According to the Washington Post,
Prince William, a Year Later
A crackdown’s toxic effectsONE YEAR after Prince William County launched its drive to hound, harass and humiliate illegal immigrants, the toxic effects of the policy — on the county’s reputation, social cohesion, political discourse and neighbors — are increasingly clear.
Across the nation, Prince William has become synonymous with an ugly strain of nativist intolerance that has deep roots in American history but which is a slander on the county’s generally well-educated and diverse population. In this region, almost every other major jurisdiction has spurned Prince William’s approach.
Minorities account for almost half of Prince William’s 370,000 people, and a large slice of that population — around 20 percent — is Hispanic. Most of them are legal residents, but many also have ties of kinship, friendship or employment with others who are undocumented. Many say they have been made to feel unwelcome in Prince William. This year, several dozen religious leaders in the county wrote to local elected officials, warning them of the divisive consequences of the county’s venomous campaign.
Predictably, they got the brushoff from Corey A. Stewart (R-At Large), chairman of the Board of County Supervisors, who has done more than anyone else to plant seeds of discord and hatred in the county. Mr. Stewart is an avid opportunist and manipulator who has an arm’s-length relationship with public candor. Not long ago, he said that a plan to install cameras in police cars — a precondition for his preferred policy of allowing officers to ask suspects about their immigration status almost at will before arrest — would be dropped “over my dead body”; then he dropped it. Lately, he has tried to link a decline in crime to the harsh policies he has advocated. Trouble is, much of the drop is attributable to a fall in robberies that predates the crackdown on illegal immigrants and that probably stemmed from an aggressive anti-robbery campaign by the police.
So what has the county achieved with its effort to intimidate undocumented newcomers by ordering checks on the immigration status of all detainees after arrest and by denying certain social services to illegal immigrants? Without doubt, it has prompted hundreds of Hispanics — legal and illegal — to depart the county. Many of them have moved to surrounding jurisdictions, where they are enrolling in public schools and turning to local government services or nonprofits for help. To Mr. Stewart and his allies, this beggar-thy-neighbor policy is a success. In fact, it has simply branded Prince William as the one locality in the Washington area where demagoguery by elected officials has gotten the better of coolheaded public deliberation.
Just got back from the BOCS meeting. Only three citizens speaking! Wow.
I kind of liked the room they used. It’s in the Service Authority building–all light wood. Not half as foreboding or dark as the regular chambers. It was still crowded, though.
Here’s a good series of debates where Geraldo eviscerates that schmuckboy joey vento.
Ayyye, Yo Adrian!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mkqSvyLRsfo
Mando, some of us would like to be proud of where we live, not embarassed with the stigma of being back-woods bigots (which is the name we have earned for ourselves).
As far as how the rest of the region views it? Reading the comments section in response to the Washington Post editorial – it would seem there are more comments against the editorial than for it. Admittedly, that is not a scientific sample, but it is an interesting discussion going on over there in response to the editorial. It would definitely be a stretch to say the rest of the region wholeheartedly agrees with that editorial.
Not to rehash that old argument, but PWC has ALWAYS had that stigma. You’re way late in this game.
“Back-woods bigots” – more like the name some of you have painted on yourselves.
In terms of high end retail following the money, we have or had one of the highest income earning Counties in the Country, but all we have spawned is an increasing amount of residential development which has not been a wise way to plan our communities. The fault for these failures falls squarely on our elected officials.
The WP comments don’t represent any majority or minority. They represent mostly people who rant on the WP. I post there all the time, but I hardly think it matters in the long run because there is so much crap posted there. It’s almost impossible to sort through most of the crap to get to some actual thought!
High end retail and businesses have spurned the county long before the resolution was even thought of – that has been a problem for years and years – it is nothing new as a result of the resolution.
“Not to rehash that old argument, but PWC has ALWAYS had that stigma.” Back-woods, yes, but bigots, no. At least, I’ve never thought of the county in that way.
I don’t mind back-woods. But I do mind bigotry.
“In terms of high end retail following the money, we have or had one of the highest income earning Counties in the Country, but all we have spawned is an increasing amount of residential development which has not been a wise way to plan our communities. The fault for these failures falls squarely on our elected officials.”
Been in the Gainesville area lately? How about down Liberia in Manassas towards the PWC parkway?
“I don’t mind back-woods. But I do mind bigotry.”
Unfortunately, stereotyping is a relished passtime of some. See article above.
An Observer, the response section to WaPo articles on immigration only drives home the point that PWC residents are a bunch of uncouth, name-calling (haha…I get the irony), angry bigots. A year ago the responses were rather unemotional, even-handed. Now it’s as though all the rational thought is gone and vitriol and party (FAIR) talking points rule. It’s become such a cess-pool that I asked the editor to consider the response section to immigration articles for further study…and articles.
