It is time now, time to move towards community solutions for Prince William County. I have said this before, we will not fix the immigration reform debate from a local standpoint. There are many diverse views on illegal immigration AND immigration, but at some point, we have to come together and find what will work in our own communities, our own neighborhoods. Let’s use this thread to talk about community solutions, ones that WE can implement here, in Prince William County, solutions that will unite us as opposed to divide us. Part of the solution must involve the Latino community, so I hope that people will come up with some innovative ideas. Please, I urge everyone, leave the name calling behind and instead, focus on positive solutions. Some of the issues that need to be addressed are day laborer sites and a more dignified location for people to look for work, overcrowding issues, language barriers, community healing, immigration education, and a host of other issues that need to be addressed. I know I haven’t named them all, so please, feel free to add to the issues and solutions within the thread. I am hoping this will foster some great dialogue and bring us out of a “cyber world” and into “real life” idea implementation!
From Cindy B on a previous thread:
If you want to do more than just debate, take part in a webinar being hosted by the Center for Voter Deliberation of No Va (www.cvdnva.org) on July 9 from 6:30 to 7:30 pm.
This fall the Center plans to convene one or two pilot circles, of up to twenty people each, for an afternoon on one or more Saturdays in October. The goal for the pilot circle(s) will be to attract a diverse group of Prince William County participants, i.e., to include people who have concerns about the problems of immigration from the immigrant and non-immigrant sides, and who seek a way to discuss and do something about those problems.
So either register for the webinar if you’d like to be in on the planning, or go to the website to leave an e-mail that you’d like to be in the pilot study circles in the fall. The more diverse the viewpoints, the more valuable the study circles will be.
Yea I have an HOA but did you know these OLD communities can START THEIR OWN HOA???
Not very easily. It would probably take 100% of the homeowners agreeing to form one. A civic association or other less formal group should be doable.
Well there are many I know that actually get out and communicate and are neighborly with their immigrant neighbors. Talking to you neighbors working together, helping each other is good for all.
Of course many now you can start a Civic Association in neighborhoods. Unfortunately, all residents don’t want to participate. I did read the links above, and have read many more.
You haven’t a clue as to what I have or have not done. From the sounds of your posts you just like to read your words or hear your voice.
Sometimes something as simple as a block party in the summer gives neighbors a chance to get to know each other.
Well Jorge guess you got it alllll figuered out..and your right, Havent got a clue as to what you have done and really dont care.. Gald that you know “many other” communities that are leading the way, helping others etc etc..Guess if thats the case, then whats your point here???
Remember..Actions speak louder than words.
Censored,
That’s right and the county can assist with that. They also will help orgainize Community Yard Sales too.
100% participation.. I hope that’s based on occupied houses. A quarter of my block is still empty.
C
You say you don’t care what I’ve done or not done. Yet, you say actions speak louder than words. Right, you are I’ve been busy for years working for good for all citizens.
What’s my point here.. That is of no concern to you.
Go bok at your HOA!! Your comments are not working for good like the thread mentioned.
I go out with my kids and pick up trash at various places, if you must know. I say “hi” to my neighbors and let all the kids play together if they wish. If there’s a problem, I talk to my neighbors. I also do what I can within our church that reaches out to immigrants. I write letters and talk at Citizen’s Time if I can.
Is that what you are looking for, Just?
I’m also advocating for a Citizen Advisory Board to help direct neighborhood and community complaints…..NOT to write immigration policy but to help keep the peace, get residents to the right departments, field complaints, etc. The people on these boards must be customer service oriented, logical, kind, patient, and unconnected with any political party. And I would add, NO HSM MEMBERS OR ASSOCIATES.
Jorge Pollo- Your right…Your wisdom is so much more inspiring..Thank you for the enlightenment…
Kgotthardt- …..Nope…Thought the thread was all about bringing all sides together, hashing out ideas that also involved the latino Community…
Everyone here is all about “picking up trash” hmmmmmm are you guys associating Illegals to trash?? Makes one wonder….hmmmmmm
Chris, I think because an HOA has legal ramifications and homeowners bought their houses when those legally restrictive covenants weren’t in place it would take all of them agreeing to the change to make it happen. I might be wrong but that’s how it was explained to me. Civic associations aren’t that restrictive…you can join or not depending on if you wish. Supervisor Jenkins’ staff told me that some civic associations had been formed in older parts of Dale City.
