Kristen Mack, in today’s Washington Post article, focusing on the appointment of Duecaster, has clearly connected the comments of Robert Duecaster to “Advocator.” It was interesting to me, viewing the comment section, that Advocator tried to deny he was actually Duecaster! Ummm, Robert, you already took responsibility for your comments regarding “pitchforks and shovels,” it’s a little too late for back tracking. My hope is that we can start moving away from immigration status, and really focus on the underlying issue in this debate: the demographic changes in the county. We don’t know who is documented or not, legal resident or not, but we can focus on how to help our neighbors without vilifying an entire segment of our population, the Latino community. Certainly, our country is facing an economic crisis of a magnitude that will effect us all, and I believe our collective energy is better focused on the issues that REALLY will effect our everyday lives, like a bailout of a trillion dollars! When our personal property taxes come in next year, that will be a sobering moment for all us.
120 Thoughts to ““Activists Want Answers on Panel Choice””
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- Citizen Tom
- Counts of Monte Cristo. The
- Derecho, The
- Dixie Pig, The
- My Side of the Fence
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I’m going to shed a tattooed tear!!!
And now we see why they can’t give the Washington Compost away, much less charge for it. I wouldn’t wrap a fish in it.
TBD and Slowpoke,
You have both richly illustrated why people need to speak out at citizen’s time at 7:30pm.
Please everyone speak who is available. It will help to make a strong impression. Some people on the board did not like having to hear the speaker at 2pm.
They’re trying to shut us down! Don’t let them!
Mackie what are you saying, “they” are shutting down Citizans Time?
Sum up the HSM crowd’s arguments: “I know you are, but what I am I? I know you are but what I am? I’m not…YOU are! I’m not…YOU are.” It’s always Kindergarten over at HSM Headquarters.
–“We don’t know who is documented or not, legal resident or not”
And we should. And we would if our government were not so corrupt. And someday we will.–
Rick, I agree! But targeting people for hatred doesn’t help us do that. We need a clean sweep of government. Our government, especially our local government, hates transparency. Why? Because they do things behind closed doors, on their own time, and on their private blackberries. LIES all around.
Corey put a half hour limit on citizens time tonight.
Is this an attempt to silence people? He looks nervous. Who is he afraid of? Order of the Red Specks is there plus Ms. FOIA. Actually 2 Ms. FOIAs.
Maybe they didn’t like him complimenting Mr. Gerhart this afternoon. Maybe their Boss MAN sent them down there to make him PAY.
You know what? If people want to be quiet racists, then fine. I really don’t care. But don’t try to bring that crap into my government, expect me to pay for it and accept it like I think it’s right. It’s NOT right. I have no problem calling this local government of ours RACIST. You know why? Because it’s GOVERNMENT who have alligned themselves with RACIST policy makers.
If you lived next door and muttered racist things under your breath, I would ignore them. But when Stirrup stands up there and preaches his doctrine of racism, I’m going to preach BACK.
Rick,
We can’t tell who is here legally or illegally. But you say we should. How, exactly, should that be done? Anyone who is not “obviously” an American will have to wear a Scarlet Letter A to denote themselves as legal aliens? And anyone who does not “look” American who doesn’t wear the Scarlet Letter should be assumed to be “illegal?”
The whole point of the matter is that you can’t tell by looking at someone if they are here legally or not. All the people you rant about in your neighborhood could be here on a TPS for all you know. And that would make them here legally.
TBD,
I don’t think we should be asked to give someone a pass on racial slurs, save mental-illness. I cannot even begin to imagine the horrors that John McCain had to go through as a POW. If he referred to his captors as bastards, f**ckers, etc. for the rest of his life…I would totally get that. That is not what he did, however.
I understand that “g**k” was a more socially acceptable term in the 1950s and 60s. However, John McCain continued to use that term, and use it publicly into 2000. He refused to apologize, and finally stopped when his GOP advisors convinced him that it might hurt his campaign.
What is even crazier is that John McCain should be more sensitive to racial slurs than that; he has an Asian daughter!! (albeit a South Asian one…) As his daughter grows, will she be completely accepting of her father’s unapologetic use of the term?
All of this aside, I think it is unacceptable that the possible next president of our country used racial slurs repeatedly and refused to apologize for it/saw nothing wrong with it. What message does that send to citizens of this nation? What message does it send to the world?
The following excerpt is from a February, 2000 San Francisco Chronicle article:
“I was referring to my prison guards,” McCain said, “and I will continue to refer to them in language that might offend some people because of the beating and torture of my friends.”
“I will call right now, my interrogator that tortured me, a gook,” McCain said. “(I can’t believe that) anybody doesn’t believe these interrogators and prison guards were cruel and sadistic people who deserve the worst appellations possible.”