Mando,
Let’s just take a look at Gainesville, Route 29 has been 2 lanes in each direction for as as I can remember, and I’ve lived in the area since 1976. Look at all the development in Fauquier County and Linton Hall which allowed huge developments without requiring adequate infrastructure to be developed.
If you’re suggesting another retail development establishment qualifies as a business, if so, I would hope that we(PWC) could attract corporations instead of forcing residents to commute hours on ends to points east of us.
Censored: How do you even know that the responses to the article are from PWC residents? I would say the responses are probably from all over the DC area – so in that case what you say would be for the DC area, not just PWC.
Alanna – definitely agree that what PWC needs are corporations to move in here – not more retail which there seems to be plenty of. If some of the corporations that occupy office buildings in Fairfax County would move to PWC, that would help tax revenue as well as provide jobs that wouldn’t be such a long commute. Unfortunately, for years PWC has been hoping to attract that kind of business and has not been successful. The Innovation@Prince William area was only a partial success, there is still a lot of land out there that has not been leased. We need a lot more of that kind of industry.
PWC has always been marketed as and has always been a bedroom community for commuters. What you’re asking for is a total economic shift. This has nothing to do with the resolution and perceptions and everything to do with tax incentives and economic planning.
Why are we confusing the two?
An observer, there probably are a lot of responses from outside the county, but some of the same names appear in local letters to the editor at MJM and some have posted for a year or so on the WaPo website and claimed to be PWC residents. I think the arguments have gotten angrier as they’ve lost ground – perhaps personally as well as in changes made to the immigration resolution. And, of course, neither presidential candidate will appeal to most of those posters so they’re frustrated. But the responses do make the residents here look like a bunch of loons and reinforce the editor’s comments – if only in displaying the divisiveness and hatred in the community.
When I asked the editor about doing an article about the response section, I asked if it were possible to tease out the residents and individuals from any mass-mailing response. I haven’t heard anything and don’t know whether I will hear anything. It interested me.
The irony is, if the comments were reversed this would be a crystal clear indication that PWC residents are against the actions of the BOCS.
Spin is a funny thing it is.
Mando, we can’t draw any real conclusions from the WaPa responses as to residence – other than for a few people. However, the anger and vitriol are there for anyone to see. The BOCS meeting (last October) was the nearest thing we have to the consensus of the population. They signed in and gave their addresses. HSM and co-horts were outnumbered.
Turn PWBlue,
Nice to see you again. And I couldn’t agree more with your comment.
287g has more teeth than the resolution.
dont think the resolution is anything more than a scare tactic, however the 287G is actually quite a nice program.
dont know what wapo really is getting out, if the illegals are scared to live here then so be it, they should be scared to live ANYWHERE.
“Alanna – definitely agree that what PWC needs are corporations to move in here – not more retail which there seems to be plenty of.”
YES! And make them PRETTY. But they won’t come here if they think it will be impossible to enforce EEO and non-discrimination policy in their corporations–not with the rap we are getting as a bunch of white-hooded-crazies!
Just some news from a city that once embraced undocumented persons and scorned the acts of PWC:
FAIRFAX, Va. — Fairfax County supervisors are considering criminalizing some zoning violations, meaning landlords who operate illegal boarding houses could go to jail.
The proposal would turn what would normally be a civil penalty into a criminal one, if the civil fines for the violation are worth at least $5,000. Supervisor Jeff McKay said it would be up to the judge hearing the case to decide whether the offense deserves jail time.
http://www.nbc4.com/news/16954858/detail.html?dl=headlineclick
Is the former sanctuary County of Fairfax turning racist?
HSM was outnumbered at the BOCS meeting because they have jobs and couldn’t stay up for the circus no matter how entertaining. Especially that part at the end where the interpreter flipped out. I recorded most of the meeting just for historical purposes. I figured a couple bucks worth of DVD’s would be well worth the ability to show anyone just how badly the county’s situation had gotten. Hopefully we won’t see one of those any more, unless of course it’s from within the Fairfax BOCS meeting chambers!
By the way the 19:08 post was copied from someone else’s and I posted it here FYI.
SA,
I’d personally prefer this approach over what we adopted.
I will say there still seems to be confusion over the new revised version of the resolution especially given the spin from Stewart. If I remember correctly, the spin started from the Chairman’s seat immediately prior to the passage of the revised resolution when he claimed it would result in increased checks.
