Apparently George Zimmerman chose to tour a gun factory in Florida recently. The Joe Scarboro team on Morning Joe had a lot to say about the trip:
Yahoo News:
According to the TMZ story, Zimmerman got a personal tour of the Cocoa, Fla., facility from the son of Kel-Tec’s founder and owner. The story includes a picture of Zimmerman and a man wearing a Kel-Tec shirt. TMZ says it was taken on the assembly plant floor. The entertainment website reported that Zimmerman inquired about purchasing a tactical shotgun; however Kel-Tec’s website says the company doesn’t sell firearms directly to the public.
Late Friday afternoon, Kel-Tec sent Yahoo News a statement “concerning this leaked bit of information by someone unassociated with Kel-Tec.”
“He simply wanted to see the manufacturing facility,” the statement said of Zimmerman’s visit. “This is a common occurrence with our customer base that live close by or may be traveling through.”
The statement implied that Zimmerman specifically inquired about a tactical shotgun he is apparently interested in purchasing.
“The Kel-Tec KSG is one of the most desired products in the industry, and can be very difficult to acquire due to supply and demand,” the company said. “Many individuals like to come by the plant to actually see the product and how it is used.
Obviously George Zimmerman is simply a person who lacks the wisdom to exercise good judgement. Why on earth would he tour a facility like this publicly and allow that picture to be taken? Zimmerman needs to thank his lucky stars or his God for the fact that he is a free man. He then needs to go to some area where he can blend in and lead a quite, low-key life, free of stupid judgement calls. His very life might depend on it after this stunt.
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TEXT of Morning Joe segment
How disgusting! Here is the what I know. This moron goes walking around armed because he has to prove his genitals aren’t tiny. He ends up KILLING a kid walking back from 7-11 armed with skittles and an iced tea. PERIOD. Had this POS not found the need to chase after Trayvon, for NO reason, other than he looked like a kid who had been arrested, then he would be alive.
So, if my daughter is walking home from the store, someone follows her, a stranger in a truck, she should just ask very nicely why he is following her. Hell no! She should take out her pepper spray once he exits his vehicle, use her pepper spray, and then kick his ass because by then she is a black belt in Tai Kwon do. Oh wait, no, in some people’s mind on this blog, she shot be murdered in cold blood because she is now the aggressor.
Zimmerman shows NO remorse and clearly is giving the big ole middle finger to the Trayvon family. What a DB.
The best advise you could give someone, especially a female, when being followed by a man they don’t know is to either get home as fast as you can or knock on a neighbors door and ask for help.
Looking for a confrontation is the LAST thing that should be done. It only makes a bad situation worse for both parties.
Obviously Peterson, but for the sake of this discussion, if you some stranger approaches you, on your way home as quickly as you can, you don’t wait to ask their intention, especially as a woman.
I do agree though, Zimmerman was looking for a confrontation and it ended up with tragic results. He should have allowed the police to do their job and he should have stayed in his vehicle.
“Now…one more time…this subject is closed. It has been discussed on this blog for going on a year now. I find it very disturbing. The boy is dead and not here to defend himself. His parents are living.”
I thought that the topic was closed.
“She should take out her pepper spray once he exits his vehicle, use her pepper spray, and then kick his ass because by then she is a black belt in Tai Kwon do.”
If she does that to a person that is getting out of a truck and has not attacked her, she WILL be considered the aggressor under the law.
He toured the factory because he saved his life using one of their products. He did nothing wrong.
What he did that has come in to question was pose like a hero. I have no problem with him touring a factory of any sort. I have a problem with him turning it into a publicity tour. What was he thinking?
He did nothing wrong? Jesus. Why not just get in the face of America and gloat?
The topic of Zimmerman’s behavior the night Martin was killed is what is closed. We weren’t there. None of us, including you. His post trial behavior has been brought into question. z
This is a new topic. How very unwise Zimmerman is being post trial, just to clarify.
I guess those people who have turned him into a cult hero have breathed a little life into his ego. It will be his own undoing.
I remember those who turned Lt. Calley into a hero also.
I’m not gloating. He was not guilty of a any crime because the shooting was self defense. He had a picture taken with an employee.
Elena is discussing Zimmerman’s actions that night. Thus, I asked if it was closed.
How is Zimmerman being unwise? He saved people from a burning vehicle. Got stopped for speeding. And toured a gun manufacturer.
I don’t see him as a hero except for his actions involving the burning car. He’s not a hero for merely defending himself.
He was gloating. I am glad he isn’t your hero.
No, he is not guilty of a crime. Probably Bob McDonnell isn’t either. It’s all in how the laws are written.
