Thanks to Poor Richard for pointing this one out.
Apparently, the sign has come down just in time for Mr. Fernandez’s court appearance today.
Facing a Court Hearing, Man Begins Removing Pro-Immigrant Billboard
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/09/04/AR2008090403620.html
This is a metaphor for the whole illegal immigration phenomenon. In time, most aliens will self-deport when we maintain rule of law and politicians stop holding out the Amnesty option.
I’ve never said that it can’t be done. What I question are the costs and benefits. I think what most people are missing is that probably a majority of the people that are here probably will have grounds to return. So, what do we get out of this? I’m sure you’ll say something like the rule of law will be maintained. okay but obviously if we just enforce it then it works, so you make Twindad’s husband leave so that he can return? Stupid policy.
Also, when is someone going to fix the problem that it takes 5-15 years to process someone’s paperwork? or the problem with having sufficient labor? or the host of other non-enforcement issues that have driven this problem in the first place? if those underlying problems aren’t resolved then we’re still suffering.
The man made his point and then moved on.
I can’t wait to drive down Liberty Street as I do every Friday, and see the sign gone. I hope this means the reamining wall of the house will finally be taken down too.
Yes, the point needed to be made, and it was made courageously. Neither our laws nor our police force should be abused by an angry mob to target or intimidate those they feel are not welcome and not entitled to equal protection under that law. What happened here in 2007 was un-American, and the sign reminded us of that.
However, the sign should have come down on April 30, 2008. The day after the Immigration Resolution was neutered.
The sign never bothered me. It was an example of our 1st Amendment rights. Only in the US do we have such a liberty. Fitting that the sign was on the corner of Liberty St.
I did think at some point the sign needed to come down, not because it bothered me, or because of its message but because it continued to fan the flames of the HSM group and allowed them to continue to spew their hate.
Marie,
The freedom of speech was not the violation or problem for me. It’s the zoning laws that have been violated. The remaining wall of must now come down too.
The sign was a zoning violation. Rules that we, as a society, all have to follow. There are other legal methods to use his 1st Amendment rights to get his message across.
Marie, if Mr. Ferndandez had built a 12′ x 40′ sign advertising cars for sale in the same location, would you be ok with that? Its the zoning laws that apply, regardless of the messages. He should have followed the laws like everyone else.
I agree the sign should have come down after the April 29th “snip-snip.” But by that point I’m sure Mr. Fernandez just wanted to resist the powers that be as long as he could.
If you look at legal history around the States, the majority has always tried to use the law to oppress minorities. Not far from that wall there is a courthouse that still has two mens rooms and two ladies rooms. Can anyone guess why?
We have to let go of the idea that “the law” belongs to only one class of people, and not to the rest of us. On this front, I think we are making progress as a nation, and of that I am proud and thankful. Mr. Fernandez’ decision to exercise free speech helped us all find our voices, and helped us make progress in PWC.
I also agree that the sign allowed Gospel Greg and his HSM clones to have something visible to hate and make themselves angry about. But if you haven’t noticed, they tend to find SOMETHING to hate and make themselves angry about, every day of their lives, bless their souls. Mexican Americans and other people of color didn’t have a voice in this matter until the sign went up. And even though it’s down now, we’ll remember it as a symbol of all those who stood up to injustace, in this cause and in others.
Sorry, didn’t mean to imply that only people of color were offended by the Duecaster Disaster (Immigration Resolution).
Lucky, If Mr. Ferndandez had built a 12′ x 40′ sign advertising cars for sale in the same location, it would be ok with me if the property were zoned commercial and the land use permitted it.
Here is the sticky wicket about the sign which may or may not be intrepreted as a zoning violation.
The City of Manassas Zoning Ordinance
Section 130-127 – Signs Not Requiring a Permit
#11 Political signs on private property
I assume this is why Mr. Fernandez felt it was in his rights to display the sign. Maybe the ordinance needs to be amended. I believe this ordinance was last updated in 2003.
