Many past governors have avoided this topic. Governor McDonnell has issued a proclamation that April is Confederate History Month in Virginia. Here is the proclamation that is posted on the Governor’s website:
“It is important for all Virginians to reflect upon our commonwealth’s shared history, to understand the sacrifices of the Confederate leaders, soldiers and citizens during the period of the Civil War, and to recognize how our history has led to our present.“
The action states that “this defining chapter in Virginia’s history should not be forgotten, but instead should be studied, understood and remembered by all Virginians, both in the context of the time in which it took place, but also in the context of the time in which we live, and this study and remembrance takes on particular importance as the commonwealth prepares to welcome the nation and the world to visit Virginia for the Sesquicentennial Anniversary of the Civil War, a four-year period in which the exploration of our history can benefit all.“
McDonnell’s proclamation heralds an upcoming anniversary April 17, 1861 which is the anniversary date that Virginia seceded from the union. McDonnell has issued about a dozen proclamations since taking office.
Perhaps it would have been more sensitive in 2010 for Governor McDonnell to have proclaimed April to be Civil War History month. Many young men lie buried here in Virginia who fought for the Union. 150 years later seems a long enough time to have divisive issues like north and south as part of our current dialogue.
Before anyone races over for the attack, let me state that I am currently looking at my picture of Robert E. Lee in my living room. I have had 2 dogs named for Stonewall Jackson, and my great-great grandfather was a Confederate soldier. Those are personal things that affect my family. I am free to honor our past heroes in any way I choose, from placing their likeness on my desk to naming my dogs after them. That isn’t the point. The point is, this is 2010 in Virginia. Sure, Virginia seceded and was a Confederate state. But, they had to fight someone didn’t they? One cannot study Confederate History without studying Civil War history.
The Civil War is still, even after 150 years, a very contentious subject. People are sensitive. The governor needs to be inclusive if he is going to tackle this subject for the sake of history. If there are other points to be made, perhaps they shouldn’t be and he should be more careful of the advice he is receiving.
UPDATE: The governor has issued an apology for an omission that mentions slavery. New Proclamation link
“Perhaps it would have been more sensitive in 2010 for Governor McDonnell to have proclaimed April to be Civil War History month.”
I agree.
I would have also liked to see him put this in a way that makes sense to those of us who aren’t native born Virginians. How does this merging of the blue and gray reflect contemporary Virginia?
MH, your comments are very neutral. Very well written.
McDonnell’s words are also very nicely written. A study of history has to be done looking at the good and the bad and with the effort of trying not to repeat the mistakes of our past. Our present is trying to figure out what was a mistake and moving forward.
I’ve found in my lifetime that most Americans have a great capacity to “get over it” when it comes to something like past warfare, even a civil war. Born and bred a Yank but having lived for over 40 years in Virginia, I find myself giving less and less thought beyond history for the sake of history to the bitterness and carnage of the Civil War but, rather, focusing on the remarkable courage and fortitude of so many who fought for starkly different causes. I would hope that this is the focus of this declaration.
I kind of like Moon’s way of celebrating that aspect of her Southern heritage. In fact, I’ve always admired that in Southerners. I cannot remember ever seeing a portrait of U.S. Grant hanging in the living room of a Northerner of our time. I look at Stonewall Jackson not as a man who wrapped himself in a cause with which I could never agree but, rather, as a man who was an absolute genius at his military craft. The same goes for Lee. To study how he played his hand in a situation where he lacked many of the aces is to marvel at his capacity and strength in adversity. Back in the day, Col. Mosby was considered by Northerners as a partisan bushwhacker and murderer who practiced a dishonorable form of warfare. But, with the passage of time, you start to see him for his absolutely astounding loyalty and audacity and his ability to strike and disappear like the wind.
When you put aside the causes for the Civil War and the bitterness which divided us even after the close of that war, you can begin to consider that many men on both sides were Americans who displayed each in his own way a tremendous genius born of an almost unique American heritage. When I look at Lee, I can also see Washington saving his rag-tag army by retreating across New Jersey. When I look at Mosby, I can see Francis Marion, the “Swamp Fox”, frustrating Banastre Carleton in the swamps of South Carolina. When I look at Jackson, I can see Daniel Morgan cleverly calculating how to beat the British at Cowpens. And I am a Yank!!!