Does that mean he had correct behavior? I surely don’t think so and the majority of Americans don’t think so either. Is it smart when you are acquitted of a crime that carries a prison sentence of minimum ten years to do what he did? Probably not.
I don’t see any remorse. Perhaps I am missing something.
He doesn’t even look like the same person we saw 2 months ago.
The real smart folks in all of this might very well be the Prince William County police department. They didn’t want him for a cop. Perhaps it was a little more than that credit history. Perhaps it was that someone in recruitment smelled a rat.
Like I said, I hope this never happens to any of our children, toh end up dead for simply trying to walk home. Had he not been armed, this never wou have I cannot imagine the pain Trayvon Martins family must experience everyday and this little publicity stunt must be like salt in an open wound. George must be very proud of himself indeed.
@Elena
Elena,
Martin wasn’t shot for walking home. He was witnessed…. a prosecution witness…. straddling and beating Zimmerman. If Martin was defending himself is some way…straddling and beating someone is NOT considered self defense. No one is allowed to strike someone for following them, being a “creepy ass cracka,” or being a possible gay rapist, as Rachael Jeantel suggested.
Were bad decisions made? Absolutely. But the worst one was the decision commit assault and battery. THAT is the key event. Everything prior to that..personal histories, actions, etc…. is not relevant.
If my daughter is ever followed by someone and she is on the phone with a friend and is able to run home like Martin was able to…..I’d want her to hang up on that friend and call 911. Or me. And when she gets to the house, to GO INSIDE. NOT return and confront someone that she broke contact with 400 feet away.
Your daughter is a girl. Girls go by a whole set of different safety rules.
Martin was shot walking home. We don’t live in a communist state that outlines that you have to go from point A to point B. He can hang around outside and talk on the phone, listen to music or whatever he wants to do. He was stalked.
You and I just have a different moral code. I happen to like mine better.
Let me say this. My husband or son at age 17 might very well have turned on some dude following them and beaten the B-jesus out of them. We don’t know what happened. I don’t know and you don’t know.
however, getting the crap beaten out of you in one of the chances you take when you follow people when it isn’t your job to follow them.
And anyone stupid enough to be a volunteer neighborhood watch person and walk around armed sort of gets what’s coming to them including a million dollars worth of legal fees.
Actually, you have no right to go making the kid out to be a street thug. There is no arrest record to suggest that he was a thug. Just as a heads up, adolescent males of all races often bullshit each other and talk smack to their friends. Its a rite of passage. I have seen it thousands of times.
You can make as many excuses that you want for George Zimmerman. He chose to not follow the suggestion to stay in his truck. If he had followed the dispathcher’s suggestion, none of this would have happened.
But for all his recent bravado, he made a life-changing decision that night and I’ll bet that it’s one that will haunt him all his life.
This is an emotional issue for all sides. That is clear. Whether he was guilty or not, I don’t know. That jury on that day found there was not enough evidence to convict. That part of the tragedy is over. His trip to a gun manufacturer or shop or whatever, is an affront to Martin’s parents, to the black community, to his community, to those other American victims of senseless gun violence and to legitimate gun owners who believe that the use of a gun for self protection is a last resort..
@Censored bybvbl
For one thing…he was NOT told to stay in his truck. He got out of the truck because dispatch asked where was Martin. Z replied…”he’s running.” and got out of his truck. Then, dispatch asked if Z was following him and told him that they didn’t need him to do that.
Z lost contact with Martin at that time. Martin was GONE. Z stayed at the top of the T intersection. Martin was “in back of his father’s place” 400 feet away, per a prosecution witness, while Z talked on the phone with the cops for 3 minutes.
So…. you can “what if” all that you want…. If Zimmerman hadn’t run an errand….if Martin hadn’t gotten sent to his father’s place….. any picking of an event except the one that resulted in the shooting is pure cherry picking.
@Moon-howler
Martin was not talking smack when he was assaulting Zimmerman. He was not talking smack when he tried to buy a gun. Nor when he was found with stolen property. Or when he assaulted a bus driver.
Yes, Martin had every right to be there. He did not have the right to assault anyone.
Zimmerman made a mistake in getting out of his truck…but he did not compound it by wandering in the dark looking for someone that had disappeared. Zimmerman was not “on watch.” He was running an errand to the store when this all occurred. And following is not illegal. Neither is acting as a neighborhood watch. And he did what neighborhood watches do…he reported someone that he deemed suspicious.