“This is a metaphor for the whole illegal immigration phenomenon.”
How true and not only in its demise.
I think Mr. Fernandez’s actions of removing the sign the day before his court date gives you an indication of which way he (or his attorney) felt the law applied to his sign.
Lucky Duck,
I agree. The timing is everything. 😉
Talk about waiting ’til the eleventh hour.
Good ridence to the sign. I hope we don’t have to continue to look at the remaining wall of the house for another year.
Marie,
The sign was attached to a wall of a building that had a demolition permit. The demolition of the house was never completed, and that’s a direct violation of the demolition order/permit. That still needs to be addressed.
So, all this time the problem wasn’t with the sign itself but with the structure it was attached to? Wouldn’t know it from the HSM clones behavior, comparing this to illegal immigration and all.
This is a poor metaphor for illegal immigration in my view, since the Fernandez family are AMERICAN CITIZENS and the only connection people draw to immigration at all is due to their ethnicity.
If a white person had put up the sign, would this be a “metaphor” for immigration?
Doubt it.
But if a white person or a black person put it up, it would still be a zoning violation and they would be subjected to the same law as Mr. Fernandez. Regardless of the sign’s content and the owner’s race or ethnic background, it was a violation.
And the fact that Mr. Fernandez took it down the day before his court date tells me that he and his attorney felt the court would rule against him and the zoning law did, in fact, apply to his sign. He should have taken it down months ago. It was an eyesore to those residents that live in a residental zone.
As of 10 A.M. this morning, the entire structure had been removed. The only thing left was a flag and I beleive, one porta-john. BTW, does anyone remember the situation in our community a year ago. How many people were speaking out about the “Resolution”, HSM, the ILRI or GL last year before this sign went up. He was the first to speak up in opposition. We owe him recognition for that.
NotGL,
Zoning has always been the problem for me, and it is an eyesore. It doesn’t matter to me what the sign said. I’ve told many this over the past year. I would still think it was an eyesore if it said Manassas & PWC is great.
Zoning laws don’t know the color, gender, religion, etc. of those that violate the zoning laws.
Lucky,
It was also an eyesore to all of those passengers travelling on the train.
For the core readership of this blog, the sign was apparently a symbol of
their feelings, material for wannabe film makers, and a salve for Fernandez’s
often misguided but enormous ego.
It was also great publicity for HSM, a poke in the eye of Old Town Manassas and for
a historic Afro-American community plus highly counter productive if the intent
was to build empathy and understanding for local immigrants (documented or not).
Know Greg L., no matter what he post, is really sad to see it go.
I agree Letiecq is sad to see it go but there are still brown people in his neighborhood. Chris, I hear you, but you are in the minority in terms of objecting to the sign. Most objected to the messenger. Latinos are not welcome in their eyes and neither is their right to free speech.
They want running to the zoning laws, found political signs were protected, but kept digging for some other way to exploit the law in order to silence him.
Well, he outlasted that ubconstitutional Resolution by four months.
PoorRichard,
My take was that Mr. Fernandez saw what he believed to be an injustice and acted. I don’t think it was his ego that motivated him. In terms of the message/sign, I have consistently said that I though it was a mechanism for them to communicate a message. Their side has had a hard time effectively communicating, they have not been fully included in the decision making process at the local government level, and the ‘wall’ seems to have served a purpose in atleast letting their voices be heard. I’ve even gone as far as to suggest that it perhaps has served as a type of safety valve where their frustrations were allowed to be vented.
Second, the ‘wannabe film maker’ swipe is laughable.
Annabel’s resume – found here – http://www.kascon22.org/?page_id=14
Eric’s resume – found here – http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eric_Byler
By the way, where’s Letiecq’s resume?
Mr. Fernandez created an injustice to the citizens of Manassas. He and
the filmmakers slandered our community for their own gain and recognition.
