It’s been a year since the County first adopted the ‘Immigration Resolution’ and because of continual participation from more moderate voices, it is now, but a shadow of its original proposed self. The Resolution is, at its core, faulted because of its assertion that illegal immigration has been determined to cause ‘lawlessness and economic hardship’. This declaration has never been substantiated and continues to remain an unfounded claim upon which this resolution was founded.
If you recall, the original version suggested checking immigration status at all public facilities even schools and parks. Thankfully, staff recognized that implementation of such a far reaching and radical policy was unwise. And, with the guidance and suggestion of more reasonable perspectives, began the process of affecting changes to mitigate not only the potential of costly lawsuits but to reign in the more radical elements that initially suggested the plan.
By October, we were left with a short list of 8 identified services that could be ‘reasonably’ restricted combined with a policy that mandated officers to inquire into immigration status with anyone they came into contact with that they believed had ‘probable cause’ to be undocumented. Shortly thereafter, it was determined that 2 of the previously identified services should also not be restricted and the list shrank to 6.
In April, with the start of the planning for the ‘09 Fiscal Plan’ another opportunity presented itself for another scale back when cameras became too costly of an investment. We then lobbied and succeeded in having the Resolution modified so that Officer’s could fallback to the previous policy of ‘reasonable articulable suspicion’ combined with a mandated post-arrest procedure for status checks, Now, the “Immigration Resolution” consists of the restrictions to the 6 services, mandated status checks after arrest and the general resolution. All of this, has born a price tag of $4 million dollars, and for all practical purposes has brought us full circle, back to the place, in essence where we started.
Emma, the sign issue will have to run its legal course. Had the sign not appeared at the time Manassas City was under the scrutiny of the DOJ, perhaps the situation would be different. Manassas City at least does a sweep of all neighborhoods looking for code violations that detract from the appearance of properties. I’d like to see PWC implement that in some of the older sections of the county where most of the problems are – addressing the actual code violations as opposed to ethnicity.
Many problems occur when a person calls in a violation. I suspect too many wild accusations are made and no facts are offered to back up some of the claims. Too much staff time is spent sorting through crapola instead of being able to investigate valid complaints. You know what I mean. You’ve read the wild and nutty speech at BVBL. Now imagine what county and city staff and politicians have to sort through. I know you have the ability to write a coherent letter, but too many other people lack that skill.
Another thought. What would have happened had Mr. F torn down the remaining wall of the house after the original sign was vandalized and done this – sink two 4×4 or 6×6 posts in the ground and attach a sign painted on a sheet to them? No building code violation. Freedom of speech?
One solution: Just get out there, meet your neighbors and help clean up the mess in the yards. Work with your local government, don’t just call them and expect them to fix it.
http://www.insidenova.com/isn/news/local/article/volunteer_teens_give…
The City of Manassas’ Neighborhood Services is listening and responding, but they can’t do it alone without matching volunteers right here.
The family who was helped is very nice, just overwhelmed. Their neighbors came out and helped, gave popsicles to the youth. I couldn’t help much because I had to work, but I leant the crews a gas weed-eater and safety glasses and when they were done, I picked up a load of old car batteries to take to the hazardous household waste collection.
If all of us just went a little out of our way to show some kindness, it would diffuse a lot of the tensions here.
Great meeting some of you at the screening last night! The food at Casablanca was awesome. I really appreciate the filmmakers’ work in documenting this ever changing time and capturing so many people and their stories. Does anyone know, has this type of on-going evolving documentary ever been done before?
http://www.insidenova.com/isn/news/local/article/volunteer_teens_give_manassas_hope/18242/
Just Cause,
I guess I just don’t see that the sign has anything to do with reality. It’s there. I think it is ugly but I am not a city resident so I guess I don’t have much to say about it. I wish our BOCS chair had said as much on fox and friends this morning. He said it wasn’t fair.