@BSinVA
An affront to the black community? You mean the same black community that threatened him, his family, people with his name, people with with similar phone numbers, and attacked random white people while shouting “this is for Trayvon?” I mean, if you’re going to generalize about a community, I guess I will too. A visit to a company is an affront? He is a legitimate gun owner that used his gun for self protection as a last resort.
How about if he just commits suicide? Will that suffice to satisfy those that wanted to lynch him?
Where is the proof and documentation? What blog did that all come off of? No legitimate documentation then it doesn’t exist.
Its just all pure bullshit, justification for some really bad gun laws.
Yea, I know the smack being discussed on the blogs.
Thank you for your eye witness account. Yes, my sarcasm button was on.
Frankly, I think you really need to rethink what you just said about the “black community.” Funny how a few individuals just became the entire black community that BS was speaking of.
Feel free to discuss the stupidity of publically going to a gun factory but as I asked before, let’s leave that which has not been proven or documented off this blog.
Look. This discussion is getting a bit off the rails. About being followed. Makes no difference if you are male or female. I don’t care if you think you have the biggest cajones in the neighborhood. Peterson is spot on. You do not confront a surveillant. You are walking in ignorance. You do not know who the surveillant is. You do not know his purpose. You do not know if he is armed. You do not know how willing and ready he is to use that weapon. Secondly, you do not know if the surveillant is alone. Surveillance can be done solo or in teams. You turn around and try to deck the surveillant in some kind of James Bond bravado, and somebody not seen before could come out of the shadows and split your skull. (People not versed in countersurveillance seldom pick up on this or even think about it.) You do one thing: head for the nearest safehaven and seek help. Home, neighbor, store, business, restaurant, police post, firehouse, whatever. Putting aside all the speculation about what Zimmerman should or should not have done and all the hubbub about race, Trayvon Martin, in his fit of pique, made a bad decision to confront. It was a fatal decision. It should teach us all an important lesson.
Funny that you pick out the one who is dead to blame for the bad decision. Zimmerman is damn lucky his tail isn’t in jail for 20 years. He might not have been so lucky in Virginia.
You failed to mention the stalker who turned sissy when he got confronted. Don’t you think he made a bad decision?
Most of us don’t go around thinking espionage. Obviously you haven’t dealt with a lot of teen age boys. whether its smart or dumb, most of them will confront, not seek shelter. That’s sort of how they earn their stripes. It’s a wonder any of them survive to adulthood.
Strange that no one has mentioned anyone using their cell phone. Call the cops and take a picture.
If I were trying to inform, I would probably not use words like ‘surveillent.’
Had Zimmerman not stalked this kid, Trayvon Martin would be alive. Period. End of story. It isn’t a crime to be black, young, and skinny. It isn’t a crime to be the same race as someone who commits a crime in your neighborhood.
Jesu maria. Maybe it is best to stop. Should have kept to my original inclination and not tried to discuss the realities of crime and street ops with bloggers.
Street ops?
yea, the rest of us are rubes and no absolutely nothing about anything.
Yup. About this business anyway. You all watch too much TV and too many movies.
I must admit that I did get one big guffaw out of this thread. The daughter with pepper spray and the ass-kicking future black belt in Tae Kwon Do. Brings to mind that incident in San Francisco not too long ago. Big martial arts personality, well known local fighter and trainer, more “belts” than I have trousers. Accosted on the street by armed muggers. He tried to end the mugging by making like a movie ninja. The muggers shot him dead where he stood.
Bottom line, Zimmerman showed a lack of judgement the night he encountered Martin and the day he went to this factory.
I agree completely with Scarborough, he is not a hero. Based on the reaction from his attorney, I’d say they did their job but might not have liked it. That’s telling.
http://articles.washingtonpost.com/2013-07-15/opinions/40581519_1_trayvon-martin-george-zimmerman-martin-s
Had Trayvon Martin been a white youth – and Zimmerman been a black male – he would have been arrested on the spot, and probably found guilty.
Who threw the first punch? We will never know. Morally, Zimmerman is guilty of murdering this kid – even though he was found not guilty. If Zimmerman were smart, he would keep a low profile – the fact that he is not just shows that he does not feel he did anything wrong.
Zimmerman wasn’t “looking for confrontation”. He had called police. Clearly his goal was for the police to be able to question Martin.
He’s probably being confrontational now, though. Or, arguably, asserting his rights after being persecuted.
I’m tired of arguing about the case. Suppose I stipulate to every angry/irrational black person and pompous/irrational white liberal that Zimmerman killed the kid and got away with it, because he was … well because he has a white last name. Now, the question I think is more interesting is – why is it so important to so many people to take one isolated case from one locality and try to use it to prove general assertions about victimhood?