BTW, I heard through the grapevine that “the sign” has seen some changes.
Yes, the Civic Association has nothing to with restrictions. It’s about coming together as community for many things. It keeps the neighborhoods looking good and getting people together to share ideas for improvement.
I was over ther Sunday, and it looked the same. I did notice a new flag flying on the top. I wil have to check it out. I’m going over to the City a little later. Thanks.
Here is a thought and its genuine so please dont pounce on me..But if HSM is really scaring off the day laborers then…Why dont some of you go and offer jobs to do around the communities..Like power washing houses, doing some light landscapping ( mowing, weed eating) take up a community collection and then offer the collection to a couple day laborers for their services.. In turn, you can s how HSM that YOU are not afraid and the day laborer is happy to be getting some income for his/her family and while these services are being done, Offer then lemonaid or some bottled water and strike up some sort of conversation…..
just a thought…
Believe it or not, I would contribute $25.00 towards this….I’m willing to take that leap, I just can’t be the leader….
Well good for you. And maybe you’ll get raped or killed the way some do who patronize day laborers. And probably your dying thought would be “Damn, I’ll bet Greg L. will have a field day with this …”
Seriously, it’s not safe hiring day laborers and taking them to your house.
Rick
You are right. No one’s doing “jack” at my home if they are not properly licesned, issured and bonded. Only a fool would take that liability on.
Just Cause, you’re nothing but a troll. Forget you and your boredom or whatever it is that drives you to waste people’s time.
@ Just Cause 8. July 2008 15:03
We do that in Herndon all the time…Many private home owners pick up Day Laborers at the unofficial site to do lawn work for themselves or the elderly.
As long as tax dollars aren’t involved, not many people care.
Chris, they called Jesus a fool as well as those who followed him, but He hung out with the poor reguardless.
We know the risk, we don’t fear.
rod,
You are so right. Some just don’t seem to see the big picute. What a shame. There so much beyond our own front door.
signed,
fearless 😉
WOW talking out both sides of your mouth, Why not hire a day laborer? You are all talking compassion and getting to know one another and bringing communities together..blah blah..Just an idea and of course shot down.
Rick- Guess you are right
Chris- Hmmm rod2155 does it all the time, Whats the difference in Herndon and PWC?
Kgottard- If you dont like what I say, FART AND SKIP OVER IT..people like YOU are part of the problem, you have alll these suggestions and ideas but when its time to put your money where your mouth is…YOU FART and roll over……
Chris, 8. July 2008, 15:30
rod,
You are so right. Some just don’t seem to see the big picute. What a shame. There so much beyond our own front door.
signed,
fearless
______
Did you just not post that you would NEVER hire someone ( day Laborer) unles they are bonded and insured etc etc ??
KG, definitely a troll. Some loud pottymouth here but apparently fell to pieces when someone wizzed on her tire and laughed at her (or is that him). Uh huh…
JC,
I left a sarcasm alert!
I would NOT hire a day laborer or any fool that came knocking on my door wanting to do work. I have plenty of legal friends with ligit businesses. You can hire them if you want to.
Ignore those pesky trolls!!
CHALLENGE:
Why dont you KG and your gottar-bot censored, and all the other broads, troll ON over to Irongate and clean sweep that community and then hit Georgetown south..Make sure you wear your smiles and give your best “Hi how are you’s” and then report back how you were welcomed with open arms and how “nice” the community people were..
Put your Money where your Mouth is ladies…………
Chris- EXACTLY!!!!!!!!!! ..Becareful the troll police might “get you”…
Ignore kg, she is quick to label anyone she disagrees with as a troll, a Greg supporter, an HSM member, or other even more hateful things.
