Please sign this online petition by clicking here. Your address and email will be not published. You have the option of signing your name without it being publicly displayed. It will get sent to all the supervisors. I know it is intimidating to sign a petition or even write a letter to your supervisor knowing that it may get FOIAed by Help Save Manassas and end up on Greg’s blog. We must all stand together to confront their bullying tactics. We can’t give up our rights to representation out of fear. Once you are done signing, please forward to your neighbors, friends and family in Prince William County. Thank you.
To Chairman Stewart and Supervisors Stirrup, May, Nohe, Caddigan, Jenkins, Principi and Covington:
We, the people of Prince William County, express deep disappointment at your appointment of Robert Duecaster to the county’s Strategic Goals Task Force, Human Resources Committee confirmed on September 16, 2008 with a 5-3 vote.
We commend Supervisors Jenkins, Principi and Caddigan for voting against it.
You have the right to vote however you wish as a supervisor, and we respect that is part of the process. However, it light the of fact that Mr. Duecaster has made anti-Hispanic, xenophobic, and anti-Catholic statements both addressing the Board during Citizens’ Time and writing on blogs,
And, in light of the fact that the appointment was confirmed on the inaugural day of Hispanic Heritage Month, we ask you for the following,
1. Please make a statement as individuals, not as the Board, explaining why you voted the way you did. Tell us how you feel about Mr. Duecaster’s anti-Hispanic, xenophobic and anti-Catholic comments. For example:
This really is not about immigration, it’s not about legality or illegality, it’s not about economics, I’m going to tell right what it’s about; it’s about and invasion of this country. This country is being invaded no less than if hordes of armed people came across its borders. This invasion is not armed, but they’ve got weapons. The weapons that they use are their anchor babies…This invasion is being funded by foreign governments…We’re going to repel this invasion, one way or another, it will be repelled. You can either be part of the repulsion or you can be part of the other side. (Robert Duecaster during Citizens’ Time, October 16, 2007)
What’s even more ironic is the fact that el Pape will be here bemoaning how some jurisdictions have ‘treated’ the illegals. He’ll disregard the facts that we’ve educated their anchor babies, provided social services, indulged their vulgarities, cleaned up their trash, and provided them with a higher standard of living and more freedoms than their own countries used to give them. He’ll berate us for not embracing them wholeheartedly, for not allowing them access to our universities at the expense of our own children, and for not rewarding them for violating the sanctity of our borders. He’ll be pandering to them to gather members to replace those who left the Church due to the institutionalized approval of his priests’ penchant for little boys’ behinds. (Robert Duecaster comment written as “Advocator” on bvbl.net, April 14, 2008. He admitted to being “Advocator” to the DC Examiner. Click here for the article.)
Please click here and review this collection of his written comments.
Please click here to review a video documenting his statements to the Board or ask Channel 23 to assemble the county’s own video documentation of his statements.
2. To mark the occasion of Prince William County’s declaration of Hispanic Heritage Month, please make a statement, and take meaningful action as an individual citizen and as a District Supervisor to express your appreciation of people of Hispanic heritage in this community.
We recognize that you have not always voted in accordance with your moral beliefs or your best judgment. We ask that you take this occasion to come forward and make a statement based on your personal beliefs instead of obscuring them behind such protocols as courtesy votes and unanimous votes.
You are our elected representatives in government. We need and deserve to hear you express how you really feel and what you believe.
People of Prince William County, Virginia
At what point in the democratic decision making process does everyone agree to abide by the voted decision? The way everyone carries on I don’t know why we bother. A vote between two choices means that someone isn’t going to get their way. That’s the best system we have so how about accepting the results, instead of starting a campaign about the vote not being fair. I really don’t need to hear four years of whining from who ever looses in November either. Eventually you’ll get a chance to cast your 17% vote for board members, so relax until then.
Where’s the 17% coming from? If it’s the citizen satisfaction survey, I wouldn’t go there because there’s no way of knowing what that figure means (i.e. how to interpret it).
