll have to ask my walking partner tomorrow. Dh hasn’t experienced primaries for both parties on the same day. Representatives from both parties can be/are present when voters check in and give their names and addresses so if a person is a party member that could be cross-checked with a name and address. The actual vote wouldn’t be disclosed.

    Since the choices are on the computer, I would guess that a voter would just make one choice and that vote would go to a Republican or a Democratic candidate.

  21. Steve Thomas

    Elena :
    Steve,
    In a country where so few vote, I guess I don’t imagine that influence on either side to be that meaningful. I feel the exact same about voter fraud. I agree with your final point regarding the pledge anyway. If someone is intends to vote for nefarious reasons, a pledge does nothing. People will behave like jerks and a piece of paper certainly will have no meaning.
    I am quite troubled that my vote is public information that anyone can view. THAT is very disturbing to me. Since when did voting records become available to anyone?!

    Elena,
    The fact that you voted in an election is public, not the way you actually voted. Same goes for conventions and the other methods of nomination. How long this have been going on, I don’t know, but it’s been going on for many years.

  22. Elena

    Here is my problem with the concern over nefarious voting by democrats in this county.

    I have voted in two republican primaries, NOT for any other reason but to ensure that the general election had to good candidates to choose from. both time, unfortunately my candidate lost, most recently Martha Hendley.

  23. Elena

    two candiates NOT to

  24. Elena

    I am also wondering which presidential candidate would be the one to “throw off” the race in the eyes of Republicans? Romney? Paul? Santorum? etc etc.

    I imagine depending on who you speak with, there is no one candidate that is the best or the worst so I am not even sure how the “scheming” Demoracts could throw off the race anyway.

  25. Censored bybvbl

    @Moon-howler

    My walking partner says that you would request the ballot for either the Dems or Repubs and the machine would bring that party’s candidates up. Otherwise you could cross over if there was more than one position for election (Prez and US Senate or PWCB, for example). You have the choice of one party and get that party’s ballot.

  26. Steve Thomas

    Censored bybvbl :@Moon-howler
    My walking partner says that you would request the ballot for either the Dems or Repubs and the machine would bring that party’s candidates up. Otherwise you could cross over if there was more than one position for election (Prez and US Senate or PWCB, for example). You have the choice of one party and get that party’s ballot.

    Except in this case, there is only one presidential primary, the GOP, on Super Tuesday. There is another primary in June, for Senate. You will have to declare which parties primary you wish to vote in, as they will be on the same day.

    1. I think this is my fault, Steve. I asked a generic questiion and now can’t remember what it was.

      Can you vote absentee or curbside in a primary? If yes, and it is a 2 party primary, how do you get the right ballot?

  27. Steve Thomas

    Elena :I am also wondering which presidential candidate would be the one to “throw off” the race in the eyes of Republicans? Romney? Paul? Santorum? etc etc.
    I imagine depending on who you speak with, there is no one candidate that is the best or the worst so I am not even sure how the “scheming” Demoracts could throw off the race anyway.

    @Elena

    Considering there will be two, and only two choices on the ballot, you would be attempting to throw off the one you are voting against. Condsidering this two candidates represent opposite ends of the spectrum, and are the most viable contenders to date (in that their support has remained relatively constant thus far, I am not sure how big of an impact michief voting would have. One couldn’t vote for Huntsman, or Bachman, or a percieved weak candidate (which would make the best opponent for Obama), as Romney and Paul will be the only choices. IMHO, either one of these candidates could potentially defeat Obama. Fast & Furious, the fallout from Solyndra et, al, the continued anemic economy, Iran, etc. etc. means the goodship Obama is sailing into a hurricane westwind, but this is fodder for another thread. I am predicting that the RPV will be pressured by electeds, and local units to repeal the oath requirment.

    1. @Steve, sticking my nose in….I am not sure there really is a mischief candidate now. Everyone but Huntsman has had his or her day in the sun. Huntsman probably really is the candidate that would give Obama the best run for his money.

      The people who are in an uproar over fast and furious and Solyndra wouldn’t have voted for Obama in the first place. Unfortunately for the Republican candidate, should he win (assuming Bachmann isn’t going to be it.) that person will run in to the same situation. I still am waiting for those jobs promised us by the freshman class elected in 2010. I think they sound out that it is easier said than done during a recession.

      I think Romney could be elected. I don’t see anyone else even coming close. A good indicator is the money being poured in to that campaign when new upstarts seem to challenge his position. In the end, I think the establishment will win. Who they want will run. The other people other than perhaps Newt and Huntsman are far too esoteric for a general election. They don’t seem to have appeal to the masses. Remember that 30-40% who are out there and who can go either way. Nothing too extreme will get the moderate vote.

      Just my opinion formed by sitting back and watching over the years. This cycle seems the strangest I have seen yet. Perhaps there really is no previous model.

  28. Steve Thomas

    @Moon-howler

    “I think the establishment will win.”

    I dslike the term “establishment”. Perhaps “mainstream Republican” is a better descriptor, in that the candidate who secures the support of the majority of Republican and republican-affiliated voters, represents the mainstream.

    Unfortunately for Huntsman, he does not appeal to the mainstream of Republican voters, as polls would indicate. In order to face the President, he must get over this hurdle, first. He will not.

    1. @Steve, I like mainstream Republican better also. Far better. I was just trying to fit in. LOL. With your permission, I will say mainstream.

  29. Steve Thomas

    @Moon-howler
    “Can you vote absentee or curbside in a primary? If yes, and it is a 2 party primary, how do you get the right ballot?”

    Yes on both. You must request the ballot for the primary in which you intend to vote, or go vote at the registrars office, if intending to vote “early by absentee”. Also, if you’d like to vote curbside, an election official will come out to the car, and either ask you which primary you will vote in, and return with the correct ballot, or will bring out both ballots and ask you which ballot you would like.

  30. Steve Thomas

    “Just my opinion formed by sitting back and watching over the years. This cycle seems the strangest I have seen yet. Perhaps there really is no previous model.”

    I agree. 100%. Too many new factors to make comparisons to previous primaries. Use of the internet and social media for messaging and fundraising is a big one. Can’t really look to 2007, as that primary quickly turned into a Clinton v. Obama race.

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