I can’t believe the Hate Bunnies are on here now celebrating the fact that the Immigration Resolution was neutered and diminished to the point that one could compare it to what we had BEFORE July 10th, which was 287g in the jails only.
There is a difference, but you’d have to be interested in reality to have the patience for that, so stop reading now if you are a Hate Bunny or an Anti-Immigrant Lobby clone.
287g, which we had BEFORE our year of hate-mongering and political opportunism that earned this unfair reputation sited in the Post editorial, was recommended by our Police Chief as the best way to deal with “the worst of the worst” … that is illegal aliens who commit crimes (that is actual crimes not anti-immigrant hysteria “crimes”). 287g was sufficient for this because immigration checks were done on anyone who was incarcerated, and certainly those whom we can prove beyond a reasonable doubt is a criminal are going to match up well with those who commit crimes.
During the first four months our year of hate-mongering and political opportunism, we went from checking everyone the police comes into contact with, to checking only those they come into contact with AND have “probable cause” to think might be undocumented.
This goes WAY further than 287g, Hate Bunnies, and this is what earned us the reputation we have today.
In 2008, however, we scaled back the Resolution so that only those who are arrested will be checked for immigration violations. This is similar to 287g in that you have to have committed a real crime (not an anti-immigrant lobby hysterics crime) in order to have your status checked. It is also a heck of a lot fair because anyone who is arrested will be checked regardless of skin color or language proficiency (the general order listed language proficiency as a factor, but not skin color to be fair).
It is not accurate to say it is THE SAME as 287g because not everyone who is arrested ends up in jail. About half of the people our county arrests are released on bail. So, we are checking more people. And we are checking the right people, in general, since we are limiting the checks to people who have most likely committed a crime as opposed to people who look like they might be undocumented (which was unconstitutional and immoral in my opinion).
By the way, if the Post wanted to single out Corey Stewart as the primary reason our economy and our reputation have been destroyed by the Anti-Immigrant Lobby’s immoral agenda, all they had to do was say “go see the screening Friday at Trinity.” The things Corey says and does IN PUBLIC in that film are even more damning than any criticism, however accurate, printed on a page.
Screening info:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FQeLms84uXg
Hate Bunnies, go and dare to experience this debate beyond ignorance and indoctrination. As I’ve said, the damning words come from the Chairman himself.
I’d disagree. The spin started at least the week prior to the revision when Chairman Stewart went on NewsChannel 4 claiming he had the votes to ‘strengthen’ it. What I don’t completely understand is the part about the police chief in his news conference explaining the changes. I have only heard about it second-hand and was wondering will the video ever be on the internet or do we have to go to a special screening?
WHWN,
What is it exactly that makes illegal immigration so appealing to you? Are you a frustrated illegal yourself? Do you live in a trailer park, and don’t get what the big deal is? I only wish the people who are trashing the neighborhoods were white, then we could take care of business without all this bleeding heart stuff. I guarantee you would never see a large group of white men loitering at a 7-11 for long before the police would be involved. Come to think of it, what is the legal meaning of loitering anyway? I’m sure you’ll enlighten me.
So, if you live in a trailer park you don’t get the problem or if you live in Haymarket, you don’t get the problem. Any place else?
Any place ‘you don’t get the problem’!
Suzie if you’re reading this, SecondAlamo’s post above is another example of creating a “scarecrow” that is easy to tear apart when one is unable to come up with a salient argument that addresses the substance of a post. When it comes to debate skills, the Anti-Immigrant Lobby is basically a two-trick pony.
1) Conform the other person’s argument so that it fits with in the narrow confines of their preconceived and dutifully memorized talking points
2) Attack the messenger by finding some tangential part of their argument to feign outrage about, but avoid addressing the substance of any argument to which you have no answer.
Actually, I take it back. SecondAlamo didn’t muster a good example of this rhetorical last resort. But if I’m reading it right, it is an example, and a typical one.
WHWN,
What is it exactly that makes illegal immigration so appealing to you? Why can’t you answer a valid question? Try stepping down off the soap box, and ask yourself what is it that you stand for in regards to illegal immigration.
If you owned a business where people had to pay a fee such as a movie theater, and people came and watched the movie without paying the fee you’d be outraged, and legally so. That’s how I feel when people come into this country without ‘paying the fee’ so to speak. This country is also a business enterprise that has been paid for by generations of tax paying citizens. Some with their lives, and no one from any other country has a ‘right’ to come here illegally, period!
Just as I thought, no reply from WHWN. I’m hitting the sack so I can get up for work tomorrow and earn enough money to pay my taxes to help support even those here illegally. Only in America!