Yea, 17% is getting real old. I take issue with things having to be 2 dimensional. Yes or NO. Black or White. Some of us might be somewhere in between. Maybe, gray. These are not always bad places to be.
It is knowable what it means. The demographer dude said it is the number of people who are willing to blame our Police force for the Immigration Resolution.
I am probably more offended by the resolution than anyone on this blog, but I am NOT WILLING to blame our police officers or our Chief for the Board’s decision.
Corey asked the demographer dude, “Why didn’t you ask them directly how they feel about the policy?”
The guy said, “Because it is not our practice to ask about specific policies.”
This is all from memory, but that’s what I remember.
I also remember thinking, oh boy, Gospel Greg will spin this to say only 17 percent were willing to cricicize the policy, and the low information types will believe him without looking at the study, and without hearing the guy who directed the study explain:
THE QUESTION WAS ABOUT THE POLICE IMPLEMENTATION OF THE POLICY; not the policy itself.
I don’t know anyone, really, not anyone, who would blame the police officers for the Supervisors’ bad policy.
Ok, agreed, I’ll stop with the 17% if you stop with the 1.6%. Take a look at the photos from the BOCS waiting room during the Resolution vote versus today. That’s why the numbers have dropped dramatically.
Hi, All.
I was on a tour of the Capitol today and guess what?! I am about 98% sure I saw John Stirrup there! And he was not on any tour. Ugh, it just makes me physically ill that he has access to our hallowed halls of government. I am not 100% positive it was him, but I’m almost sure. I’ve only seen him once in person, but there have been close ups of him on videos and I just swear it was him. He rushed by me and if I hadn’t been with a group of co workers I probably would have been arrested for rushing up to him to let him know I am a constituent that does NOT think highly of him or the people he chose to appoint.
Dime,
Thanks for agreeing to meet me. How do you want to arrange this? Could I meet you at the study circle? Or how about on Tuesday at McCoart evening session?
SA,
Let’s look at both percents and determine where they come from. I think we are all throwing them around and probably need to refresh memories where they come from.
1.6% of those arrested from July 2007-July 2008 were illegal immigrants? Am I right on that?
17% were dissatisfied with what? I have forgotten.
Everyone else is free to jump in and straighten me out on this.
MH,
Is there any real debate over the presence of between 10 and 20 million illegal immigrants in this country? That is a fact regardless of the arrest rates in little old PWC. Why is it that I should feel relieved about 1.6%. Perhaps it’s a slow season for crime for all I know. There could be zero illegals in PWC in a year or so, and then I’d really be impressed.
SA, I don’t think anyone really knows how many illegal immigrants there are in the country but I won’t argue either of your numbers. I don’t think you should be relieved that only 1.6% of those arrested were illegal immigrants.
Here is the issue, at least in my mind. I cannot tell who is legal and who isn’t. I can guess, but that doesn’t make me correct. A huge deal was made over crime committed by illegal immigrants in Pr. Wm. County. In fact, wasn’t that the main thrust of the original resolution?
Now I don’t want criminals running around loose any more than the next guy. I am all for locking up criminals. If they are in the country illegally, I will even agree to give them a one way ticket home once they have done their time, if they committed a serious crime (not jay walking or a parking light out)
But, our cop records are showing that out of all the arrests in that given year, 1.6% were illegal immigrants. Where are the hordes of thugs that had us all cowering under our beds? To hear some folks talk, we were about to be over-run by the thundering herd of illegal aliens. I think 1.6% falls a little short of the projections we were all given. And for the record, I am all for locking up those 1.6% if they did the crime.
MH,
AMEN!
Dime,
I don’t care if some, like you, think that people with my viewpoint are in the minority. Being in the minority doesn’t mean that you have any less right to an opinion.
Second Alamo,
When a decision is made that I feel is a poor one, I am not forced to sit and take it. Plenty of great laws have been made in this country, but, as history shows, there have also been plenty of bad ones put on the books.
We have a very real and legal right to express our opinions about laws, and sometimes we even have some people that step up to the plate and work to try and change things for the better. Thank goodness that laws in this country are living documents!