They have given nothing to the common good, but taken much.
“They have given nothing to the common good, but taken much.”
And like the sign, once chance for publicity is gone, they too will be gone if not already.
Eric Byler’s Wkipedia entry? Hahahahahahahahha OMG I wonder who types that stuff in. This is too funny.
Let’s have a pi**ing party tonight and go pi** all over Fernandez’ lawn. Oh, wait. We are American and speak English, we might get in trouble for loitering and public urination.
Maybe we can hire some day laborers to do it for us?
It’s about time the sign came down (should have come down long ago). I’m happy for the people that live in that area because they no longer have to see that hate filled rhetoric every day.
Hi Alanna, you said “Their side has had a hard time effectively communicating, they have not been fully included in the decision making process at the local government level”.
Who exactly are you talking about? Are you referring to illegal immigrants? If so, why in the world would someone who is in this country illegally be included in any decision of government on any level?
Rick,
Once again you sound incredibly racist. If you want to appear as though this is broader issue, please refrain from insulting latinos.
Poor Richard,
Exaclty what are you referring to when you say 9500Liberty filmmakers have slandered PW? As far as I am concerned, Greg Letique and his ilk, along with two key elected officials slandered our county, 9500Liberty simply documented it!
Hi Elena, you said “two key elected officials slandered our county”, how? By actually doing something about illegal immigration instead of the standard look the other way method? I’ve got no issues with what you said about Greg but saying “two key elected officials” makes no sense to me. They were elected to do a job and they did the job we asked them to do.
I don’t see how the filmmakers slandered our community. Some members of our community are responsible for the reputation PWC has earned. The filmmakers merely documented what PWC and City of Manassas residents were all too willing to say in public.
The sign didn’t bother me in that it was a good history lesson learned locally. It could have been more polished but the emotions were raw and with reason. It featured building and zoning code enforcement, freedom of speech, David vs. Goliath, push and shove, action and reaction, neighborhood bigots and bullies, pandering politicians,political heroes, public discourse, unity against xenophobia,and on and on and on.
Haha. On the SPLC’s website.
I disagree 100% Hello. They were not elected to handle a federal issue, spurned on by a Nativist and a Hate group like FAIR. There was absolutely NO due diligence regarding the consequences of illegal immigration OR the possible negative consequences of the resolution. Good Lord, I put more effort into my college research papers than Corey and John put into garnering a holisitic view of illegal immigration, HSM, and FAIR.
“The sign didn’t bother me in that it was a good history lesson learned locally.”
And I assume you conveniently do not live near the “sign” (it was the side of a condemned house) nor the trashy property it sat upon?
Censored – You are on point!!!! Good post.
Hi Hello,
HSM represensted half of a half of a percent in this county. The public hearing demonstrated that there was clearly an overwhelming majority of people that were opposed to the resolution. Now, because people law lantino faces, they were dismissed because we all know after all, they must have been “illegals”.
You should go look at the video with Linda Chavez when she asks Corey ” where is your empircal research and evidence regarding illegal immigration” and Corey’s reply is ” comments from the community is my evidence” or something to that effect. WHAT? That is how government is run these days, you take a poll from citizens, and decide that is the proper way to make public policy, which by the way, a policy that has cost us millions of dollars.
“They were not elected to handle a federal issue, spurned on by a Nativist and a Hate group like FAIR.”
You’re right. They were elected to finally do something about the illegal aliens that were beginning to overrun PWC instead of looking the other way and saying it’s a federal issue. They made that pretty clear when they were campaigning. Citizens believed them and they delivered.
“WHAT? That is how government is run these days, you take a poll from citizens, and decide that is the proper way to make public policy, which by the way, a policy that has cost us millions of dollars.”
Imagine that… a publicly elected official listening to the constituents that voted him into office. wow!