The City is planning its 2nd Annual Neighborhood Conference now. It’s going to take place on Nov 15 from 8:30am to 3pm at the Carteret Mortgage Boys and Girls Club in Manassas (behind Jennie Dean Elementary School). Call Kisha Wilson-Sogunro, the City’s Neighborhood Services Coordinator to volunteer — adults and youth needed! 703-257-8240
There are still two more groups of “Week of Hope” volunteers coming to the City of Manassas. Anyone is welcome to work along side them, or if you know of someone in the City who needs their help, call Kisha.
Join in planning the Study Circles (see beginning of this thread).
Go to the film series Unity in the Community is putting together (see KG’s post).
Thanks for focusing on action and solutions.
I think that there are a lot of bi-lingual people who post here (unfortunately I’m not one of them) has anyone tried to create and/or volunteer to teach English classes? I think that the main problem with getting a community together is that some people can’t even talk with their neighbor. If they could communicate then maybe some ice-breaking could start.
Wow, you have been a busy group today!
While I see some good ideas on this thread, Elena, I take issue with the way you introduced this thread:
we will not fix the immigration reform debate from a local standpoint
Yes, we can, and we will. Turning a blind eye to the breaking of existing laws is not a “solution.”
Part of the solution must involve the Latino community
Just the Latino community? Aren’t you drawing some serious generalizations here, generalizations that have gotten many people attacked on this blog for racism? What about the sizable West African immigrant population in Woodbridge? Are we leaving them in the dust? Or are you suggesting that Latinos need more hand-holding than other immigrants?
Day laborer sites and a more dignified location for people to look for work
I am all for helping LEGAL Americans find work. Many church groups and other private organizations are already doing that. It has seemed to me that you favor maintaining a way for illegal immigrants to get work, to continue to avoid paying income taxes, and enable their exploitation by businesses profiting by the cheap labor and depriving legal citizens of the right to blue-collar jobs that pay a living wage. Last I checked, it is still illegal to hire an illegal immigrant, and I won’t agree with any community “solution” that involves enabling that practice.
Community “healing”
The idea that this area has suffered a decline in reputation, that it is somehow more “hateful” and that Hispanic women and children are living in fear is an outright lie. I see Hispanic children riding their bicycles around police cruisers, women with them strolling with babies. They are everywhere living their lives like everyone else. The folks setting off illegal fireworks in the largely Hispanic neighborhood in PWC I was visiting this weekend were certainly not living in fear while they were defying the law. Mr. Fernandez and his crew didn’t look too stressed out while they partied in front of their big “FU” to the community. The day laborers who continue to gather are not living in fear. It is complete nonsense that is nothing more than an effort to make the race card a stronger hand.
Many of you suggest that it is simply a matter of loving thy neighbor. Unfortunately, some of you are wielding a rather self-righteous weapon here. Anyone who has shown even the slightest bit of dissent in this thread is painted with a broad, unholy brush, and that is unfair. Those who invoke Jesus to try to shut down a debate might be in need of a little soul-searching themselves. One cannot assume that those of us who take issue with some of the above are not already helping the community in many ways.
I hardly think, as some have suggested, that disagreement with the prevailing opinins here equals “anger-management issues.” Many of us are unwilling to simply abandon the effort to control illegal immigration and its effects in favor of “solutions” that simply provide a welcome mat and further incentive to lawbreaking.
Hi Emma, I had many of the same issues you pointed out but I was too tired to get into it. The one that most stood out was “we will not fix the immigration reform debate from a local standpoint”, a lot issues are first fixed at the local “grassroots” level.
However, when it comes to getting a community to come together it can only happen if neighbors can communicate with one another. I’m not saying everyone HAS to learn English, I’m just saying it would make it easier if we could speak the same language. If someone doesn’t want to learn English I could care less, but I may not get the opportunity to ever get to know them and they won’t get to know me.
Emma,
We will not solve global warming on a local level, just like we won’t solve immigration issues. Having said that, it doesn’t mean we don’t do what we can individually and as a community to improve our small piece of the planet. We can be the model that sets the standard, and it can be a negative, fearful, and angry model, or it can be positive solution focused humane initiatives.