How an African-American looks at all this I naturally expect to be different. For them the whole thing was a desperate war for liberation with an incomplete ending and 150 years of having to consolidate what should have been won back then. But I do think that it is well for all to focus now on the individual heroes on both sides of an agonizing national experience. I am far from being a lover of Hollywood. But one of the few times I actually wanted to pat Hollywood on the back when was I first experienced the movie “Glory.” Certainly much in the movie was poetic license as usual; but, if I were an African-American, the last battle scene in that film would be imprinted with immense pride on my memory for as long as I lived.
That film caused me to add a study of the African-American role in the fighting along the Missouri-Kansas border to go along with the genealogy of Mrs. W’s family. My eyes were opened wide by something I had never known before. Free Blacks and freed slaves from Kansas did not let someone else fight for their freedom. Many joined the Union forces and fought very hard, despite the fact that capture could mean being resold into slavery at best and instant execution at the worst. You talk about the dire dilemma of an individual soldier. You were the only one on the battlefield who would never have the option, if captured, of spending the rest of the war in a POW camp. I call that courage beyond courage. I think that is one of the reasons why I prefer to leave the causes of the conflict to the judgement of historians and focus my own thoughts on the individuals who fought and suffered through it.
I look today at news photos of our troops in the field in Afghanistan, seeing such an absolute mixture of races and colors that it still amazes me that a country which went through such a bitter internal conflict and post-conflict period of social trauma survived to the point where we can field a military that has within it a mixture of the individual courage from all sides of that long-ago war which is the subject of the Governor’s declaration.
Wolverine, WOW. That’s some perspective you’ve put out there. Thanks.
I think I’m still trying to come to terms with a nation killing itself and the naivete of young men signing up for a war they thought would be over in an afternoon, a day or aweek. I’m trying to understand how it all got so out of control.
Causes can be confusing. One man’s Freedom Fighter is another man’s Terrorist. One thing for sure, though–suffering is suffering no matter who is doing it.
Definitely an interesting perspective, Wolverine.
Another perspective that is often not mentioned is how little the average man in the trenches cared about causes. Many of the northern soldiers were immigrants. Often they cared more for the concept on ‘union’ than the non-immigrants. Often blacks were as scared of the ‘Yankees’ as the white people. It was an invasion of their homeland also.
I think our biggest mistake is to judge those people by today’s standards. Most of them were just trying to get along in a world that probably was speeding past their realm of understanding.
At a WWII event, someone said everyone is a soldier in the trenches and causes are just politics. Soldiers don’t care about politics. That’s probably true.
I agree too Moon.
So will there be a hue and cry over the confederate part of the proclamation?
This seems to be a very active administration, doesn’t it?
Have I left out that I have grand-dog named Mosby?
As a southerner and Virginian (both sides of my family have been here since the Civil War) I like Moon’s idea of Civil War History month instead of Confederate History Month. I agree with her point about remembering Southern Unionists.
Interesting point about the attitude of Northern immigrants during the war, Moon. The city of St. Louis was almost torn apart between Union and Confederate loyalties. The first to rise up in that city for the Union cause and against slavery were the German immigrants, including very recent immigrants. Many of them were of Prussian ancestry and remembered the militaristic and statist aspects of their former homeland, not to mention that Prussia in the first part of the 19th century was considered in some ways to be virtually a throwback to the old feudal system of the Middle Ages. The Germans in St. Louis formed their own militia and drilled as a group. They were of great help to Union officers in keeping St. Louis out of Confederate hands, despite a state governor who was pro-Confederacy. These units later went on to fight with the Union army in the Missouri-Kansas-Arkansas triangle.
Some of Mrs. W’s German immigrant relatives lived in a small town just south of St. Louis. At one point, the Confederate Army of Gen. Sterling Price was camped nearby, threatening St. Louis itself. One of the relatives, a storekeeper, took up a collection from the local folk and used the funds to have the local ladies sew an American flag because there was none available in the area. When the flag was finished, he raised it high above his store so as to tell the Confederates that the little town was loyal to the Union and not afraid to show their loyalties in the face of Gen. Price. That flag and the little book in which the donations were recorded are now in the library/museum at Truman State University in Kirksville, Missouri.
Does New York state have a “Union History Month?” I think not. What a ridiculous concept.
I like Woverine’s comments as well as Moon’s suggestion that this be Civil War History Month. As a mid-westener, I had great-grandfathers (that gives you a clue to my age) on both sides of the war and a great-great grandfather who died as a civilian POW in a Union prison in St.Louis. He lived in Reynolds County, MO and the 65 families there were southern sympathizers. The imprint of our Civil War is still visible in the attitudes of some and it is way past the period when we should be moving on. I would hope that the present governor and future governors of Virginia would take Moon’s advice.