Mando,
You can’t seriously believe that a few vocal voices should control government? The the role of government is to determine effective policy for all its citizens, that it is their responsiblity to research and investigate new policies that will bring a huge tax burden onto its constiuents, and that they are responsible to all citizens to determine good policy not just a half of a half a percent.
Yes, the idea of a HATE group, founded by a guy who has demonstrated he is a white supremicist is NOT the person I want influencing policy for my county.
Elena, I see, so citizens voices shouldn’t be listened to by their elected officials according to you. Interesting…
Please Elena, you said “You can’t seriously believe that a few vocal voices should control government”. You and I both know that isn’t true. I never heard of Greg, BVBL, HSM or any other group before casting my vote in support of Corey. I would be willing to bet that most everyone that voted for Corey never heard of Greg or HSM. You seem to think that Greg is some sort of bigger than life person who controls local politics and your wrong. HSM doesn’t even have that many members, I think people here need to realize that a majority of PWC citizens support the resolution and it has nothing to do with Greg or HSM.
Elena,
You can’t seriously believe that a few vocal voices somehow elected officials whom made their stance on illegal immigration obvious during their campaigning? Do you think it was some kind of conspiracy?
The City of Manassas certainly has its own set of challenges and consequently
doesn’t need to import any from PWC.
Greg L. lives in PWC, but, sadly for us, named his group Help Save Manassas –
even when most of the members and issues are from PWC.
Mr. Fernandez also lives in PWC and, in the few brief conversations I’ve had
with him, it became clear that his major gripes are with PWC. Where does he put
his ugly sign? The heart of the City of Manassas.
In the postings on this blog, people mingle PWC and Manassas City even though they
are two separate jurisdictions.
PWC residents, take your PWC fights outside the city limits — please!
“And I assume you conveniently do not live near the “sign” (it was the side of a condemned house) nor the trashy property it sat upon?”
Mando, I could count on one hand the number of residences that would actually catch a glimpse of that sign. It’s mainly surrounded by the Museum and a parking lot.
Mando and hello, I’m sure you know that there was no public hearing about the resolution. If you count the mass turnout for Citizens Time, then HSM and cohorts were vastly outnumbered. As far as the fall elections, other than Corey’s signs and people in Stirrup’s district, I think few people outside HSM viewed the results as a mandate on immigration. Even my Republican friends who voted for Stewart said that immigration didn’t register on their radar. They were more concerned with residential growth.
Poor Richard, I think the “definition of family” puts the City in the spotlight as well.
Hi Censored, that’s fine if immigration didn’t register with your Republican buddies but it registered big time with just about everyone I know (that lives in the area). I live on rt.1 near the parkway, maybe it didn’t register with your buddies because they don’t see the effects every day.
@censored
Concerning the “sign” and it’s proximity to residentual areas. Wow. You don’t get into Manassas much do you?
Concerning the mandate on illegal immigration, wow again. All I can think is that your head was in the sand. 90% of the flyers I got in my mailbox, FROM BOTH SIDES, specifically stated stances on illegal immigration and how candidates were going to confront it. Not to mention TV adds, newspaper articles, etc. Just wow.
Mando, how many houses are near enough to see the sign? Three?
I think most of my friends who saw those flyers figured that it was an election year gimmick and immigration was best handled by the feds.
well, how is that working out so far (feds handling immigration)… not so good huh. You can’t always just sit around and wait for the feds to do everything.
“Mando, how many houses are near enough to see the sign? Three?”
How many residents have to drive by the “sign”? I’d say there are probably well over 500 within a 2 mile radius considering the 3 or 4 condo complexes, townhouses, and single family houses. Just because one doesn’t have to see it when they wake up in the morning looking out the window doesn’t mean they don’t have to see it when they have to drive about taking care of daily business. I know a few people that live in Sandalwood, less then a mile from the eyesore, that HAVE to drive by it on a daily basis. They pretty much ignored the “sign” after a while, but did complain about the shindigs on the property.