I understand that there are legal issues with this case. I know that many some will say “She got what she deserved, after all, she was in this country illegaly, and was given prior deportation notices.” To the men who have NO clue what childbirth entails, this was cruel and unusual punishment, her 8th amendment rights were violated in my mind. No woman, in the midst of labor, is going to be a flight risk out of a hospital. Furthermore, she was kept chained AFTER she gave birth, for six hours, and was denied her G-d given right to breastfeed her newborn. I am sickend and appalled by this case.
p.s. hyperlink located on the word “case”, click on it and it leads you to the video
The process of birth is a sacred , and that this woman was chained like an animal, is beyond my understanding. Birth is a very unique biological process, that only women will ever understand. Your body tells you the positions that are most condusive to birthing your baby, positions that minimize pain, and this woman was denied that very basic right. She wasn’t an ax murderer for G-d’s sake!
That this happened in the 21st century in the United States of America is appalling.
Wjat’s happened to the American values that the world respected…
In Africa rebels hack the hands or arms off of innocent children just because they are from another region. The world is unfortunately full of acts that are barbaric, and this pales by comparison even though I don’t agree with it. Ever think of the fact that most countries at times take healthy young men, give them weapons, and then send them off to be killed or maimed? It’s a necessary evil that protects the defenseless ones who remain behind, and I suspect this was done for protection purposes also. There are a ton of potential weapons in a hospital setting that could make for a bad situation.
Read the story. They uncuffed her. Her supporters think the main outrage is that she was taken in at all rather than let go.
Now we have another “anchor baby” and one whose mother is a lawbreaker with a sense of entitlement from being Latino.
I’m pretty sure that is the main driver here, Rick, and that was the point in posting this in the first place, but….
…having given birth a few times myself, I cannot imagine being handcuffed up until 2 hours before giving birth. There comes a point during transitional labor that you are almost literally climbing the walls. That was stupid and inhumane, at the very least, for the jailers not to give her the freedom to move around and use her hands. I think in this case you have to have experienced labor to know what I’m talking about.
SA
Many share your thoughts about what goes on in the world, many as my ultra conservative friend says “hold my nose and shop at WalMart” and she admits she tries not to think about the 8 year old slave labor that helps provide her, a rather independently wealthy person, save $.80. She loves keeping that $.80. I would not say she worked hard to earn it either. A popular comment of hers is “well, I can’t do anything about it…..”. She is a fanatical churchgoer and very proud of the image she casts as an ultra conservative Republican Catholic. I think the image she hopes to project outweighs any deep rooted beliefs. 🙂 But she is a good person in many other ways. Many share your sentiment and are good people.
I can’t do that. I can’t control the world, but I can control my participation in it. I have been taught that is a personal responsibility. So, I will continue to speak up, vote accordingly and as it appears my values are in the minority when it comes to illegal aliens, at least I am satisfied with what I did or didn’t do. Think that’s what it comes down to at the end. Never been to the end (!), but based on comments from elderly relatives, that is what they say.
So we disagree, it’s not the end of the world, but I think your approach is going to override…. Mr. S will prevail because it appears to be working as he reminds us. Many won’t care how, just that it is or appears to be and they can go on with their day.
“Many share your thoughts about what goes on in the world, many as my ultra conservative friend says “hold my nose and shop at WalMart” and she admits she tries not to think about the 8 year old slave labor that helps provide her, a rather independently wealthy person, save $.80. She loves keeping that $.80. I would not say she worked hard to earn it either.”
Kinda reminds me of some regular posters on this blog living in their segregated communities in Haymarket. The world is full of hypocrits.
I don’t feel sorry for her. She was here for 12 years illegally. She made a joke of our legal system. And her lawyer wants to continue to do so. She wasn’t tortured. She was taken to a hospital. She was treated quite humanely as far as I can see. Seems to me childbirth is torturous whether or not your hands are free (and her hands were free for 8 hours in the middle of it).
Do any of you ever ask questions like “If she had 4 kids and was here illegally, why was she having another?” Isn’t that irresponsible? Or am I being too judgemental and culturally biased on that point.
Bad things happen in jail and in detention. But nothing much happened to this woman. As to the general principle of not being especially nice to detainees, I support it and would like to see them all trteated harshly and rudely, so when they go home they will communicate to their countrymen/women that they’re not really wanted here.
This is shameful treatment–I worked as a nurse for many years, and on the occasion when convicted prisoners had to be hospitalized, they were not treated like this. They had armed guards at the bedside and outside their hospital room doors, and nurses were escorted in and out for their safety. Keep in mind, in some cases, these were convicted, violent offenders–very bad people. But they were never cuffed to a bed. In fact, in most states, this kind of restraining is illegal.
Regardless of what a person has done, it does not justify violating their right to humane treatment. If this is what America has become, it is a shameful disgrace. -SC
America has become shameful and disgraceful because we allow the wealthy to circumvent rule of law, resulting in increased poverty and increased lawlessness and increased disparity of wealth, and lower wages, and we collectively are lazy enough to accept this.