Here is what NPR’s Michael Pope has to say about Governor McDonnell’s rather lame defense of his decision and proclamation:
McDonnell Defends “Confederate History Month” Proclamation
April 07, 2010 – By Michael Pope
In Virginia, Governor Bob McDonnell is defending a decision to declare April as Confederate History Month.
Not since 2001 has a governor of Virginia issued a proclamation designating April as Confederate History Month. The last two governors refused to issue such a proclamation. McDonnell says his proclamation is intended to honor sacrifice and bloodshed on Virginia soil.
“I felt that simply as a point of history, to study the history of the confederacy, was something that should be done,” says McDonnell.
A spokesman for the NAACP says that McDonnell’s proclamation crosses the line – moving beyond a simple recognition of a dark chapter in American history to honoring the commonwealth’s slave-holding past. The governor disagrees, arguing that it draws attention to the state’s many battlefields and tourist attractions.
“We’ve got more Civil War and Confederate cemeteries in Virginia than any other state,” he says.
The controversy comes as Virginia is planning a series of events to mark next year’s 150th anniversary of the Civil War
I don’t think studying the history of the Confederacy is a bad thing. But in what context? The name of the proclamation leaves it open to some extreme interpretation and doesn’t exactly connote inclusiveness.
@Starryflights
Don’t even say that aloud. I am already battling Mr. Howler on that one. He says every day is Union Recognition because they won. He and I are not in agreement on this. He thinks Confederate History month is wonderful. He was born in MA, lived in RI as a small child and grew up in Maryland. Go figure.
There is no southerner like a convert! 😉
Thanks for sharing that George. You know, I feel if the objective was really to study history and to honor those who died on Virginia soil then the proclamation would be called Civil War History Month. To hone in on ‘Confederacy’ just rubs salt in the wounds of some people, and not necessarily all for the same reason. Its divisive, not a uniter.
I am not ashamed at all of my southern heritage. I am proud of it. I just don’t feel the need to keep coon hounds at the house, gun racks in my pick-up and the battle flag on my antenna to express that pride.
Studying war. If it’s not about the strategy it’s going to be a stufy about people which is never comfortable. Wolverine gave me plenty to ponder and MH, I don’t think any other title would have prevented people from reacting negatively.
The only statue I recall seeing of the Civil War in New England is in Camden ME. And it says in large letters accross the pedestal – IN HONOR OF THOSE WHO DIED DURING THE GREAT REBELLION.
It’s all about perspective and it’s all about people. Makes for a lively discussion. If it can just be done politely. 🙂
“Who else could have declared a war against a power with ten times
the area and a hundred times the men and a thousand times the resources,
except men who could believe that all necessary to conduct a successful
war was not acumen nor shrewdness nor politics nor diplomacy nor
money nor simple arithmetic but just love of the land and courage.”
William Faulkner, from “The Bear”
@Juturna
I think to understand war, we MUST study it. Let’s examine the people, the movements, the sociology, the soldiers. What caused this great divide, and why do we still have it?
I fear this issue is more about the politics of “gotch ya.” I hope I am wrong about this but it sure looks like a flame to raise questions of sensitivity and political correctness. Instead of understanding that not less than 7 states memorialize their geneology, Confederate war dead and an historical sense of the sovereign, constituional relationship of the State to the Federal government, we must now endure another politically correct and factually sophmoric attack on the Governor. I tried to not comment on this and avoided it until I saw the WP this morning.
The proclamation narrowly honors Virginia’s Confederate citizen soldiers of the 1860s – very, very few of whom owned slaves. In my view this is appropriate for the State as it avoids the larger issues of states rights, slavery and even the unfinished work and pain caused by the segregationalists/racists of the 1960s (who absounded the ANV’s Battle flag for their own purposes – and still do). The political correctness of the the past couple of governors dishonored those men and women, black and white who fought not “for” slavery”, but for country and community. In this vein I agree with those who will argue that for the soldier – its not about politics – nor is this proclamation.
