In today’s edition of the Washington Post entitled – Prince William’s Mothers of Dissension, an article about Stay-at-Home Mom’s, featuring Elena, myself and Katherine Gotthardt with quotes from Kris Nohe as well. Honestly, I started to doubt whether this story would ever appear, you can tell by the photos, which were taken in the early fall that this story has been in the making for quite some time.
167 Thoughts to “WP: Stay at Home Moms (featuring Elena, Katherine & Myself)”
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Fontbonne,
I said more on the matter than that. Are you taking the Emma approach? Each child has his/her own needs as to what’s best for them. The parents make that choice, and I do believe parents do what they feel is BEST for THEIR child. I said I don’t have the patience or desire to do it myself, and have respect for those who do. I will repeat myself once again. I have respect for those that want/can school their children at home. It’s not my cup of tea, and don’t feel that public schools are the ruination of children.
Everyone is free to do what they want. I just asked what about other types of mothers. Sounds like you might have an ax to grind with public education. That’s just my perception of your comments. I’ve not meant to offend anyone. However, I’m not on this blog to make friends or enemies. I’m here to exchange I ideas, and my comments here uncensored, and without risk of being deleted.
Emma,
“people in glass houses”, do you know that saying? You have been quite vicious towards Alanna and I, as far as I can tell, not only on bvbl, but also possibly the wash post comment section. Although I may not necessarily agree with Chris’s premise regarding the quality of home schooling, I find it interesting that YOU would be the one to admonish someone on attacking others.
Let’s not focus on what Chris said. I have seen a great and mighty effort turn to fixate and deflect on Chris’s words rather than on the vicious attacks on Elena and Alanna that has gone on for over 24 hours on the Post blog and on bvbl.
Chris isn’t the guilty one here. Those who have had a hay-day at the expense of Alanna and Elena are the guilty ones. Emma, how dare you question how either of these ladies spend their day! I have always believed in the birds of a feather axiom. I would work on Ch!cko becoming a human being rather than how much quality time Elena and Alanna spend with their children. If you work on Ch!cko the s!cko it will be a full time job. Perhaps he won’t have time to leave gutter scum remarks on this blog.
Emma, all of us have tried to be fair with you, but let’s face it: you have been 2 faced and hypocritical. That’s too bad. You are bright and articulate. You are wasting it being nasty.
Did you read the Wash Post comments, Elena, where I was “possibly” vicious to you? You and many of your friends here would do best to take some of your own advice about glass houses. Funny how the mere mention of my name brings out the self-righteous dander in you.
And Chris’s comments did smack of personal attack with the reference to “HSM/homeschoolers,” and was glaringly ironic coming right after Ivan’s comment about personal attacks on bvbl. Apparently I’m too much of a sinner in your view to be allowed to point that out. Did I touch a nerve?
MH, I do not own Chicko’s remarks, and it’s not my job to police him/her. I have called him/her out in the past on the physical appearance stuff, but I’m not in charge in what seems to be an open forum, so why do you bring Chicko up in relation to me? Do you own Mackie’s remarks? Should I assume Mackie is representative if this blog as a whole?
Emma,
Even though clearly I have no idea who are as a human being, I was pleasantly surprised when you visited here with kind words for New Years Eve, and yet, a mere three days later, you have gone back to your cruel words, directed at me. I guess on some level, I am just disappointed. I thought maybe we had turned a corner with you, maybe not in belief, but at least in tone. What a shame I was wrong.
I’m sorry you feel that way, Elena. Sometimes it’s not all personal. Sometimes it has more to do with the complete lack of objectivity on the part of the reporter and the newspaper as a whole when it comes to the immigration issue. Let’s start with the photograph–lovely, by the way, and I mean that sincerely–which gives the impression that you and Alanna are next-door neighbors talking over the fence. There is a certain amount of reader manipulation that goes on there and throughout the article that doesn’t require a lot of sophistication to see.