McCain said he does not consider the comment an epithet.
“Gook,” he said, “is the kindest appellation I can give.”
The following is a link to video of Dr. Phillip Butler, who went to school with John McCain and was also a POW with him (you can google and find more writings by him):
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_KjsEs46C70
This is wrong…regardless of which party you belong too and I am not a McCain supporter
“Mackie, 23. September 2008, 16:36
McCain chose to put on a uniform and go fight in an unconstitutional war. No one forced him. He knew the risks and was captured. It’s unfortunate but we ALL have our crosses to bear. ”
People can claim the same thing about illegal immigrants…they committed an unconstitutional act by entering our nation illegally and they knew the risks of being caught, deported or even the possibility of being taken advantage of. Because we ALL have our crosses to bear, as was stated above.
Funny how nobody defended McCain for his service, regardless of political affiliation, yet many are quick to defend those who enter our country illegally to advance themselves.
You can’t have it both ways here…if you can disparage someone who made a sacrifice FOR this nation, then it has to be difficult to defend those who made NO sacrifice FOR this nation (only for themselves or families) by entering illegally.
I am no McCain supporter, but he did what many of us did not do for this country and THAT should not be subjected to the comments above.
TWIN my understanding is that Rick is saying we should know who is entering the country, not that they should wear a scarlet letter. I, too, think it would be best to know this, and of course, to have no immigrant have to be considered “illegal” (assuming they aren’t criminals, of course).
Well folks, I can honestly say that the illegal immigration debate is behind us. We are know in the era of ‘Blog Wars’. I just watched Citizens Time on 23 and all that was discussed, besides Mr. Duecaster, was the two blogs. Members of each stood there and complained about the actions of the other, and I’m thinking is this what Citizens Time is all about? I don’t think so, but at least no one seems to be mentioning illegal immigration any more. I was waiting for judge Judy to walk in. There wasn’t a single non-English speaker in the bunch from where I started watching. I loved Eric B’s opening statement that the bad reputation that PWC is getting is unfair when he is the one perpetuating the negative, but then that’s the ‘media’ for you.
SA, yes, blog wars it appears to be. But, for a silly diversion you can always guess which color Maureen’s hair will be.
Actually, the ability to plant a nasty comment on a blog and have someone highlight it at Citizens Time certainly exists. To me, that’s why it’s important to look at what the blog owner actually posts and the general tone of the blog. Advocator’s posts are important because of the position to which he was appointed.
I utterly agree with Elena…no we don’t know the immigration status of our neighbors..nor should we..in a PERFECT world. The status of our neighbors has more to do with our desire to have the Rockwellian “perfect neighbors”, than accepting our neighbors for who they are, or where they are at financially. I am a perfect example about a neighbor who complained about the renters in the home next door. Yes they were hispanic, yes they were nice, yes I did the whole catholic, posadas, thing with them, I was invited to participate in the first communion/confirmation parties for the kids. No I was not happy with their grandson who was..in my opinion..
EVIL. We talked, we worked it out. My cat ate their birds and they did not complain. A year later they left b/c the “owner” from NYC wanted to move in his home. I was actually sad to see them go. Then the house owners moved in in the beginning of July. NOT ONCE have they mowed their lawn. They cut down a tree in the backyard, and today it lies there still. I have noticed an increase of vermin in my back and front yard. Every attempt at knocking on their door results in silence, even when I know they are home. They too are hispaninic, but their desire to acclimate, and be a part of the neighborhood is nil. My point: demographics change, neighbors learn to be neighbors, and in some cases, people resist change irregardless of where they are from.
Blogs have actually become a source of inquiry for any employer considering hiring an employee. Employers commonly do a general web search to see what the net has to say about their candidate. In many cases, candidates are not hired because of what they have said on the internet. This has become an acceptable way to screen candidates before they even come to an interview. The BOCS being what it is, of course, would never use technology to ensure we are getting the best people for the job. Then again, these are the people who couldn’t even tell all the emails supporting the resolution were from FAIR, not from real residents. But they know how to use their blackberries, that’s for sure! Stirrup and Stewart, having their private chats with GL and Duecaster….yup, they got that down.
I think people using Citizens Time to air there disagreements with each other is a huge waste of the Board’s time. What do you expect out of that other than getting air time. It has little to do with the fabric of the county and its well being. If they keep this up soon you’ll have to submit your topic for approval before being allowed to speak, which I would agree with. It’s not a platform for private arguments. Besides, people who don’t read the blogs are probably thinking what the hell are these people talking about?