Let’s be real here, people are complaining about lantino’s that simple, that overt. I don’t really want to play semantics, the people who complain the loudest, like HSM, that have impacted our county policy, have one common denominator, HISPANICS. “go back to mexico”, “learn english”, “why are home depot signs in spanish”, etc etc etc.
Day Laborer sites, do nothing and see what happens with HSM, not a good solution. The solution does not have to involve tax payer dollars, i.e. Rod’s suggestions.
Since you are not part of the lantino community Emma, you may want to do a little more research. This is not simply about illegal immigrants and their fear, or lack thereof, it is about hispanics immigrants, being singled out for hateful comments or nasty stares based on what they look like and sound like.
As far as broad brush strokes, we have had several agreements Emma, so I am not sure what you are actually referring to.
jUST CAUSE,
Funny how one person reads an article and gets one idea out of it and another reads an article and gets an entirely different main idea …from the same article.
I read the same article and walked away outraged that someone would fleece anyone who had worked all day for ten bucks an hour. I also believe the anonymity was provided by the Post, not the courts. Furthermore, we don’t know that the man who was fleeced didn’t pay taxes using his ITIN. Check out the link.
http://www.irs.gov/individuals/article/0,,id=96287,00.html#what
I am curious why this article makes you so furious. It made me feel sorry for someone who was so desperate that they lived in another country to support their family and that some scumbag would take advantage of the situation by cheating them.
It isnt too sharp to take anyone into your home that you don’t know if you don’t go through an established business, Rick. I don’t think being ‘illegal’ demonizes a person.
Moon-howler, I agree with your view on the article, it sucks that the guy got cheated out of his pay which I’m sure he worked hard for. However, at the same time I was thinking to myself… if this guy (the illegal laborer) won his case then wouldn’t that open up the possibility for charges on the guy that hired illegal labor?
So who elected you elena as defender of legal hispanic immigrants? I wonder, do they really want you to stand up for them? I would like to hear some legals ones say so, the ones I talk to say you are a blowhard looking for a cause and just wish you would shut up and go back to your environmental activism. Dont you have a bunch of kids? Shouldnt you be taking care of them instead of trying to help out the poor illegals? I’m fairly sure the legal ones dont need nor want your help.
MH, I got the same impression as you did. Yesterday’s WaPo had an article about how colleges are seeing an upswing in the number of students signing up for immigration law classes. There should be more attorneys to help with these cases in the future. (It sounded as if the judge in that one case needed an education in immigration law.)
Yap. Yap. Yap. Elvis, cite your sources.
KG spewed:
“We need to de-vest in these giant corporate chain franchises and focus on small local business.
Right on!”
Yet ANOTHER example of her waffling. Just yesterday she bragged about how she loves to shop at Wal-Mart because it’s cheap. So, uh, which one is it? Do you shop at mo and pop places or the big box stores? Which side are you on today, KG?
JC is right – all of your examples of “solutions” are picking up trash. Of course, if you live in Sheffield Manor, it’s pretty easy to communicate with your neighbors. Take up JC’s challenge and spend your Saturday (with your children!) at Irongate and clean up their neighborhood. Or better yet – go to the 7-11 and hire some day laborers to help you clean up.
You wish, and I guess you’re solutionless except to ditto JC.
Okay, how about these? Rather than just picking up trash, why don’t you volunteer in the community at schools and hospitals to act as a translator or advocate? OR create an organization in which immigrants who need help filling out paperwork/getting community resources/finding work get the help they need and the information that they need? There was just an article in the Examiner that up to 30% of students eligible for free/reduced lunch don’t get it because their parents don’t know that they can apply for it.
Is that better? I do many of these things where I work, because I work in the school system. I advocate for the parents who have limited English proficiency and make sure that a translator is available for them. I have volunteered to teach adult ESL, as has my mother. You think that because people are against illegal immigrant we are against ALL immigrants. You are wrong.
Just Cause:
Don’t you know that income tax is unconstitutional and the IRS/Federal Reserve is an illegal entity? Wake up. Instead of arguing to enslave immigrants…don’t you think you should be fighting to liberate yourself and your children from the illegal garnering of your wages that is income tax?