Maybe you would like it better if I took a page from Mackie’s endearing little book. You don’t seem to mind his foul, race-baiting spew.
Emma, which newspapers and news magazines do you think are totally “objective”? Do you think editorial staff – both news editors and photo editors – make content more or less objective?
Emma,
FYI-That same person you think I was attacking. Was the person who I said had a very well adjusted child, and was happy to be homeschool. Patty’s child is the most “normal” acting homeschooled child I’ve ever met. Nice try Emma. You’ve said before you don’t know me and HSM people. So why is it you seem to “know” who I was talking about.
I would also like to note that so many are complaining about Alanna and Elena taking their kids to board meetings. Well, I didn’t hear anyone say boo when Patty took her child to a couple of board meetings. Nor, did I hear any complaints from anyone when I took my daughter to a BOS meeting, and she decided to speak as we drove down there.
The WaPo used to have a blog – On Balance – by Leslie Morgan Steiner author of “Mommy Wars”. It was a popular blog and its focus was how to find balance for SAHMs (and Dads) and working parents. Nothing said on this thread wasn’t already covered on Leslie’s blog. There was an occasional foulmouth that would say something similar to what is spewed on BVBL by a couple of the regulars. But the WaPo has often covered the subject of SAHMs. An article about two women who are SAHMs and yet are politically active would absolutely not be an unusual subject for the post to cover.
Chris, I have no idea if you were attacking a specific person or not. You might have me confused with another poster. I was commenting on the interesting juxtaposition of comments by you attacking HSM/homeschoolers, and Ivan complaining about personal attacks on bvbl. You don’t seem to be able to see the irony there, but there’s no point beating a dead horse from my little glass house here.
Emma, I’d not seen IVAN’a post when I posted. Look at the times. His went up as I was typing my posts. So, IVAN’S warning wasn’t even there for me to see with my own two eyes.
You can claim that you don’t know if that’s the person I’m talking about or not. Yet, you assumed I was talking about HSM’s. HSM and it’s members not have the market cornered on home schooling. For someone that claims not to know them you sure do seem to know a lot about HSM. Oh, well you sound like a couple of other women I know that love to chant “I NEVER blog. I only read.” That’s BS if I ever heard it. You really sound them.
I’m able to see plenty of irony. The question is are YOU?
Why do you keep beating a dead horse, Emma?
“I personally have a problem with SAHM that think they are “educators”. HAHAHA!!!
If these “Home Schooling Moms” were so concerned about their children getting an education with religion. Why don’t these HSM(home schooling mom’s) get a real job and send their kids to get a “real education” at a private church based school. Of course they could be SAHM’s, if their husband’s could support the family.”
Your words, Chris, not mine. I have no idea whom you were attacking specifically. You keep coming back at me because you won’t own your own words, and now you’re embarrassed.
Enough said.
Emma, why not explain your statement about the WaPo and its writer – “Sometimes it has more to do with the complete lack of objectivity on the part of the reporter and the newspaper as a whole when it comes to the immigration issue.” Just what was missing in the article that caused it to have “a complete lack of objectivity”? The topic of the article was Alanna and Elena, not immigration. Immigration was mentioned as part of the article – to show Alanna’s and Elena’s activism in one arena but not as its primary subject. Should the article on Greg have disputed everything he said? Should the article on Chris and Allison have been balanced by pointing out Corey’s lies and FAIR’s influence in order to give a fairer view of the impact of immigration on PWC?
Emma,
I have no problem owning those words you’ve posted. I also, own the other words to that went into further details on my view of home schooling. You should be embarrassed for not presenting all of my comments. You choose to pick one comment out of several.
Anyways, no are the one that keeps coming back at me.
Enough said, indeed, Emma. You can keep wasting your time on it. I’m done wasting time on you and your comments. You own the crap you spew too. 😉
Emma, I haven’t yet read the crap you spew, but can you spew some on the new thread? No one is defending Corey, Weasel John, and Gospel Greg. I’m starting to feel sorry for them.