Apparently it is important to white male conservatives to paint Trayvon Martin as a perpetrator. I didn’t bring the subject up. In fact, I asked that it stop. I was ignored.
So I posted the next dumb thing the fool did. The bottom line is, Zimmerman has no remorse, is not very smart, and couldn’t pass muster to get into the Prince William County police. Perhaps he shouldn’t have been out pretending to be Billy Bad-ass.
There is clearly this YAWNING HUNGER in America to prove that black people are victims. I don’t understand it, because it clearly leads nowhere good. We implemented a welfare system in the 60’s to help people out of poverty – it’s been somewhat counter-productive. We implemented affirmative action and school busing, for better or worse. We forcibly integrated institutions and workplaces. THERE AIN’T A LOT MORE TO BE DONE.
that yawning hunger must be with people you know, Rick. I know no one who wants to prove black people are victims.
I think people just naturally think someone is a victim when they are unarmed and shot through the heart. I don’t think the race matters.
The appetite for black-as-victim stories is enormous. I’ve seen CNN report as news incidents in the last few years such as someone (presumably some kid) grabbing the public mic in a K-Mart store and saying the n-word, and … I’ve blocked the rest out of my mind, but i see them all the time. I’m waiting for a blistering expose about the rampant racism, homophobia, and sexism to be found scrawled in public toilet stalls.
If anyone is really getting killed because of race, it’s Hispanic men I think. You hear a story every so often about a Hispanic man being beaten to death by some racially motivated killer. But that’s not a big story, because the American media is set up currently to profiteer off black-white conflict. In this post-OJ world, it’s no secret that black-white conflict is good business.
People get killed all the time over their race. Whites, blacks, Hispanics, Asians. Just being in the wrong part of town at the wrong time can do it. However, most cases go unreported. Sometimes people get killed over class. Sometimes they get killed randomly.
If I open my door right now, see a black person, and yell the n-word at them, is that really a news story? is it really cause for all of America to reflect? Or is it an isolated action that says something about me.
@Moon-howler
What blogs……THIS WAS FROM THE TRIAL.
This what? Street fighting, drugs, and theft? That all came out in the trial? How on earth did I miss it?
@Moon-howler
What blogs?……This is from trial testimony and discovery.
As for using the term “black community” read my entire statement about generalization. If you listen to the news, its the “black community” that is aggreived and wants justice. Any kind of justice. The race hustlers like Sharpton are inciting the community.
But…okay….to make you happy…. numerous, uncountable incidences of threats to those I mentioned have come from hundreds, if not thousands, of members of the black community. There…now its not a “generalization.” Of course, I will call others out for ANY incidences of the same that I see.
@Moon-howler
“You failed to mention the stalker who turned sissy when he got confronted.”
I thought that you didn’t want to talk about things not documented. Sounds a little judgmental. And why “sissy?” Are you saying that he should have just let someone beat him and taken it “like a man?”
“Strange that no one has mentioned anyone using their cell phone. Call the cops and take a picture.”
I mentioned using the phone. TM was ON THE PHONE. He could have called 911.
@Pat.Herve
That is pure speculation. Moon doesn’t want any of that.
About the sissy remark. Why didn’t he use his fists? Isn’t that usually how things are done?
He should have let Martin beat him. Out of white guilt. Anything less is unmanly.
You are sort of hung up on white guilt, aren’t you?
Do you have it?
‘
Funny, I have never felt white guilt. My ancestors on my mother’s side were even slave owners. I never felt guilty. Why? I didn’t own slaves. I also don’t feel guilty over the American Indian. Why? I never killed Indians or took their land from them.
I can’t feel guilty over things I didn’t do or have any control over.
For that matter, Martin’s dad looked like kind of a wimp, on the verge of tears and all.
And if you ask me, I think some of the lawyers acted like f*ggots. I’m just sayin’.
None that needs to be said as a matter of fact.
You are being incredibly obnoxious.
@Moon-howler
I have no clue how you missed it. The defense brought it up and it was dis-allowed as irrelevant.
The mj was brought up and not allowed. I never heard anything about a police record that involved theft and street fighting. I am guess it is because there is no police record.
@Moon-howler
No…actually not. That’s only in the movies. People die everyday from being beaten. From even one punch. Fighting is for children.
But…lets go with that. Would it have been ok with you then, if Zimmerman HAD been able to defend himself with a punch and killed his attacker with that? Or put him into a choke to make him stop attacking him and Martin dies by that? Its very easy to kill someone in a choke. MMA fighters have to learn how NOT to kill someone the ring in the heat of battle.