MH,
No, crime in general wasn’t the main thrust of the Resolution, but the fact that MS-13 came along for the ride was a factor that I hope no one here would deny. As you say you don’t know who is legal and who isn’t, but it’s that lack of background knowledge of these people that makes it so bothersome. Not only do you not know if they’re legal, you also don’t know if they have a criminal or medical history. Crossing over into the US would be a very easy way for a Latino thug to avoid prosecution south of the border, as do many members of MS-13. Most of the MS-13 members came from south of the border, and others were recruited here from other illegal families.
SA Said:
As you say you don’t know who is legal and who isn’t, but it’s that lack of background knowledge of these people that makes it so bothersome. Not only do you not know if they’re legal, you also don’t know if they have a criminal or medical history.
So, by your logic outlined above, then anyone who doesn’t speak English as their first language or has brown skin is suspect? “Not only do you not know if they’re legal, you also don’t know if they have a criminal or medical history?”!! Really? So, anyone here legally should have to wear a Scarlet Letter (A for Alien), so you know they are here legally and not illegally? Really, although there are a huge number of “illegal aliens”, there are also huge numbers of “legal aliens”, but you are essentially saying that it doesn’t matter to you which they are, because you can’t tell what their background is or determine whether they are legal or not by looking at them.
Ah, I knew you’d pick up on the ‘unknown’ issue. You’re right, I don’t know the background of anyone no matter who, but at least I know that immigrants who are legal have had their backgrounds and health checked. Not so for illegals. It’s like knowing that we enforce laws. It gives you a feeling of security that wouldn’t exist if we didn’t as in Mexico.
I have grown to believe that males think about these types of things more than women do. Thats how it works at my house at least.
I don’t think that people still get health checks like they did in the days of Ellis Island. What’s the difference in someone here on a 90 day visa and someone who has overstayed that 90 day visitors visa? I see no difference other than being out of status….no change in the individual.
Second Alamo, I’m glad to see you understand the meaning of the 17 percent figure. But regarding your point about 1.6 percent, I find that a little troubling.
The people at the Board chambers in 2007 were indeed Latino, but that does not signify documentation status as you well know.
Now they have less at stake, and are not seen as often in Board chambers, but the same is true for Help Save Manassas stickers and people apt to wear them.
Those Latinos who decided not to live in this sort of climate have left, I grant you. But were not criminals who are also undocumented. They were just families with moms, and dads, and kids, and maybe an uncle or a great aunt in the house who is undocumented, or maybe they just didn’t feel safe or welcome.
On the other hand, the gang members in PWC, I mean, the ones who also happen to also be undocumented and Latino, are not afraid of the law, and will probably remain that way no matter what new laws you put on the books. They were already breaking the old ones!
In other words, before the Resolution, they were committing the sorts of crimes that would have landed them in the 287G program, which I believe was initiated in 2006. So they were not going to freak out about the idea that people who roll through stops signs might also be targeted.
I’m not clear on whether you think a “crime wave” was the false justification for the Resolution, but I recall that it was used that way. It’s increasingly clear that the proponents of the Resolution objected to the presence of Latino people in their neighborhoods, regardless of their status, and regardless of their propensity to commit crimes.
I cannot fathom any other reason to be pleased with how things have turned out in PWC in the year and a half that we’ve been consumed with the immigration issue.
NGL and Second Alamo:
Another way of looking at it is this:
If we decided as a county to outlaw people with Type O blood, and enlisted our Police Officers to check the blood types for all those people they encountered who they had Probable Cause to suspect had Type O blood….
Well, our crime statistics would now show a small percentage of people with Type O blood committing crimes. Of course, that easily could be attributed to the fact that people with Type O blood were committing a small percentage of crime in this county BEFORE the Type O Blood Crackdown, because people with Type O blood represent a small percentage of the human population.
If you throw out a lot of babies, you might very well throw out some bathwater as well. Now that the damage is done, it’s not as important what the statistics tell us, as it is to reevaluate what our common values we share as a community, and which of them we wish to use to guide our democracy.