I don’t think in this case it’s about not getting along with each other. It’s whether or not Duecaster should be appointed. IMHO, he doesn’t have the capacity to assess needs of minorities, the poor, or anyone else from a background he detests. He is unstable, vengeful and has a pretty shady past. Even if he were not an overt racist working with a hate group, he would be a poor pick for such an important committee.
Hold on there kgotthardt, ALL the emails were from Fair! Now you know you can’t make that statement as fact. You may state that ‘probably’ or ‘I think’, but there is no way that could be true with 350,000 residents. The law of numbers says that someone must have supported the Resolution, otherwise there would be outrage in the streets after the vote. The only outrage is on this blog ; )
No not all of them were from FAIR but there were literally thousands of them. (Source: FOIA) Some of the emails were from the same people just using different names! So the numbers were bogus. We don’t know how many REAL residents DID support it.
Ironically, the BOCS ignored thousands of protesting people right outside their doors and instead paid attention questionable emails!
SA, whether it’s immigration or anything else, would you agree that governments should be transparent, that we should know how and why these people choose to do the things they do?
SA, I think the last two Tuesday’s Citizens Time speeches were pertinent because of Duecaster’s appointment. IMO, that appointment steps over the line. As much as I might disagree with Donna W.’s opinions, she does not fall into the same catergory as Duecaster. The only worse appointment would be Letiecq’s. There’s a valid reason to protest the Duecaster appointment.
Maureen and Allison have been itching to use the overhead projector ever since Greg’s postings were exposed. They were bound to make an appearance as soon as they heard that Elena would present the petition. Maureen isn’t even a county resident.
I would never agree with ditching Citizens Time as it’s the only public avenue available to the average Joe/Jane Blow to make their opinions heard. It can also be very entertaining.
–As much as I might disagree with Donna W.’s opinions, she does not fall into the same catergory as Duecaster.–
Agreed. Plus, wasn’t she appointed for something like neighborhood safety? She used to be a cop, I heard, so she is at least qualified!
Glad Maureen isn’t in the county. We have enough idiots in our government without adding her.
(Yeah, I’m ready for the bashing I’m going to take on that comment.)
I thought McCain did apologize for using racial slurs against Asian Americans.
I have to give thumbs up to the City of Manassas for showing good sense in accepting a settlement to the lawsuit and to the Republican Party there for passing by the wingnuts and nominating and electing a moderate Council. Hope PWC moves in the proper direction as well.
How many people knew that Donna was not a member of HSM???? She never wore a sticker come to think of it. But she always shows up with Greg’s talking points. Anyway that’s the slight of hand that allowed Maureen to say HSM hadn’t cost the county hundreds of thousands in taxpayer money for FOIA requests; Donna had.
As I recall, the main person who was quoted by a red circle tonight at citizens time was one of the few people who has banned from bvbl.
On the other hand, I was reading the WAPO online today and read some pretty nasty comments about this blog owner’s children–the comments were made by someone who spoke at citizen’s time tonight.
Actually I’m going to have to agree with SA, it’s pretty silly that this is what County politics has come to. But it was pretty damn funny when they put the political satires up. How that’s character assasination is beyond me. It’s Duecaster’s own words that have done him more damage than a cartoon.
Hold up NGL, Widowski wore the sticker and anybody that wears the sticker is a member in my book.
Alanna, Allison is the type to shoot the messenger – in this case, the cartoonist. Without Greg’s and Corey’s statements and actions, there’d be nothing to satirize. Oooh, I thought a particularly hammy touch was when Allison pointed out the Devil!!! Brought me right back to the Christmas parade thread at BVBL. Haha.
I have seen Donna W wearing the sticker …that red badge of shame…in some of 9500 Liberty’s film footage. However, I do not think that should disqualify her to serve on whatever committee she has been appointed to. Her speech and her behavior, to my knowledge, has not been repugnant.
Interesting that none of the characters in the political satire cartoons had names on them. Yet one of the speakers tonight insisted on telling the chair that one of those strange looking cult members was none other than himself. I was embarrassed for her.
I anxiously await the next episode!!!
Censored, I didn’t see a devil. Which character does she think is the devil?
El Diablo sure isn’t on my screen. I didn’t realize the Corey was a member of HSM either.
tsk tsk. The whining was pointless. The red circles sounded like children tattling on us because people here on this blog had opposed the appointment of one of their members…based on his own words, not on the words of others.
MH, I think she meant the horned image where Greg is holding up the Rule of Law.
I agree that it sounded like tattling. The logical thing to do would be to offer up Duecaster’s good points but I guess there were none to be championed.
I always associated Donna W. with HSM too. She made the same points both before the Board and in the MJM’s letters to the editor. If she’s not associated with them, why all the FOIAs?