Consider, I for one have grown tired of equating southerners, the Confederacy and even this proclamation with only racism – which I still think is the larger goal here in the not so subtle attacks on the Governor. The Civil War is much more complicated than that. Germany can differentiate to honor its Weimarcht troops and veterans from its Waffen SS – why can’t we? In response to the proclamation “King Salim Khalfani, executive director of the Virginia State Conference of the NAACP, said his group will hold an emergency meeting Saturday to discuss a series of problems it has had with McDonnell since he was sworn into office in January.” What ? is –he is saying is that he/they are being left out — by limiting the proclamation to a review of Virginia’s military history – do we really have to go through the “shame on you” and a pox on all your families again. I do not object to a Civil War month any more than I object to an African American history month, but let us also simply and directly honor our dead and educate people about what they went through especially as we enter into the 150th sequicentennial. The purpose of this fight over this proclamation is to politically throw mud on the Governor and to dis-honor anything Confederate.
PWC, do you really think people want to dis-honor anyone? What I am hearing is that people feel excluded and that the proclamation seems intended to gloss over the horrors of that war. The NAACP has a right to discuss what the Civil War meant to African Americans and how such a proclamation might be interpreted.
IMO the 150th must bring to light all aspects of the war. But this shouldn’t be just for the 150th. It should be for always. Otherwise, what have we learned from it?
@Poor Richard
And they darn near pulled it off. The war that was supposed to last a matter of weeks lasted 4 years. That wasn’t supposed to happen.
I do. The purpose of this fight over this proclamation is to politically throw mud on the Governor and to dis-honor anything Confederate.
Honeymoon is over here, PWCtp. Did you even read what I wrote? The proclamation is posted and I posted my credentials to be addressing this issue. I left out that I was born and raised in Virginia. Except for a year and a half of my life, I have lived in the South.
The point of the thread was for discussion. Quit trying to manipulate and spin the purpose. I won’t let you. Juturna is probably right. Any mention might make someone mad. I feel the anger might have been mitigated somewhat if had used that big umbrella Civil War rather than Confederacy.
There are literally thousands of young men buried throughout the south who fought for the North. Most of them never made it home. Often their families weren’t even sure where they were buried. The ladies who started Decoration Day didn’t just go out and tend to the southern graves. They tended to all the graves.
State policy should try to avoid sensitive topics, not leap in with both feet. Frankly, I am offended as the great great granddaughter of a Confederate soldier to hear that the past 2 governors dishonored those who died. They most certainly did not.
McDonnell apologizes for slavery omission
Virginia Gov. Bob McDonnell, under fire from some for his proclamation on Confederate History Month, issued the following statement Wednesday evening:
“The proclamation issued by this Office designating April as Confederate History Month contained a major omission. The failure to include any reference to slavery was a mistake, and for that I apologize to any fellow Virginian who has been offended or disappointed. The abomination of slavery divided our nation, deprived people of their God-given inalienable rights, and led to the Civil War. Slavery was an evil, vicious and inhumane practice which degraded human beings to property, and it has left a stain on the soul of this state and nation. In 2007, the Virginia General Assembly approved a formal statement of “profound regret” for the Commonwealth’s history of slavery, which was the right thing to do.
When I signed the Proclamation designating February as Black History Month, and as I look out my window at the Virginia Civil Rights Memorial, I am reminded that, even 150 years later, Virginia’s past is inextricably part of our present. The Confederate History Month proclamation issued was solely intended to promote the study of our history, encourage tourism in our state in advance of the 150th Anniversary of the beginning of the Civil War, and recognize Virginia’s unique role in the story of America. The Virginia General Assembly unanimously approved the establishment of a Sesquicentennial American Civil War Commission to prepare for and commemorate the 150th Anniversary of the War, in order to promote history and create recognition programs and activities.
As Virginians we carry with us both the burdens and the blessings of our history. Virginia history undeniably includes the fact that we were the Capitol of the Confederacy, the site of more battlefields than any other state, and the home of the signing of the peace agreement at Appomattox. Our history is perhaps best encapsulated in a fact I noted in my Inaugural Address in January: The state that served as the Capitol of the Confederacy was also the first in the nation to elect an African-American governor, my friend, L. Douglas Wilder. America’s history has been written in Virginia. We cannot avoid our past; instead we must demand that it be discussed with civility and responsibility. During the commemoration of the Civil War over the next four years, I intend to lead an effort to promote greater understanding and harmony in our state among our citizens.”