I believe he should have said it isn’t in his jurisdiction and moved on to his own gored ox. He never attempted to explain that in Virginia, cities are seperate municipalities. He never said that the sign was a zoning violation. Perhaps the Mayor of Manassas should have been the spokesperson for what is going on in the city rather than the BOCS chair of PW Co.
I felt sorry for the city this morning. Not only do they have to contend with Mr. Fernandez and his famous illiterate sign, but they also got Corey Stewart to use it as a launching pad for self-advancement. it guess today was the city’s turn in the proverbial barrel. Sorry guys.
Emma,
I’ve given many links to the various county agencies. I’ve posted about how you can help the county with the vacant houses by filling out the Neighborhood “eyes and ears” Checklist for vacant properties. I’ve also given various links to other links within the Neighborhood Sevices. They ultimately are where the real neighborhood solutions will be resolved. I also have similar links for the City of Manassas and the City of Manassas Park.
These below are all compliments of PWC!
Vacant house checklist..
http://www.pwcgov.org/docLibrary/PDF/008268.pdf
Neighborhood Resource Guide
http://www.pwcgov.org/docLibrary/PDF/004111.pdf
The 2008 Community Clean Up Calendar
http://www.pwcgov.org/docLibrary/PDF/008027.pdf
I would like to say the Community Clean Up Day at Sudley Elem. They took away 14 tons of trash between 8am & 2pm. It gives residents a much closer alternative to going to the dump. Take advantage of saving some money on gas.
There probably should be clean up days 4 times a year. Once a quarter. Sort of like locker clean outs. Not everyone has a truck.
rod2155 said 11. July 2008, 7:05 “Last night was a moment of clarity for me, I was able to see how an attempt was made by a handful of recklessly angry locals to manufacture a law that would limit the constitutional rights of people, citizens and non, based on “Unreasonable suspicion.”
Even though Eric Byler and I had a peasant conversation before the screening started the screening was far from unbiased. Why didn’t he capture other people who spoke less passionately? Why not put my statement to the board on this film? The statement I made about a friend’s son being murdered by MS-13 illegal gang members? Was it because it showed 5 illegal immigrants in a bad light? People on both sides of this issue are very passionate and it shows in how strongly they speak out.
Eric said I probably wouldn’t like the first part of the film and he was right. I question why he didn’t balance the speakers. No he took clips of the comments that would most inflame. The clips he put up are just that, clips. Most of the people that spoke were not that passionate the whole three minutes they were in front of the BOCS.
I haven’t really looked at the PWC crime stats but there is one thing I want to point out about the paper that was passed out last night from 9500 Liberty and Antibvbl.net. There are two sides to every story/issue.
Through a FOIA request, I acquired an email to Chief Deane that says, “Here are some numbers in case you get the “lawlessness comment” The Hispanics are as much a victim as suspects: for the robbery cases this year 43% of robbery victims are Hispanic. 21% are suspects. I went through the murders back to 2004. Non-Hispanic Victims-19, Hispanic Victims- 11. Non-Hispanic Suspects- 18 cases, Hispanic suspect cases-10 Some of the cases had multiple suspects.” This was dated July 9, 2007.
Maureen
Maureen, you know that the majority of the film was devoted to how the change in the resolution came about. The focus was not on the comments made during Citizens Time but on the BOCS’s activity. I watched the twelve hour marathon on channel 23 as it happened. The inflammatory remarks were there and stood out.
Maureen,
Did you get to ask Eric why he was hiding in the bushes?
Maybe Eric had to take a pee…
Red Dawn, Yes we talked about that and he acknowledge he was filming behind some trees, but that it was not his intention to conceal himself from HSM members. He didn’t have his tri-pod with him so wanted to get different angles.
And guess what else? I had a “respectful” conversation with a few people last night. I didn’t get “angry” with anyone there and I was well behaved. What a concept for an HSM member.
Censored bybvbl, You are correct in your statement, however it still does not excuse the beginning of the film.
Hope not. Thats against the law.
anon-100
I am not sure of what your point is about the email to Chief Deane. Would you please clarify.