Emma, I once saw you chew out ch!cko and his many other names (I can’t recall which one) for making nasty personal appearance remarks. I applauded you for doing that. Yet I don’t see you distancing yourself in other areas. Has he bragged to you about the vulgar, nasty, hate spewing remarks he makes several times a week here? Some of them are extremely vulgar.
I am sure you know that Mackie and I often disagree. There are several people here I just glaze over and do not bother to read. However, you cannot accuse me of cozying up.
Now that we have covered that territory, I agree with Elena. We have talked about how glad we were to see you and your less hostile attitude at us. I certainly do not mind you disagreeing with me. I disagree with my best friends over things. We still are friends. What I mind are the nasty attacks.
When I read the article I thought what a nice article it was. I thought the same thing about some of the articles that involved people who where not associated with anti at the time. What I really object to is the nasty parenting cracks made about Elena and Alanna. Those remarks are undeserved and without merit. Both are extremely involved moms. Their children are involved in a variety of activities and they are there every step of the way. In fact, I would say both of them are role models, rather than objects of derision.
And finally, much has been made over on your place about me being here much of the time. Just why do you think that is? I am not a stay at home mom. I have time to spend that Elena and Alanna do not. I fill in so they have more time with their families. Yet that ,too, is criticized. Why doesn’t
everyone just admit the 3 of us can do nothing right.
Rageaholism is an interesting behavior. The WaPo response section is filled with it- as is BVBL. You can see the rage building as posters respond and feed on each other’s posts. Any article on immigration will get many of the same posters, the same responses, the same rage. It’s not the same as being contrarian. It definitely has an extreme anger to it – an anger that would make sane people leave a room were it to be expressed in their actual presence. Just as alcoholics often are in denial, rageaholics are as well – they always feel justified to say the most vile or over-the-top thing.
In over ten years of posting on various message boards, I’ve read enough manic rages to feel some posters are interchangeable in their similarity.
“Sounds like you might have an ax to grind with public education. ”
Not even close.
No, MH, Chicko doesn’t brag to me about anything–I don’t know him/her at all and I’m not the blog police that monitors everything he/she says. I also haven’t spent any time speculating about how much time you run the blog at what you call my “place.” I consider all of this to be more of an open forum.
I stand by my assertion about bias in the article. Additionally, the Post tends to take turns alternately slamming SAHM’s and working moms, especially during slow news cycles, and it irritates me to no end to see them glorify one side of it, only to tear it apart in the next article to keep the newsworthy “Mommy wars” going. But that is beside the point.
Emotions run high on these issues, and my opinions are fairly strong and set. But I will apologize for my initial statement about Gymboree and all that–it was more in response to the tone and the bias of the article and the usual Post nonsense than it was intended to be a personal attack. I will think twice before I hit “send” in the future.
M-H,
Thank you for your very thoughtful post. I think that you made a great point, it is clear that for some, no matter what we do, or don’t do, we will always be the object of their distaste. Your help in writing threads, has been invaluable, especially during the busy time of the holidays. I am sending you a big hug right now!
Emma,
Thank you for your expressing your intent to “think twice before you hit “send” in the future” and for the apology referencing some comments you made.
Emma, no, you cannot control what others say. Very true. Perhaps I am wrong that you have been a cheerleader to some of the crap that has been hurled our way. If that is the case, then I sincerely apologize.
I read the article because I know Elena and Alanna. Working moms/SAHMs are concepts I no longer worry about. My kiddlies are grown and most of the time I was a working mom.
I hope that you will help diffuse things rather than ignite them. I feel certain there is much common ground. The war mongers just want to stir things up. Ex. If both ‘sides’ were happy on April 30, that should have been a spring-board for working towards common goals. I appreciate your ‘pausing before hitting send’ sentiments.
MH
Elena, you are more than welcome.