We must ask ourselves, was it really that important to get rid of Hispanic immigrants? For every Hispanic baby that would have grown up to be a productive member of our community, did we also ease the anxiety of a septuagenarian who was not prepared for our changing demographics?
Was it worth the heartache, conflict, and anger as we’ve suffered? Was it worth as much money as we have spent? Was it worth the sense of community we shared? Was it worth the reputation we enjoyed? Was it worth the futures we once looked upon with optimism? Was it worth losing faith in our elected officials? Was it worth seeing our Police Chief attacked? Was it worth knowing that we risk being looked upon by historians as another tragic example of how fear and prejudice can poison a society, and cause otherwise good people to be consumed with hatred, unable to grasp such concepts as forward thinking and the common good?
Look, the main reason that people were complaining is that it was obvious that these people were bringing in a much lower standard of living that was not something that we willingly allowed. You have repeated many times that it’s the Federal governments fault for not having done something sooner, but when the county took action BEFORE things got out of control look what happens. You can’t have it both ways. I’m glad we didn’t passively sit by as the Federal government had for years. It’s the standard of living that separates the ‘Good’ neighborhoods from the ‘Bad’ ones in most all cases. Take a look at the places you wouldn’t walk around in at night, and then look at how the homes have been kept. It goes hand in hand.
S-A, I just don’t think we can attach a racial value to what amounts to a good neighbor.
This idea, while frightening in and of itself, was made all the more frightening when a Washington DC anti-immigrant lobbying firm came to Prince William to help a small band of angry people storm our government.
But the most frightening prospect of all was when, for a short time, it seemed as if the Police Force would be enlisted in enforcing this “good neighbor” vs. “bad neighbor” value judgments which, at their core, seem to have been motivated by racial discord.
WHWN said of the Immigration Resolution, and the claim that it has made PWC a better place:
True that.
The solution to all this is really quite simple…we adopt the immigration regulations of Mexico so that those coming across our border will feel right at home. Of course, I can well imagine the uproar if that should happen. They seem to take violation of their borders, as well as their sovereignty, FAR more serious in Mexico than we do here.
I’ve finally gotten around to looking at this site, and boy, am I amazed!! FYI, all you
people who are condemning Corey and John….had it not been for their intestinal
fortitude, PW County would be a deeper cess pool than it is right now. Also, I am
amazed that Chris (aka Lafayette) seems to have forgotten that thanks to the efforts
of Greg, her street was somewhat “cleaned up”. I guess since her street has risen above
the cess pool status which a lot of us are still stranded with, she is no longer so gung-
ho about ridding our land of the blood sucking illegals. You people make me sick!
You go, HSM!!
Efforts of Greg my ass! Any work that was done on Lafayette’s street was because of her own action and her efforts working with the county.
Greg didn’t do crap on the local level.
Perhaps people like you made HER sick? Ever think of that? I know people like you make ME sick.
Feel free to use the screen name. I rarely it. Drug it out of the attic for the occassion.
Billy Bob,
What makes you think Greg’s done dick to clean up my street? I have not seen him walk down my block picking up trash, newspapers, etc. You should drive down his block sometime, and then you would know; he personally has done NOTHING for my block. His block is one of the more effected blocks.
You have no earthly idea what I’ve thanked Greg for.
I’d been calling to Neighborhood Services years before Greg L ever moved to my native PWC. I am the one that went to talk to my Supervisor last summer at a Community Clean Up Day in Irongate, and I went of my own FREE will. No one fed the idea to me. I’ve had nothing but cooperation and assistance from my supervisor office ever since, and I’m most thankful for this. I’ve never “condemned” John Stirrup. So, please don’t put words in my mouth.
I still have no desire to have illegal aliens residing in our county, state or nation. I can speak for myself. I do NOT need to belong to any group to take an active role in my community as I always have. I am not comfortable having someone speak for me. Just because I don’t write about what I do, doesn’t mean I’m doing nothing. Trust me I’m still doing my part and contacting my elected officials at all levels.