Lucky Ducky,
I’m curious, why do you think the Founding Father’s abhorred the idea of a standing army?
Thank you, for watching this week’s episode of “More Middle School Mayhem”
Lucky Duck,
I am not a McCain supporter either but I have all the respect in the world for his service to America. People in the military do not decide the politics of war. They do what they are told, most of them very honorably.
I’m glad the illustrations got some airtime. The rendering of Corey Stewart’s head is priceless.
When the illustrations were shown, was that Corey Stewart who was chuckling in the background?
Censored, I thought that Rule of Law rascal was a gargoyle. Could have fooled me. I am not very devil-centric though. Gargoyles are a different matter.
Many of our wounded, coming home today, are finding themselves in a similar situation . Fighting a war that many have come to believe is a moral and fiscal disaster. What I find heartening though, is unike the Vietman War, citizens are not “blaming” the soldiers for the acts of the the executive branch. I have great empathy for soldiers who are returning, battered not only physically, but battered to the core of their emotional well being. John McCain, whether he volunteered or not, survived horrific circumstances. He was one of the few Republicans to speak out against Bush’s doctrine of torture. He dared his other co presidential candidates to dare speak to the idea that “America tortures” is an acceptable statement for ANY politician to utter. Now, I think he could have, and should have, taken this moral subset to its final end, but he was dealing with an unrepentant President. I happen to like john McCain, and because of that, I have been especially disappointed in his most recent behavior, especially as it relates to choosing Sarah Palin, a bone to the religious right that his cost the republican party so many independents.
It is clear now, it is time to start working towards a new goal. The resolution is neutered, the appointment of Duecaster and the objections are on public record, and enough citizens are beginning to see HSM for what it really is, the pathetic bully on the block that no longer scares anyone. The question now is, how do we start rebuilding the notion that PWC, IS a place ,where all people are welcome.
Let people know they are welcome, but also that we expect them to adhere to or improve the standards of living that have been created by the community that came before them. Those two things together will ensure another Resolution situation will not arise.
I hear a few women flew in on their broomsticks tonight, according to one from the unenlighted screen. It just gets cruder and cruder.
Double double toil and trouble;
Fire burn, and caldron bubble.
Actually the 2 real witches stayed home and the witch look alike did too, but not with the 2 real witches. Gasp! Persish the thought.
SA,
Excellent point. I’ve met my new neighbors, and gave them a booklet from Neighborhood Services on the most common zoining complaints. I met one family on my block, and they’d been living in Culpepper for the past three years. They are very happy to be back in Westgate, where they moved from when they went to Culpepper. The man told me his wife longed to be back here, and it’s a nice place to raise kids, and a nice size yard to keep up and for the kids to play in. They’ve really spruced the house up. It’s just one family living in the house. They are immigrants and where not afraid to move back to PWC even with the current climate.
People in the military swear an oath to the Constitution. They are obliged to honor their oath…even if it means disobeying orders.
More of them would do just that…if we supported them.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wj0hI4OyF3A
Ultimately, it’s hypocritical to blame our soldiers when we give them no other way out beyond prison and a criminal record which will cripple them for life, not to mention ostracism from their brothers and sisters in arms. It’s a high price to ask anyone to pay.
We the People have allowed our ‘ruling class’ to separate the warrior class from the citizenry. We have allowed them to hold our warrior class hostage with it’s own sense of honor and obligation. What was a strength, the bloom of duty from the hearts of our warriors, we have allowed to become a threat through neglect.
Okay, who kidnapped Second Alamo and replaced him with a reasonable person!
Just kidding.
Second Alamo, if Moon-Howler says you’re alright, then you’re alright with me. I’ll never besmirch your name by calling you Tom Kopko again.
Elena, I agree let’s work with the Supervisors to move beyond all this back and forth about blogs and political cartoons.
(When I saw Ms. Kipp doing her “would you look at this political cartoon” show I felt like I was in 2nd grade all over again. It was Show&Tell and Tattle Tail rolled into one.)
Some people have their whole identity tied up in this fight over immigration, and they just aren’t going to escape it. But we can escape it. Because ultimately this is not about immigration to us, but about tolerance and community spirit, about fiscal responsibility and the responsibility to represent us wisely, and show leadership even when challenged by angry and fiercely critical people.
Kipp actually brought in a POLITICAL CARTOON and complained about it? Come on. Talk about making herself look like an ignorant fool.
My sources tell me Widowski can’t join HSM because her husband is a Federal cop. (Don’t ask me which sources. I won’t tell. Besides, I literally forgot! I’ve got so many now…..wahaaaahaaahaaa.)