SecondAlamo, I stopped reading and started skimming when you introduced your “argument” with a false premise.
I don’t know anyone who finds illegal immigration appealing and neither do you.
The remainder of your post was also intellectually dishonest. I did respond, but only to point that out.
SA,
Please expain this statement by you:
“HSM was outnumbered at the BOCS meeting because they have jobs and couldn’t stay up for the circus no matter how entertaining”
I am wondering, exactly who were the people that did not have jobs?
Mackie,
Have you seen another favorite of mine with bill o’reily and Geraldo?!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=01uMNSYhq-Y
SA, I don’t personally know anyone who thinks illegal immigration is appealing. Most of the people I associate with feel this county took an experiement, spearheaded by an outside group, and ran with it without citizen input.
Many of us are outraged and will continue to fight the forces of darkness. Illegal immigration is just the carrier. Abusive government is actually the issue. Much of this issue is really about power and control by a few, at the expense of many.
I could have lived without citizen input if they had just done their homework and researched the whole thing first. Why in God’s name did they trust Robert “Duecaster” Disaster, Gospel Greg Letiecq, and that guy from F.A.I.R. more than they trusted Chief Deane????
I can live with the fact that they thought automated faxes, plus automated emails, plus real emails added up to more citizen support for Help Save Manassas than the rest of the county.
Democracy is not a perfect system. It can be gamed, particularly when it comes to public opinion. The Iraq War should have taught us that.
But elected officials are expected to do more than just bend to the will of the most motivated and most vocal minority to ambush their chamber. They have to weigh that, and use their best judgment to do what’s best for the county, even if it isn’t exactly what Robert “Disaster” Duecaster screamed at them about at Citizens’ Time.
Eventually, they did just that. Perhaps not until more responsible citizens got organized (starting with this blog). That’s how democracy works. If you don’t get involved, you might be forced to live in a Duecaster Disaster for a year. That’s the lesson we have to take away from all of this.
The Supervisors learned another lesson. Lead, don’t follow. Even if they scream. Lead, don’t follow. Even if the emails pile up. Lead, don’t follow.
In a moment of sheer optimism and hope…I choose to post this music video by Terra Naomi:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9qo8-NlgRa4
Elena,
I always saw Geraldo as a tabloid journalist and I suppose he is but on this issue he has really surprised me with his passionate defense of immigrants. He’s well informed and cool under fire. I can’t believe it but I find myself cheering for Geraldo.
Elena,
That Geraldo video was great! I expect to hear that Bill O’Reilly will do a lot of future coverage of all drunk driving incidents in the state of Virginia, being the wonderful advocate for victims that he is…or maybe I’m asking too much.
Beautiful video Diversity Gal!
You know Mackie, Geraldo wasn’t always tabloid. He first became famous(1970’s) for breaking a story about a mental health institution that was horribly abusing their wards. It was an amazing gutsy story!
Elena,
I didn’t know that about Geraldo’s start. That’s very interesting.
O’Reilly is such a tool. When he has an intelligent guest who doesn’t back down, his moral cowardice is obvious.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=evjgGQJZShA
Mackie,
Very moving and powerful video…thanks for posting it. Go Phil Donahue!
WHWN said:
“But elected officials are expected to do more than just bend to the will of the most motivated and most vocal minority to ambush their chamber. They have to weigh that, and use their best judgment to do what’s best for the county….”
That is the exact statement I wish I had made about what took place at the BOCS meeting. It was a well orchestrated effort by MWB to get all those who needed an interpreter to come to the meeting to tell their tale of woe. If the BOCS didn’t give as much weight to their argument it was because the BOCS knew they where the very same people whose presence the county’s legal citizens were objecting to. You see it was well known that the numbers of people that appear before the BOCS don’t reflect the majority in terms of representative numbers. Obviously the non English speakers are a minority in PWC. That can’t be argued by anyone. Don’t forget the marches and caravan that took place before the meeting. It was as if a group of people walked into your place of business uninvited, and then started telling you how to run it because it was their ‘right’. Not so!
“Mr. Stewart is an avid opportunist and manipulator who has an arm’s-length relationship with public candor”
if this isn’t the most perfect description….
“elected officials are expected to do more than just bend to the will of the most motivated and most vocal minority ”
If you add ‘most well-funded’, it is precisely – PRECISELY – what PW BOCS does. Time and time again, on nearly every issue. Check out what they’re doing with commercial development. Wally Covington wouldn’t know how to put his pants on if Mike Garcia and Barry Braden didn’t tell him how. And you know he took his lesson from Corey, who wouldn’t know how to put on his white sheet if Greg Letiecq wasn’t there to help him with the hood.