If someone attacks me, I will use any means possible to stop that threat.
I doubt if we would have heard about it. Perhaps he wouldn’t have been left in the morgue for three days.
I don’t go the the movies very often. I have raised sons though and my husband is part Irish. They knew how to fight with their fists. If someone comes at you with fists, you return the favor.
The bottom line is neighborhood watch is not supposed to be armed. Carrying a gun doesn’t make you tough. He obviously panicked. Maybe a few more fights in his youth would have toughened him up
“You are sort of hung up on white guilt, aren’t you? Do you have it?”
No. I feel as you stated above. I don’t use that phrase much. I don’t believe I benefitted from “white privilege” either for that matter, I think that phrase is overused. My ancestors came here in boats 150 yaers ago, dirt poor, and scrapped to feed their families. My inheritance is nothing, I got through college oin loans and scholorships, and I’m quite sure that the opportunities I did get in life would have been open to me regardless of ethnicity.
I suppose I did profit from white priviledge. My parents were both educated. My mother attended schools that didn’t allow blacks. My father attended a university where there were no black people. I didn’t attend any schools with black children until college. I don’t feel guilty over it because it was all beyond my control. However, I do acknowledge that I had opportunities many blacks didn’t have.
Regardless of all justification, whites were the priviledge class when I was coming along.
My children, not so much though. I would say the playing field was more level.
The southern relatives were slave holders….not large numbers but does it matter how many? I had nothing to do with that either. Post Civil War, I would say my people struggled to be middle class. They still had it better than 99% of the blacks.
@Moon-howler
You are absolutely right. Neighborhood watch on patrol does not go armed.
He wasn’t on “watch.” He was on an errand.
So he had no damned business stalking a kid, especially while armed. You really can’t have it both ways.
No… he had no business stalking a kid, which he didn’t do.
He did have business contacting the police on a suspicious person of an unknown age.
From his car….and staying in his car and out of the way.
Cargo, you aren’t going to convince me Zimmerman is one of the good guys. In fact, I have evolved a great deal since someone (SA) unfortunately brought this topic up where it didn’t belong. I think Zimmerman has gone from being just unwise to being a real dumb-ass.
yes, he followed the kid. That has been establish. He is a real hero of yours, obviously.
@Moon-howler
When did he follow him on foot? He did follow him in his car…which you don’t seem to mind.
He got out of his car. He STAYED near it at the top of the T side walk. Martin was gone. Z talked on the phone. Martin talked on the phone near his father’s place….400 feet away.
Martin returned.
But….. I guess you’re right. Zimmerman was a real dumbass getting involved in trying to protect his neighborhood. I guess citizens should just stay out of it. See something….don’t bother calling the cops. Mind your own business.
Getting assaulted….. mind your own business. Let the guy beat on you. Otherwise you might be a racist or a vigilante or …something.
I guess self defense isn’t a “good thing.” Zimmerman’s detractors will slant the story and lie from now on anyway. Trying to interject accuracy doesn’t work.
Oh..and you keep on trying to say that he’s my hero or something, in the face of repeated statements that he’s not and that I don’t personally care.
But…if it makes you feel better to add to my supposed motivations…or my “feelings”…. by making that up…. I can’t stop you. Go ahead.
I just like accuracy in the telling of an event without the loaded legal terms like stalking, murdering a boy for walking, etc.
Its obvious that you don’t like Zimmerman because he defended himself with a gun. Fair enough. I can’t help that you feel self defense wasn’t warranted against assault and battery.
“But….. I guess you’re right. Zimmerman was a real dumbass getting involved in trying to protect his neighborhood.”
The mistake that he made was in following a black male. It was a politically incorrect action. Particularly when Zimmerman has a white last name.
Oh puh-LEEEZ. I have never heard such self-pitying nonsense.
Now we have Zimmerman as the victim.
I am going to put Zimmerman as a trigger word. I simply cannot stand it.
I’m serious, Moon. If he’d followed a white kid that he wanted followed and there was evidence the kid attacked him in an arguably life-threatening way, no story here and probably no trial.
And if Zimmerman’s last name was Hernandez, do you really believe we’d have ever heard about the story?
Only because white people don’t really have a ‘community’ like minorities do.
They should be outraged regardless of who that happened to. White, hispanic, asian, black, it doesn’t matter.
I just don’t think kids armed with skittles and ice tea should be cannon fodder. their race is irrelevant.
Do you not see uow your rhetoric is out of touch with reality? “Cannon fodder”?
I think you’re a bit hung up on skittles and iced tea, also.