M-H, and CensoredbyBVBL, you have posted some really intelligent words here on this thread today. I did not know there were comments being posted on blogs 10 years ago. I thought this whole thing was new. Go figure.
Also, good to see Emma playing nicely but I admit I don’t fully grasp the meaning of the disagreement. Women should be proud to be stay at home and proud to be working moms. Either way, a mom is the best thing a person can be in life. Moms are the MVP’s of human history.
whwn, awww thank you.
I don’t know that the expression blog was used 10 years ago. There certainly were those news boards and chat rooms then. Certainly things have gotten more sophisticated.
Censored, I didn’t realize there was an actual name for Rageaholism. Tell us more about it please.
WHWN, I have no children but found Leslie Morgan Steiner’s blog because of a subject featured on the WaPo. I was amazed at the animosity among the posters for the different choices they had made in life – all very legitimate choices. I thought of my siblings (all female) and the different choices they had made and the financial constraints and division of work at home that pushed them onto one path or the other. How to raise children, how to educate them, and whether to have them to begin with are all very personal choices. Sometimes people have a lot of leeway in making these choices and somethings none at all.
I’ve noticed your rational posts in the response section. Months ago – maybe even a year ago – I tried to rationally present my point of view there as well. The rage that builds when any immigration issue appears just drowns out the rationality. The ragers aren’t interested in logic. Their reaction is one of emotion -a legitimate response – but it quickly goes on to become emotion out of control. I think many of them are people who are perpetually angry in life. Immigration is but one issue for them to rage about.
Moon-howler, I first heard the term “rageaholic” on a message board. The term was being discussed by a couple nurses but I doubt that it’s made it into the DSM. People were discussing anger that they thought would fit into a personality disorder but the nurses were adamant that there was an addictive nature to the anger. I don’t have a background in a pertinent field so I would not dare say. I’ve seen the behavior in a couple people on boards where I’ve been a long time member. These people can not walk away from an argument. They become “manifesto” queens and kings after a big explosion- vowing to never return only to quickly do so. They are addicted – painfully so. The anger has affected all aspects of their lives – family, work, social contacts. They don’t seem to feel alive without the anger.
There’s a little on wikipedia about the term. I’ll see if I can find more. I wonder if “Anger Management” classes deal with this issue – the addiction.
Censored, thanks for that explanation. Do you think immigration brings out rage or do you think that people who go nuts about it are angry anyway and that is just one of the topics those people pull in? Not sure I asked that right.
How come those of us who see immigration in more moderate terms (not open borders, just not massive deportations of all men women and children) do not get rage like anti immigration folks? I noticed back in the day when we were on the dark screen….some of them got so filled with rage at us over several topics, I might add. We weren’t that angry. Go figure.
M-h, here’s an Anger Management article which touches on the problem.
http://www.angermanagementseminar.com/articles/just_another_addiction.html
I couldn’t say for sure which came first but my instincts would lead me to believe that the people most furious about immigration were angry to begin with. Otherwise, why wouldn’t they tackle some of the problems which affected them by calling the pertinent county staff – zoning, NS, police? When I had similar problems in my neighborhood, I didn’t ask PWC to round up all the drunks, dopers, and country boys and drive them to the border of Fairfax County and dump them off. I asked county staff to address specific problems that concerned behavior- too much noise, too many untagged cars in various stages of repair, dogs that roamed the neighborhood, construction materials stored next to the road. None of these offenders were Hispanic, but most of the problems were solved by county staff. Public urination, as Chris noted, seems to be the hard problem to solve if you have to catch them watering the lawn.
Censored,
Thanks for the article. Yes, I was angry and the condition of my neighborhood as you know. However, even angry you must contact and work with the county departments to get these types of issues addressed. Neighborhood Services from 2006 to 2008, had cut their response, and compliance time drastically. I feel that this improvement was due in part to “anger” on the citizens’ part. Now, this is anger was working for good. (imho).