Maureen,
I am glad that you were able to get that cleared up. I find it easier to just get the answer straight out of the horses mouth. I have no doubt that HSM members can and do have conversations with out getting angry, etc. Just like with ANY group, you can’t always control the actions of others and unfortunately, the BAD actions are the ones that speak louder and ruin it for the whole group and why I remain solo 🙂
Mackie,
He has more class than that 🙂
Eric must have a weak bladder, then.
So the take-home here is that, in addition to kids, job, home maintenance and repair, and volunteer work, I am also charged with cleaning up my neighborhood, because I shouldn’t expect the Latino neighbors to take care of their own property.
I feel so much better now.
Clarification for you MH: the paper that was passed out last night at the screening made it seem like Hispanics are only victims of crime. I was pointing out that Hispanics also commit crimes. Two sides, remember? Oh and the email came from someone pretty high up in the police department.
Part of the conversation with Eric also involved the lie that was told, by someone, about Corey Stewart being at the 7-11 last Saturday. Eric said HE didn’t see Corey there.
Maureen,
What did he say when you asked him about putting your comments in the film?
Before this anti-bvbl-greg-hsm-corey blog fully morphs into the home improvement and neighborhood cleanup blog, can someone suggest how to deal with the group of men who leer at my teenaged daughter when she walks the dog? And, yes, we HAVE confronted them, and we HAVE called the police. But they still make it a point to come out and stare at her, to the point where I either have to go with her and tell them off or just walk the dog myself. Apparently, it’s cultural, and us racist white folk are just supposed to take it.
Emma,
It may be rude, but it’s not illegal. Remember, this is about the Rule of Law.
Jut, thanks for trying to help me interpret the posting earlier on. Yes, it’s amazing what’s posted on BVBL, including: “My local Wal-Mart(Liberia Ave.) is still a haven for some latino low-lifes who routinely leer and make comments to my wife and family. Mind you, this is always when I am not with them.”
Oh THAT’S not racist, eh? Insert the word “white trash” in there instead of “lowlife Hispanics” and see how many people would get their panties in a bunch.
I’ve seen plenty of groups of men of ANY ethnicity leer at women, hoot and hollar, whistle, and be total idiots. This is a gender issue, Emma. Some men are more prone to this behavior than others.
In some countries, I think outright staring at women or just another person isn’t as offensive as we find it here. There’s a different sense of personal space.
the “latino low-life” thing happens all the time, not racist at all but a simple statement of the truth. My 6 year old (yes, 6 years old) was leered out by hispanics on a brief stop getting some coffee and yes, I know spanish so I understood what they were saying perfectly. Sick, Sick individuals. Those people hanging out in front of 7-11 are no angels people, the large majority of them are pretty nasty people and quite dangerous. They are also experts at making you believe they are passive, get a nice group of them together and see what they will do. Individually they usually are fine since the latino machismo usually comes into play in groups of 3 or more, then they start getting tough. Ask any patrolman out there, they’ve seen all this before (With exception of elena’s patrolman who seems to drive around with blinders on or just plain blindfolded, if she is to be believed which I dont)
as for old eric??? he has about as much talent as a low-life porno director
“If you move into a neigborhood and crap all over it and flip off your neighbors, your neighbors will eventually fight back. And, predictably, the bad neighbors will then start whining about not feeling welcome.”
Emma, there are immigrant groups out there who openly acknowledge some of the problems you are referring to. And really, a lot of it is about attitude. Have you tried contacting an immigration organization, asking them to come out and talk to you community about what is bugging you so much? There MUST be a liason who will work with you and others on this kind of behavior that is so bothersome.
here’s a little story…awful lot of hispanic names in this bunch, seems as though they are not so angelic after all…just one of thousands of stories that could be picked out daily.
A month-long investigation into two house burglaries in Dumfries and Woodbridge led to the arrest of four Woodbridge men, said Officer Erika, Prince William police spokeswoman.
The Woodbridge burglary, in the 1800 block of Halifax Road, occurred on June 6. The burglary in the 15700 block of London Place in Dumfries occurred on June 25, Hernandez said.