We have two sets of rules in America, one for people who speak English and one for people who speak Spanish, and that is truly a disgraceful state to have evolved to.
I must have missed the article, does someone have a link to it?
There is a hyperlink on the word “case”. It will lead you to the article.
Yes, Rick, lets communicate to the rest of the world how inhumane we can be to women in birth. Great strategy.
SA,
How do the atrocities of other countries excuse our behavior as Americans?
Mando
Agree, but as you see from some posters, they are not interested in how they (illegals) are treated, they just want them gone. This attitude is one of the few that I believe does transcend economics……and is, unfortunately fast becoming the majority.
However, I doubt you will find a woman on either side of the arguement that would agree with:
” She wasn’t tortured. She was taken to a hospital. She was treated quite humanely as far as I can see. Seems to me childbirth is torturous whether or not your hands are free (and her hands were free for 8 hours in the middle of it).”
This man does not even accord women posters the respect of being more expert on the pain associated with childbirth and I deduce that he thinks 8 hours of her hands being free is sufficient. Or he thinks that people different from us don’t hurt like us. He is just one of those that want the problem removed from there sight and does not care how it’s done.
OMG – such horrible spelling and grammer……
Mando,
What is your point about people who live in haymarket? Are we not allowed to feel empathy for our fellow human beings? That IS the point of the story in case you missed it.
Absolutely disgusting.
I’ve had a whole week of thinking, “Why have we not yet evolved as a race? WHY? WHY do we treat each other like this? Is legal status any excuse to treat human beings as less than human beings, as less than living beings?” It started with viewing the Civil War video at Manassas Battlefield on Monday. I think it needs a “sensitive viewer” warning.
My fish died. He was four years old. He lived a long life. We planted him with flowers. My husband says, “He will make a beautiful flower.” We are all connected and how we treat the living and the dying makes a difference. When will we learn that we reap what we sow? When?
Elena, the green-eyed monster appears to be alive, well, and hiding among the BVBL posters. Haha. I guess they prefer a more socialist distribution of wealth…as though that equal distribution ever truly existed in socialist countries!
I would think the jail personnel could have shown a bit of discretion in their treatment of this woman. I wonder if any other “prisoner” who had a medical emergency or pre-existing medical problem would have been treated this way.
KG – “One” by Bono.
KG wrote – We are all connected and how we treat the living and the dying makes a difference. When will we learn that we reap what we sow? When?
“This man does not even accord women posters the respect of being more expert on the pain associated with childbirth ”
Oh goodness
“and I deduce that he thinks 8 hours of her hands being free is sufficient.”
Apparently it was.
“Or he thinks that people different from us don’t hurt like us. He is just one of those that want the problem removed from there sight and does not care how it’s done.”
Within limits. This is well within those limits.
I submit to you that your concern for the overwhelming inhumanity of it all is part of the reason women like this one have so many kids – because after all you’ll always be willing to help her foot the bill – and risk staying here illegally all, this time while having kids – because after all nothing really traumatic like having her hands tied could ever happen if it makes her feel bad.
“Mando,
What is your point about people who live in haymarket? Are we not allowed to feel empathy for our fellow human beings? That IS the point of the story in case you missed it.”
Your empathy is selective to what furthers your agenda. Hypocracy. That’s my point.
“Elena, the green-eyed monster appears to be alive, well, and hiding among the BVBL posters. Haha. I guess they prefer a more socialist distribution of wealth…as though that equal distribution ever truly existed in socialist countries!”
Socialist??? I’m all about capitalism. What keeps me in my neighborhood isn’t the lack of means to get out. I could flee to Haymarket and climb on that soapbox. I’m just not like that. I have freinds and family in my neighborhood. I couldn’t live with myself if I packed up and fled to a segregated community.
Shall I provoke you more and tell you some things that would not bother me if done systematically to each and every illegal alien before deportation :
Waterboarding
Stacking them into naked pyramids and jumping on top
Slapping them in the face
Branding them with irons for ease of future identification
Not because I’m sadistic. Simply because we are either overly welcoming (the current situation) or we are not. We collectively need to go one way or the other.
Things I wouldn’t be comfortable with :
genocide, serious physical abuse, rape
Things I would be :
mental torture (limited, not continuous), some slapping and pushing, branding or tatooing, tying their hands down as long as 2 hours before childbirth
Elena – I think he was responding to my post. The topic is horrible, however, the majority of people don’t want to know about it or be told. Why? Because they want the illegals to go away and they don’t want to know how it’s done or what happens. That is what Mr. S is banking on and winning on.
My point was this attitude crosses economic divides. The wealthy are snotty and cavalier about it and the not wealthy are angry.
Rick – did I read that correctly? You are okay if we tie down women’s hand two hours before birth? Do you mean beginning of labor or actual birth? Do you mean to include transition or exclude that?
Or, as it appears, you really don’t give a rats a#@?