In addition the Governor announced that the following language will be added to the Proclamation: WHEREAS, it is important for all Virginians to understand that the institution of slavery led to this war and was an evil and inhumane practice that deprived people of their God-given inalienable rights and all Virginians are thankful for its permanent eradication from our borders, and the study of this time period should reflect upon and learn from this painful part of our history…..
http://voices.washingtonpost.com/local-breaking-news/virginia/sheila-johnson-criticizes-mcdo.html?hpid=topnews
I really think there is a way out of this. African-Americans living in Virginia either as slaves or free men are also part of the history of the Confederacy. I see no reason why their stories cannot be included in all of this as part of the entire fabric which makes up the Commonwealth. In fact, I think that such an inclusion would make the story of our state’s history in that terrible conflict rather complete. I. for one, would have a great interest in seeing such on display. Rather than let this degenerate into another argument, why don’t we just pull together and present the entire history as an educational endeavor? Let the NAACP lead the way in showing all of us what it was like to be a Black person in the Virginia of the Confederacy. In my opinion, they could start with those escaping “contrabands” who provided military intelligence to the Union armies along the old Rappahannock battle line.
War brutalizes almost all who are involved in it. Few are aware that, not only did the Union split apart in 1861, but that conflict also caused the Cherokee Nation in Oklahoma to be rent asunder. Part of the Cherokee Nation supported the Union. Part of it supported the Confederacy. You may have heard of Stand Wattie, the ultra-skilled commander of the Cherokee Cavalry who fought for the Confederacy in Arkansas and Missouri under Gen. Sterling Price. Those Cherokee who stood for the Union were often so frightened that some tried to flee into Kansas. The Confederate forces were also joined by Creeks and/or Choctaws, I believe.
At some point in the frequent battles on the Missouri-Arkansas line, some of the Indian allies of the Confederacy took to scalping fallen Union soldiers in the long-held traditions of Indian warfare. The Union soldiers were most often farmboys from Missouri, Kansas, Iowa, and Nebraska. It was not long before some their surviving comrades, enraged at what they encountered on the battlefield, began to engage in revenge scalping in return. As I said, war brutalizes.
And just to get Confederate History Month started as I have suggested, I, a Yankee long ago transplanted into Virginia through the fortunes of a later war, will have the audacity to put in a plug for two of my favorite people of the Old Confederacy. They both happen to be women who lived in Richmond, one a wealthy White woman of the Richmond aristocracy and the other a young Black woman, a freed slave of immense courage. I doubt that this story will come as a surprise to most African-American historians in the Commonwealth, but I have found that not a whole lot of other people remember these two ladies.
The first was a maiden lady named Elizabeth Van Lew. Although the family originally came from the North, the Van Lews had long been residents of Richmond. They were very wealthy socialites who were stalwarts of ante-bellum Richmond society. They were also slave owners. Daughter Elizabeth, however, was one of the very few in her social circle who disagreed with slavery. Surrounded by believers in slavery, she found few who considered her opinion with any seriousness. However, when Mr. Van Lew died, Elizabeth and her mother took the unusual and almost scandalous step of freeing their own slaves — not just freeing them but sending them north to be educated. Many of the freed slaves took advantage of this offer. Others decided to stay with the Van Lew family as servants. By that decision they entered into the historic annals of the Confederacy.
During the war, Elizabeth made little effort to hide her sentiments. She became obsessed with helping the Union soldiers in Richmond’s notorious Libby Prison, bringing them food and other items whenever she could cajole or bribe the Confederate guards. She affected an air of being a rather eccentric old maid, so much so that Richmonders took to calling her “Crazy Bet” and looking the other way with regard to her open Union sympathies. But what none of them suspected or knew was that “Crazy Bet” was the leader of a Union spy ring right in the heart of the Confederacy. Through her visits to Union officers in Libby Prison, through elicitation from a wide spectrum of government and military acqaintances, and through the use of sub-sources, she collected miilitary information and transmitted it via secret couriers to Union military intelligence across the battle lines. She wrote her reports in a secret code devised by herself and known only to selected Union officers. Apparently her code was never broken by the Confederates. Not until she died early in the 20th century, did someone find the key to the code hidden in the back of her watch. When Gen. U.S. Grant established his headquarters in Petersburg toward the end of the war, he sent a message to Elizabeth Van Lew which read: “You have sent me the most valuable information received from Richmond during the war.”