Police said that video game systems, video games, video game accessories, jewelry, cameras, an iPod charger, a TV, sunglasses, and cash were among the items that were stolen
Wilmer Humberto Ortez, 18, of 14881 Enterprise Lane was arrested on July 3 and charged with two counts of statutory burglary, and two counts of grand larceny. Ortez is accused of breaking into the houses and stealing approximately $5,205 in property. He is being held without bond and is scheduled to appear in court on Aug. 5, Hernandez said.
Edward Steven Dell’Acqua, 20, of 1404 Illinois Court, was also arrested July 3 and charged with possession of stolen property. Dell’Acqua is accused of being in possession of some of the stolen property. He is scheduled to appera in court on Aug. 5, Hernandez said
Matthew Juan Gonzales, 18, of 14738 Tamarack Place, was arrested Saturday and charged with statutory burglary and grand larceny. Gonzales is accused of breaking into the Dumfries house. He was released in lieu of $2,000 bond and is scheduled to appear in court on Aug. 5, Hernandez said.
James Anthony Cox, 18, of 14413 Melbourne Avenue, was arrested on Friday and charged with statutory burglary and grand larceny. He is accused of the burglary at the home in Woodbridge and is scheduled to appear in court on Aug. 5, Hernandez said.
Elivs, crime is committed by all ethnic groups. And some of those names you think are Hispanic are not. People have argued using these stories before, so I’m not going to argue all over again about who does what crimes.
Elvis, if my 6 year old was getting leered at and having comments made to them that were that bad, I would have called the cops. That story seems a little odd to me and frankly, I’m not sure a blog is a good place to post such a thing. Just my opinion.
Emma, sometimes you’ve got to know when to fold ’em. If your neighborhood is unbearable and you’re unwilling to work with any group to improve it, there aren’t too many other alternatives. Don’t stick your hand in my pocketbook if you aren’t doing your share to work with your neighbors or, as KG said, an immigration organization that it willing to bridge some gaps in neighborhood communication/issues. When I’ve had neighborhood problems to solve, I’ve used the county services available. I didn’t race off and stick my fellow citizens with a resolution that does little but costs a lot in terms of other more important programs not being funded.
Ha ha. I saw that article in the paper and wondered which minion would be the first to post it.
kgotthardt, 11. July 2008, 20:41
Jut, thanks for trying to help me interpret the posting earlier on. Yes, it’s amazing what’s posted on BVBL, including: “My local Wal-Mart(Liberia Ave.) is still a haven for some latino low-lifes who routinely leer and make comments to my wife and family. Mind you, this is always when I am not with them.”
Oh THAT’S not racist, eh? Insert the word “white trash” in there instead of “lowlife Hispanics” and see how many people would get their panties in a bunch.
“White trash” isn’t racist?
“White Trash” IS racist if it is used to degrade someone.
If someone made that same statement using the word “white trash” as opposed to “lowlife Hispanics” you would hear people up in arms about racism. But because that statement was referring to “Hispanic lowlifes” it seems to be more acceptable to the BVBL/HSM crowd. NEITHER term is acceptable if it is used to denegrate someone else.
Elvis, should I say that the newest skinny on Alabama Republican Attorney General is just par for the course for the GOP? Closeted hypocrites?
Censored bybvbl, 11. July 2008, 21:14
Elvis, should I say that the newest skinny on Alabama Republican Attorney General is just par for the course for the GOP? Closeted hypocrites?
Indeed. He should switch parties. He’s be welcomed into the democratic fold.
Oops “democratic” should be “Democrat”.