Also, I post here because my comments get deleted from bvbl. So, why would I waste my time just to have my comments deleted.
Why not come out from behind your moniker? You sure don’t mind calling mine out.
Chris
Robert Duecaster is clearly a man consumed by fear, physiologically sickened by fear. That much fear cannot be healthy. A stressed body cannot fight off disease and infection the way a healthy one can. He just can’t seem to comprehend what it is that makes him so afraid.
It’s sad that a citizen has that much fear; especially a citizen of the most powerful nation on the planet. A nation more powerful than any other by an order of magnitude or more. Not only that, but in Prince William County, this citizen i far away from targets, far away from the borders, far away from the coasts…. yet he still chooses to be afraid.
Prince William County is very safe for it’s population. It’s citizens are caring and friendly… why does he have so much fear? What is it that makes a man choose fear and a victimhood mentality over happiness and pride?
I think the answers to these questions, which I do not have, may be the key to our country’s survival as a culture.
I chose not to live in fear. I welcome my neighbors and see them as often as I can regardless of their origins. They know me and I know them and we take care of each other. When a teenager up the hill acts up and starts vandalizing properties; we cooperate and solve the problem. I feel safe. I pay taxes. I enjoy incredible freedoms and benefits… I don’t understand why anyone would choose fear as a lifestyle.
Supervisor Stirrup’s actions will be remembered in the next election cycle; and I hope we can get the word out to as many voters as we can and that we find a supervisor less willing to use unhealthy individuals like Robert Duecaster for their own ends.
This is my first time reading this blog. I’m trying to summarize what I’ve just read.
JustinT is a lost soul that needs group therapy, has found his group, and he cracks me up.
ShellyB is afraid of being attacked on a website, when those here have ordered the “extermination of all HSM members”.
NotGregLetiqic has no idea that the argument is about those here illegally,
regardless of their race, not because they are Latino.
Moon-howler still doesn’t know what the Resolution was all about. Crime was ONE of the items on the list, but the county being sucked dry by those who refuse to pay for social services was another. His moderate stance seems to make him devoid of an opinion.
Scott Nolan can cooperate with his neighbors to stop the crime in his neighborhood. Good for you Scott. I would have to learn Spanish if I were
to try that.
Chris has gone to a place where she can be heard, not deleted. And this place has made her feel more welcome than where she was before. But her position has not changed, she can just say her mind easier here because she will get stroked every time she puts her 2 cents in.
It’s been interesting, reading here. I’ll come back in another 6 months and see if the mantra has changed.
Poutyface, welcome to the blog. You should do some more reading before you make your assessments. There are few who come here and pretend that prejudice is not at the heart of this issue. The only question is whether you can abide by that or not. You’ve correctly assessed that I don’t feel that prejudice is a good basis for public policy. But that doesn’t mean I’m blind to the anxieties and neighborhood issues that are driving people to this kind of behavior. The argument that it’s all about legal vs. illegal is what’s called a head in the sand talking point. If you can’t acknowledge the prejudice involved, then you are not really looking for a solution, you’re just picking a fight.
By the way, the “extermination” post was a plant by a Gospel Greg clone, probably one of the Gospel Greg clones who actually IS Gospel Greg. He was banned as soon as he did that, and the comment was taken down in less than an hour.
Of course, that was all it took for the same little rat to post it on his bvbl as, I guess, an indication that he can be an asshole on two different blogs at once.
poutyface,
Welcome but your analysis is horrible. Hope you figure it out over the next six months.
Greg or his minion posted the comment about ‘exterminating HSM members’, then did a quick copy and paste before it was pulled. They are so predictable and aren’t fooling a single person with there hijinks.
What I don’t get is whether Maureen, Donna & Aliison are so stupid or if they just don’t give a crap. It’s really a toss up between the two but I might be leaning towards not giving a crap whether or not it’s true because just look at their leaders John & Corey who are without a conscious as well. It makes me wonder what has happened to the conservatives, when did we become so desperate to win that we would lie?