I will say that there were times I also got angry over the way I saw a few things handled by NS. I also, so their level of service improvement at least from my standpoint. However, as I learned how limited the powers of NS are and the length of time for due process, my anger subsided. I know one thing, if it had not been for the work of Senor Chavez in November of 2007 we’d still be looking at “the coke machine” sitting in Mario’s driveway. When I sensed Senor Chavez’ frustration with this problem, it restroed my faith in NS, along with some meetings with Michelle Casiato. Neighborhood Services will listen to ideas, and help citizens understand their limitations. I’m very pleased to the increase in fines for violations, and the more powers given to NS over the past couple of years.
Watering the lawn!! Classic that will be filed away with the many “classic quotes of Lafayette Avenue”. I did see a couple of vehicles of those that belong to the two nearby NW. I wonder if they went cruisin’ down good ole Lafayette on WW(WeenieWatch)? This is not meant to offend or discredit anyone that may have gone down our street slowly yesterday. It’s very funny to me that someone that’s lived in the same neighborhood for forty years would honestly think wizzin’ on the neighbor’s lawn is acceptable behavior. To add insult to injury the owners that got their lawn watered aren’t even in town. This joker next door is probably assigned to watching that house. I would never ask that man to watch my trash can in a wind storm.
The bottom line is life is too short to be angry. It took me along time to learn that. I still get angry from time to time, as we all do. I just try to keep it to myself, and not inflict it on others.
Chris, public peeing isn’t a problem that’s going to be solved easily. LOL. PWCPD is not going to waste tax dollars doing a DNA analysis of the watered patch.
I found zoning – not sure NS was in existance at that time – to be very efficient. One case needed a bit of prodding. Years later when I had occasion to call again, I wasn’t impressed with NS. I’m in a position to know what can and can’t be done as well as what constraints it faces and I felt that NS had dropped the ball. It seems to have improved lately. Maybe the anger from citizens forced it to become more aggressive in solving some issues.
I do think it was “public outcry” that caused them to step up to the plate.
Oh, I was contacting back in the days of Zoning too. I’ve found the follow up and keeping the complaintant up to date to be drastically improved. I also, think they are working more with the citizens making the calls that report violations. I really think they are to be commended for their efforts over the past couple of years. They continue to record number of calls from citizens. I always send “photographic evidence” with my complaints. 🙂
DNA analysis. tee hee! No I’ve seen public peeing from time to time throughtout my life on this block. Nothing new, and it’s not going away. Oh well. I’ll just have to laugh about it.
I must Supervisor Stirrup and his staff where instrumental in getting a meeting set up with Michelle Casiato with the residents. I am very thankful his and staffs efforts. It really made an improvement.
We all walked away with a much better understanding of what NS is faced with. I would also, add Michelle Casiato walked with a better understanding of the citizens in this area. You know a large portion of calls to zoning are right here in the 20109 zip code.
Censored,
Excellent observation by your comment at 4. January 2009, 8:54.
I think there are people who just feed on anger. They have to be pissed off over something. A few velvets come to mind but the condition is not limited to them, for sure.
Watering the lawn…snicker…haven’t heard that one for a few years. I am drawn to 3 ideas. 1. the old man is doing it because he is an old man and he can. 2. He is marking his territory or showing contempt, like a dog. 3. The old man is in the early stages of dementia. If that is the case, it isn’t that unusual.
Does this old guy have family or does he live alone? Perhaps the family needs to be paid a visit.
The man lives with his wife. I’ve lived with dementia & Alzhiemers, and I don’t think that’s the case.
I’m starting to wonder if he might not being “hitting the hooch”. This was an individual lost their license in the 70’s and wasn’t able to drive until the mid 80’s again. In fact, we both got our license about the same time. I do plan on paying his wife a visit. She will not be happy at all. She’s one of immigrant neighbors that’s been a US Citizen, and votes for decades now. She’s from Germany. I’m not going to get too, too worked up over this. As I’ve said this is NOT the first time I’ve seen “unbecoming behavior” from this man. I do want to get along with all my neighbors.