And now the rest of the story. One of the freed Van Lew slaves sent north to Philadelphia to be educated was a young woman named Mary Elizabeth Bowser. While undertaking her studies, she received an urgent message from Elizabeth Van Lew to return home to Richmond. Without hesitation, Mary packed her bags and headed south to the very place where she had once been a slave. It turns out that Elizabeth had found a job for Mary — an important job made possible by pulling in social markers at the highest level of the Confederate government. Mary Elizabeth Bowser, now an educated free Black, became the nanny for the children of Jefferson Davis and a waitress in the dining room of the Confederate White House. In that dining room affairs of state and war were often discussed openly, much of it overheard by Mary Elizabeth and passed on to Elizabeth Van Lew. It was very often intelligence collected by Mary Elizabeth Bowser which was encoded by Elizabeth Van Lew and then sent by courier to the Union lines. In the technical terms of intelligence gathering, Mary Elizabeth Bowser was as close to the center of information as many a spy could ever hope to get. And she carried out these duties knowing that, if caught, she could be hanged or resold into slavery. Mary Elizabeth Bowser — a young Black woman of tjhe Commonwealth of Virginia.
And what of the other Black servants of the Van Lew household? Why, many of them were the couriers who carried Elizabeth’s coded messages through the Confederate lines for direct passage to waiting Union intelligence officers. Their only cover when encountering Confederate patrols was that they were out there trying to find scarce food items for the Van Lew family table. The coded messages were carried in baskets with fake bottoms and in hollowed out eggs. Even though the Confederates did not have the key to Elizabeth’s code, just the fact of finding such messages hidden away would have meant instant hanging for those couriers. But they never quit taking these risks until the war finally ended. Oh, and in their spare time, they helped to hide escaped Union soldiers in the nooks and crannies of the Van Lew mansion in Richmond.
As I suggested, Confederate History Month in the Commonwealth ought to include a wide variety of stories from both sides in that angonizing conflict. There are heroes aplenty among both the Blue and the Gray. Their stories have often been written. But we should also know that Mary Elizabeth Bowser and many of the servants in the Van Lew household were also fighting a war on behalf of their Black brothers and sisters — only they fought their battles in the shadow of the hangman’s noose.
Moon — Just an aside here which does and does not pertain to the subject of this thread. I believe it is in order to give a pat on the back to those who manage this blog and those who post on it for their ability to discuss even controversial topics with maturity and with restraint even in sharp disagreement. I just read the 8 April article by Anita Kumar in The Washington Post on this very subject of the McDonnell proclamation. No problem with the article. I followed that up by reading more than 144 comments following the article. All I can say with regard to those comments is that there are a lot of sick people in this country of the variety who are so immature that they cannot refrain from addressing other individuals and other posters in some of the most reprehensible language one sees on the web. I found it to be nothing but a long series of ad hominem attacks which were often utterly disgusting and a good reason not to view comments after WaPo articles again. Nice to come back to Moonhowlings.net where civility is a rule of the road.
In reference to the Governor’s comment…”The Confederate History Month proclamation issued was solely intended to promote the study of our history, encourage tourism in our state in advance of the 150th Anniversary of the beginning of the Civil War, and recognize Virginia’s unique role in the story of America.”
If the point was to promote study of Civil War history, encourage tourism to mark the beginning of the Civil War, and recognize Virginia’s role in the Civil War…then why didn’t you proclaim April “Civil War Month?” Wouldn’t that have accomplished the very same goals, while being more sensitive, inclusive, and all-around wise?
Wolverine – #27 –
I agree completely. It is called conversation – and if we converse, I can understand others points of view, and hopefully they will understand my points of view. We can always agree to disagree.
The issues on many other blogs, is the lack of tolerance to any view that differs with the collective audience. When one does not listen to the other points of view, they get a distorted view of the way things are – think of someone that only watches to fox.
I wish Congress would have a little conversation and debate.
@Emma
Yay! Thanks for posting that, Emma.
If you want to hear some interesting perspectives on the Civil War, come to my poetry reading at Haymarket Earth Day, Saturday April 17 at Haymarket Museum on Washington Street. Readings will be held at 11 a.m. and 1 p.m. Books signings will go on all day at Rotary Community Corps table. Partial proceeds will be donated to Bull Run Mountains Conservancy which preserves both natural assets in PWC and historic sites.
Well, the Wash Post at least, is today reveling in the Governor’s unfortunate effort to back-peddle into political correctness. See it at:
http://voices.washingtonpost.com/postpartisan/2010/04/mcdonnell_backpedals_on_confed.html?hpid=opinionsbox1
But also note how Confederate soldiers are treated and immediatley stereotyped to a modern red-neck equivelent. “Do you pine for the gallantry of the soldiers in grey, affix Confederate flags to your pickup’s antenna and delight in rebel yells at football games? Or do you regard the Confederate cause as a fundamentally racist and treasonous project whose defeat was a blessing?”