Censored, I didn’t “race off and stick my fellow citizens with a resolution.” I don’t live in PWC, first of all. I always read on this blog how we should be looking at the human side of the illegal-immigration issue. Fair enough. But the only side that seems to get consideration are the illegal–or otherwise–immigrants. What about the human costs to those of us who live with the consequences of illegal immigration? People here talk about wanting “solutions” but it seems that the “problems” have to do with how to protect, provide for and enable illegal immigrants, and the “solutions” have to do with the rest of us having to do the legwork to deal with the extra problems they bring with them. It seems to me that the resolution was an effort by people who had simply had it with trying to do the things you suggest, thanks to the endless parade over the border. People saw the inaction of the federal government and started a grassroots effort to try to solve the problem at a local level. The alternative was to sit back and passively wait for the feds to take action. I’m pretty sure we’ll see the Second Coming before that happens.
Elvis, 11. July 2008, 20:52
here’s a little story…awful lot of hispanic names in this bunch, seems as though they are not so angelic after all…just one of thousands of stories that could be picked out daily.
Were you including Officer Hernandez in the group of not so angelic??? Or are there just bad apples in all groups of people and that is what you are pointing out?
Elvis,
You had a specific invitation on a previous thread to make contact through admin, regarding confirmation of my credibility. why not be brave enough to verify with the source what happend on my ride along and I don’t mean admin.
I’ve got one for you. Some have suggested here that as a solution we should hold employers accountable for hiring illegal workers. Many here have supported this with your posts. That’s fine, but few here have the unemotional capability of enforcing any solutions. Corey does, and that is why he is in the position of leadership. Here is an example that I defy you to enforce, because you don’t have what it takes to manage a community and make the tough decisions:
If you suggest fining US citizen employers, then what would you do to business owners who are themselves illegal? It seems to me you would reasonably apply even stiffer penalties. As I said, you don’t have the ability and never will enforce any solution, and here is the perfect example: None of you would bring TWINAD’s husband up on charges even though you suggested the penalties!
Elvis is a bigot. He defames the name of the King.
SegundoAlamo,
The economy is collapsing and you want to wage economic war upon those who create jobs? Are you nuts? No wonder everybody at the first alamo was wiped out…
I actually saw the real Elvis in concert just before he died. Truly the King…
Glad you decided to come back Emma 🙂
Mackie,
Hey, you just gave a prime example of how you would look the other way and not even enforce the rules that the members of this blog suggest. My point is that any discussion of solutions here is just a waste of time, as you seriously wouldn’t enforce them even if they were put into law.
I’m going to go tell you what I truly believe happened.
Prior to September 11th, the borders were wide open. Basically, walk across a highway and you were in. People did it frequently and we know of families that have had children on both sides.
Now, in the years following September 11th the border has become more fortified and thereby more dangerous to cross. And, in my estimation, less women have made the journey because of the new risks involved that weren’t there previously. But in addition to tightening our security measures, the feds lowered interest rates hoping that the construction industry could stimulate the economy and get us out of the downturn that we were facing. And in doing so, the construction industries flourished and we had jobs galore without increasing the number of legal unskilled workers that we would legally allow entry. And of course, construction jobs are typically filled by males. For me, this has all been the result of a lack of foresight on the part of the federal government. I honestly can’t lay the blame anywhere else. We have created this problem and need to accept responsibility for its existence. In my mind, if we had done things properly, we would have increased legal work visas that aligned with our economic plan but that didn’t happen and we now are witnessing a disproportionate number of males. And, I’m sorry and time you get a lot of young men living together and hanging out, there seems to be the normal shananigans that go along with that; a good example being frat houses.
Come on folks, who would be the first to agree that penalties should be leveled on TWINAD’s husband? I’m waiting………….just as I thought, none. You make suggestions, as long as people like Corey have to enforce them so you can sit back and complain. So once again, lets hear your solutions, or I can always repost them for you. In other words don’t suggest solutions if you’re not going to stand behind them!
Yep, haven’t you guys ever seen National Lampoons Animal House?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=09byrgGCZv0
Alanna,
Why is it that when you discuss the need for laborers you automatically assume they must come from outside the United States? You’re telling me we don’t have enough carpenters and brick layers to build a few thousand homes? I fault Adam and Eve for all of this for if they never got together none of this would have happened! (just borrowing some of your logic, sorry)