Rick,
I feel sorry for you, all that hate makes you unable to empathize. I hope I never get to such a dark place.
Elena – He never experienced birth. It’s immaterial to him. That is the nature of many as I am finding. There will be alot of elbow room in heaven!!! 🙂
PS – don’t feel sorry. That is a choice he has made. Free will and all……
How is my empathy selective Mando? I have empathy for communities that are struggling with many neighborhood issues, but I can also have empathy for people struggling and working to live in a country that allows us all to create our own destiny. The issue is that this woman was treated like an animal, and no matter what LABEL you are given by a man made system, you are STILL a human being. NOW, do you think you could actually comment on the topic and not me.
” Stacking them into naked pyramids ” I know we are not supposed to bring up Hitler, but can we say Hermann Goering?
Juturna, that’s exactly what I thought having watched “Night and Fog” this week.
This is all choice. All of it.
Censored – not to mitigate your comment, but I didn’t need to have recent reminders for that one to jump out at me. But, I have been worried about heaven getting too crowded. These blogs are easing my worries some.
Do you know the story of the long handled spoon and heaven and hell?
Rick Bentley Shanda Zim Goyim!
Who is Rick Bentley?
In my opinion your own birth was a waste Rick…
Now, remember, he does make me feel better about heaven so……. and it’s all about me!
“I hope I never get to such a dark place.” I’ll bet a lot more people would if they lived through what I did in my neighborhood. Maybe you wouldn’t. But a lot more people would.
I can empathize. It doesn’t rob me of my ability to think rationally though. Half of
exico is interested in coming here and 15% is here already. If we had done that Amnesty in 2007, there’d be 50 million more here.
“” Stacking them into naked pyramids ” I know we are not supposed to bring up Hitler, but can we say Hermann Goering? ” That’s been done more recently than Nazi Germany.
She should not have been in this country in the first place. It is all her fault for putting herself in this postion. She made the choice to sneak in our country illegally.
Wouldn’t it be great Rod if all of us that has a bad experience or disaster in life could take it out on some strangers so we would feel better???? Or are the rest of us just supposed to let these folks get away with parking in the fire lane, or entitlements, bad grades/performance in schools just becuase they’ve had a bad experience or their Mommy’s didn’t teach them any better.
Yup, Rick Bentley doesn’t look much different to me than those po’ folks we are supposed to medicalize or socialize their bad behavior. Give Al Sharpton a call, Rick, he is on your side, man.
Who is Rick Bentley?
Someone who died a long time ago, there is nothing left to control his existance but blind hatred, to Rick, G-D is dead.
Who is Rick Bently?
Rick Bently is now Al Sharptons newest fan. Al, takes care of the disenfranchised and makes them feel better by helping them lash out against all wrongs committed against them and helps them justify it.
Rick thinks living in a bad neighborhood is the same as being tied down and/or tortured.
The difference is he can MOVE.
It’s pretty hard to move or give birth when one is tied down.
Clearly, Rick has big problems, one of them being he is a misogynist.
“Wouldn’t it be great Rod if all of us that has a bad experience or disaster in life could take it out on some strangers so we would feel better???? ”
I don’t know Rick, don’t really want to either, but I know from life experience that you can transform collective rage into productive energy.
With Rick’s thoughts on how much non-Americans are worth, i’d say it won’t be long before his collective hate breaks him.
Rick, yes, it’s been done more recently…by us (er…by the US). Fernando Botero showed us Abu Ghraib.
Rick,
I feel so sorry for you. I also feel sorry for people in your life (loved ones, those your work with, strangers you encounter) if this is your attitude. Your seemingly gleeful willingness to use this as provocation of posters on this site and your list of horrible things you would be OK with in deportation efforts is very telling…it reflects a level of dehumanization of others that is potentially dangerous.
You seem to have some wounds that run pretty deeply, Rick. My hope is that you will have some kind, compassionate, loving people come into your life, so that you can heal and move into a more positive direction. I don’t want you to wake up every day afraid of the world and angry against it. That’s no way to live.
Rick – don’t blame your bad manners on living in a bad neighborhood. I live smack dab in the middle of Point of Woods and don’t have such a rotten attitude towards my fellow man. There’s no excuse for supporting those sorts of torture (and yes, waterboarding is torture).
“A spokeswoman for the sheriff confirmed Juana Villegas was deported and ordered to leave the country in 1996. So, in the eyes of jail staffers, Villegas was a “medium security” inmate, which required the inmate to be restrained in some way even if she was nine months pregnant.”
This is why she was detained – not because she was Hispanic, but because she had already been deported and returned. Was the treatment of her wrong – absolutely. Thankfully my first labor was only 4 hours, so I didn’t have to go through agony long.
I have to laugh at how upset some of you got by what I posted … I’ve been behaving pretty well here, I’m usually MUCH more abrasive.
Off now to live my miserable life and smack a few stray dogs with baseball bats …
Caio…. did you give Al a call yet?