My family does not carry the stain of slavery. Indeed, one grandfather was a part of the underground railroad with a home/farm along the Erie Canel (still there) and was a member of the 7th NY Artillery – another was with the 4th NY Cav. Do I understand the issues and the sensitivites – you bet. Do I beleive that the recent attack on the Governor was political opportunism – even is there was sincere shock at the limited scope of the proclamation – you bet. Do I beleive that the State of Virginia can and should honor its dead – as the Federal government does not nor should it – without once again “wallowing in Viginia’s historical guilt” – you bet. However, I am perfectly ready to change my mind — the day that the State proclaims February to also honor its Confederate dead. I don’t expect it to happen nor should it. The point here is that we should be able to do both without the wallowing and without the political opportunism. One thing is for sure – the politics of wallowing – I like that word – is going to make the sequiscentennial difficult, at best. BTW, Moon, I too have a dog named Jackson 🙂
@PWC Taxpayer
Thank you for sharing your family history, PWC! And thanks, Wolverine, for doing the same. Clearly, there was a melding of the North and South that left many folks with loyalty issues. These are the kinds of stories that need to be shared. It’s not all about one thing.
Perhaps someone could enlighten us what flying the Confederate flag means, outside of those nuts who approve of overt racism. I can’t believe all flag-flyers are racist.
You have to have one named Stoney also and a grandpup named Mosby to keep up with the Joneses there, PWCTP. 😉 Is your Jackson a complete jerk? Mine is. And he dances.
I don’t think that the Washington Post was portraying the Confederate soldier as a redneck. I think they were showing 2 different extremes. Perhaps the middle ground should have been shown also.
I have a very dear friend who I almost put out on the side of the road on I-95. As we past the Stonewall Jackson Shrine marker by friend referred to Jackson as a traitor. He was an example of the left side of extremist. He felt everything confederate was evil. In fact, he is who gave me my picture of Robert E. Lee. I have no clue where he got it.
If people didn’t agree on these issues 150 years ago, we don’t have much of a prayer of that happening now.
@Posting As Pinko
First there needs to be an understanding of the difference between the “Stars & Bars” of the First Confederate National – flown at 1st Manassas – and the more familiar “Saint Andrews” Cross regimental battle flag of the ANV. It is that second flag that was incorporated into the 2nd and 3rd Confederate Nationals — but was then stolen by the segregationists and several southern States when they incorporated it into their State flags in the 1950s.
Properly used, the “St. Andrews” Cross is a honored Regimental Battle Flag that represents the soldiers sacrifice and brotherhood, that many gave their lives for.
Pat and Wolverine, Thank you both for your kind words. There are a few bumps in the road but I think we get back on track.
Just for the record, I do have ancestors that were slave holders. I don’t know much about it other than they were. I didn’t own slaves. What they did was beyond my control, much the same as not having control over the Trail of Tears.
Oddly enough, the g-g-grandfather who was the Confederate soldier was not a slave holder, to my knowledge.
Wolverine, when my son was little he had wonderful pre school teacher named Miss Mary. She was part Chickasaw Indian. She still had her Chickasaw grandfather’s sword from the civil war. He was a confederate. I guess he would have to have been a grew greats….
I try not to judge people from another time by our modern day standards. We can accept that things are not right and have no business in society without damning everyone from our past.
@pinko
Here is a link for the simplest explanation. Actually, it is a common mistake and unless you are in a persnickety crowd, is easily forgiven.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flags_of_the_Confederate_States_of_America
My favorite is the Bonnie Blue.
I’m a Yankee and have been all my life.I’ve read with a great deal of interest what all of you have said and I believe “most” of you have the correct perspective. I am a “Civil War Buff” and I have the greatest respect for the Southern Soldier He accomplished amazing things with less support(food,clothes,arms) and the Generals had to be great, they had less troops and transportation. The Army of Northern Virginia was particularly effective! I’ve traveled your beautiful battlefields and I commend you for remembering the past.
You have every right to be proud of your ancestors and I applaud you for it.Don’t let them turn State Pride into “political spin”
@Moon-howler
I find this especially interesting about flying the Confederate flag:
“In other countries, the Confederate flag can be used as a symbol for other things. For example, in Sweden it is used by people who drive and enjoy old American cars and enjoy the American life style from the 1940s, 50s, and 60s. In the United Kingdom it is frequently used by people who enjoy line dancing, country music and American life style.”
There should be more education on this. Would help alleviate some racial tensions, I’m assuming (or hoping).