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-1656880303867390173&q=freedom+to+fascism&ei=lf9zSObZCYS4rgKWl5GtCw&hl=en
Good for you, You wish, you’re making a positive contribution to your community regardless of your view on immigration. The reason trash is brought up is because some neighborhood residents are concerned about it and the mess in their community. My neighborhood has some messy houses – always has – and we do a community clean-up once a year and at other times we, as individuals, pick up the litter or report the worst of the houses.
I don’t pick up day laborers at 7-11. I use licensed and insured contractors…both for my sake and the workers’ sakes. And I get the proper permits. But, if that’s how some guy can pick up some money, I’m not going to prevent him from trying.
People on this blog work in different ways within their community and try to put their skills to the most or best use. Some of us who have spent time typing on our keyboards sending our messages to the WaPo, the MJM, other blogs, the BOCS, etc. feel that we’ve made a difference in county policy in that way. Others may teach classes that examine the issues of immigration. Others may be policemen/women who try to humanely deal with immigrants/the immigration issue on a daily basis. Others are involved in the thick of it at a personal level with their families.
It’s not as simplistic as telling someone to go pick up trash in Irongate or Georgetown South.
Something that I’d venture to say that most posters here do is greet immigrants with the same smile with which we’d greet our neighbors and not with the scowl of the Red Circle. Immigrants are here. For the most part, they are not “going back”. You can either make friends of your fellow county/city residents or you can make them your enemies. You decide what’s best in the long run.
You Wish, you can like Wal-Mart and support small businesses. It’s not an either/or. That’s the kind of thinking that gets us into problems in the first place. Think “and” rather than “either/or.”
I’d be happy to join anyone in a picking up trash event at Irongate or anywhere else. My daughters and I just did some at Stonewall Park near Point of Woods. Trash is everywhere. Just look around and start picking it up.
Anyone hear a whiny sound in the background besides me??? Oh, that is Elvis. Okay, let’s continue..
Whoa, elvis, them’s fighten’ words among some of us working moms. I’ve got four amazing kids, a full-time job I love, and volunteer work. I don’t tend to hang around long with people who say stuff like that.
But elvis does have a point there, once you get past all that. Where are all of the Hispanic voices? Are they really that weak and helpless? I’m not buying it. It seems more the norm that they are living their lives like everyone else, as I said, while some are openly defying zoning, employment, driving and other laws. When we hear about how fearful, oppressed or angry they are, it seems purely anecdotal.
For positive community solutions, PWC needs to deal with its “national automobile slums.”
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q1ZeXnmDZMQ&feature=related
“The idea that this area has suffered a decline in reputation, that it is somehow more “hateful” and that Hispanic women and children are living in fear is an outright lie. I see Hispanic children riding their bicycles around police cruisers, women with them strolling with babies. They are everywhere living their lives like everyone else. The folks setting off illegal fireworks in the largely Hispanic neighborhood in PWC I was visiting this weekend were certainly not living in fear while they were defying the law. Mr. Fernandez and his crew didn’t look too stressed out while they partied in front of their big “FU” to the community. The day laborers who continue to gather are not living in fear. It is complete nonsense that is nothing more than an effort to make the race card a stronger hand.”
That’s exactly right, and I’ll go further. I saw a lot of happiness among legal Hispanics when the Rule of Law resolution went down and their illegal neighnbors started moving away. Smiles everywhere.
And Jedi, I said day laborers aren’t safe, I didn’t say illegals. YOU projected that, not me.
It’s not actually anecdotal at all. The illegal immigration issue has mobilized Hispanics in this country like no other. There has been a wave of citizenship applications, a wave of new voters in states across the country. This is among legal residents. If you haven’t heard about this, I can certainly dig up the surveys/news reports.
This is because many people are citizens or in legal status have friends and relatives who are not, and all because people are angered about the potential for harassment and discrimination based on prejudice.
The Hispanic community isn’t monolithic. I am sure there are people who support all the legislation against illegal immigration on every level of government. But to pretend that is the majority voice across the country is to be wearing blinders. The candidates know that.