@Posting As Pinko
You mean the ANV Battle Flag – not the Confederate Flag — its starts here 🙂 And again, I think many of us do understand the sensitivity to the use of that flag – – but largely because of how it was used not during the Civil War (military) but in the 1950s. Unfortunatley, in some quarters, it is still used today as a racist banner.
It is interesting that Virginia is able to celebrate its Presidents, its Continental Army, War of 1812, and other pre -1963 soldiers, without the “wallowing,” but cannot celebrate its sons of 1861-1865 without it. Right or wrong, I blame the segregationalists of the 1950s for that and for the hyper-sensitivity to the whole thing we still face every day. If only Lincoln could have survived for more than a week into his second term, how different things might be.
Keep going back…PWCTP. Don’t stop with 1950’s. I agree about Lincoln.
PWC, tell her what it means…don’t just throw out initials. Don’t chide someone over not knowing which flag is which without giving out the correct information.
Pinko, good for you for reading up on it. I don’t know the names of all the flags either and I have lived here most of my life, as you know. Knowing all the names is esoteric knowledge and has to do mainly with interest in the subject.
Bear, thank you for your kind words about our state. You might just get to be my favorite yankee.
We’re getting HOT lanes, and in the meantime enduring the increased traffic and- this week–a water-main break that tied up traffic for hours yesterday morning. Those wonderful HOT lanes that will put money in the pockets of private companies into infinity for roads that our tax dollars paid to build and maintain.
It just goes to show you that when you send a guy to Richmond, he quickly forgets about that pesky “Northern” Virginia (except when it comes to revenue collection) and worries more about giving red meat to his opposition like McDonnell has just done.
Emma, can you please elaborate? I don’t commute any more and I just don’t pay attention. For the sake of argument, pretend I know nothing because I don’t/.
The High Occupancy Toll lanes are being built to cover about 14 miles between the Dulles Toll Road and the Springfield Interchange. Drivers on these roads will require an EZ-Pass transponder to pay tolls that will fluctuate according to traffic conditions–with the average trip about $5 to $6, and up to a dollar a mile during peak traffic for non-carpoolers (and to editorialize, poor folks going to jobs where carpooling or bus-riding may not be a viable option).
If folks suddenly start seeing the light and decide to carpool more, the Commonwealth will have to make up the loss in revenue to the private management company, per the contract.
This will be a for-profit venture with an 80-year contract to a private company who will allegedly use the funds to maintain and improve upon these roads.
Yesterday the HOT lane construction resulted in a water main break at the beltway off I-66, snarling and diverting early-morning rush hour traffic for hours. The construction creates daily headaches for commuters.
This will be the gift that keeps on giving, and someone gets to make a bundle of money off of our traffic woes.
Thank you for explaining. So it will be part of the beltway between the toll road there and the mixing bowl? It sounds horribly expensive.
When was this approved?
Will you keep up posted on this situation?
You’ll hear people refer to them as “Lexus Lanes,” because the rich will always be able to afford them, as well as those lucky enough to have employers who reimburse for commuting costs. The rest either endure the regular lanes or walk, I guess, if they can’t take a bus or carpool with two other people.
And we don’t have any reasonable alternatives–thanks again, Richmond. I would LOVE to sit on a train or bus and snooze, have a little time to read and regroup before going home and starting my mom/wife job, but that is simply not an option for me. VRE is a very short walk from my house, but takes me nowhere I need to go, nor is Metro an option. Carpooling is not an option, as I’m a sole provider and have to keep a unique set of business hours.
The HOT lanes agreement between VDOT and the vendor transpired during Mark Warner’s term as governor. I found the timeline at http://virginiahotlanes.com/beltway-project-info-history.asp
So who approved it? Warner or the Legislature or does it even need approval by anyone but VDOT?
When my commute changed from and hour and 45 minutes per day to less than a half hour my entire attitude about my job changed. I felt like I had a new life.
@PWC Taxpayer
What’s ANV?
Pat. Herve — I would agree that “conversation” is a very good description of this blog. Posters here of whatever political proclivity seem to put much thought and effort into their posts — unlike most blogs I see where the posts are often very short and full of buzz words without really adding any new information or new thought trails to the debate. Another thing I have noticed is that posters keeping coming back on the same thread rather than just giving it a one-shot deal. That makes a real difference in the quality of communication.
[…] it is what I’ve seen proposed in a couple of places (1,2) across the blogosphere. I think that is a reasonable compromise. Possibly related posts: […]