Numbers One and Two above both apply.
“I’m starting to wonder if he might not being “hitting the hooch”.”
Chris, that was the source of the problem in my neighborhood as well. Booze lowered the inhibitions and filled the bladder.
I left off being a drunk. Sorry. Should have added a 4th option.
Robert L. Duecaster has no decency and knows no shame which is evidenced by his diatribe on an American mother and her child. Much has been made on the dark screen about Alanna supposedly calling her children anchor babies. Such is not the case. Her words were to the effect;
According to Robert L. Duecaster on Bvbl (5 Jan 2009 at 5:03 pm: )
Mrs. Almeda is an American born citizen of the United States as are her children. Her husband is a documented immigrant. Her children are not ‘anchor babies,’
To attack people’s families is unconscionable; to single out their children is to exist without honor. In a world where we use civilized manners and apply the laws of decency, people do not direct these sorts of tirades to people’s families simply because of political disagreement.
On that same blog, a thread below where you can find Deucaster’s nasty harangue, there is a thread containing much whining and outrage over a troll remark about the blog owner, Greg LeTiecq’s children. Why do these same rules not apply? Most people find both totally unacceptable. Oddly enough, on BVBL, it is fine to make rude remarks about Alanna and her children and heinous to make rude remarks about Greg’s children. I would say it is wrong to do both.
Thank you ISO Decency for posting your comment here. Robert Duecaster is just a sad human being, to be so hateful and angry.
Duecaster is a racist nutjob and everyone who knows his name also knows this.
Don’t sweat it, Alanna. You know the only reason why they’re so enraged is that you’ve stolen their thunder. They had delusions of grandeur once upon a time. Now they’re nothing. They blame you and they ought to. So you got like 8 or 10 people really angry at you, and the rest of the county is tremendously in your debt.
The hypocrisy is totally amazing. The bullying continues. I just read the thread and the lies over there continue. I don’t know if it is intentional or if some don’t know any better. Some, not all.
Duecaster, monkey and a few others should be ashamed of themselves. UFB.
Justin T is right. When you see the swarming and frothing there on the dark screen, know that you have hit a nerve. Most of the county respects Alanna. There is a small contingency who are in a mindset all of their own who obviously do not appreciate her efforts to force our county to look at a problem with compassionate conservatism. Not every issue can be bull dozed through.
I actually think 95 percent of the county would not recognize Alanna’s name. And, until this Washington Post article, 90 percent had never heard of either blog. But, the people who follow county government and know what’s been happening the past year all appreciate Alanna for rescuing the county from the undue influence of BVBL.
That is why racist nutjob and the rest of the crazies are crazier than usual.
ISO Decency,
I hope your moniker is NOT why you went to bvbl.
Shock jock is for radio. What is comparable for blogging. As for BVBL, decent people don’t go there.
Can you imagine what
Nancy Regean would think of those two! The most conservative blog in VA! LOL.
Marriage of convenience? What the hell is that? What an old fogey term that means nothing. I would say a close to 20 year marriage, a house in the country and 4 kids is hardly a marriage of convenience.
How dare some supercilious fools think they can stand in judgement of someone else’s marriage and family. Marriage and family are the cornerstone of our society. Yet people, under the guise of calling themselves conservatives, attack the very foundation, the building blocks of our society because Mrs. Almeda married an immigrant? Many people have married immigrants.
The truth is, people do not like Mrs. Almeda because she insists that our county treat people with respect and that they not be reduced to sound bites and called names. That’s really all its about. Some folks don’t like being held to that high of a standard.
Excellent post M-H!!!!!!
Family values must be the cornerstone of the republican platfrom that some on BVBL, like its owner, must have forgotten!
Well MH it can’t get much lower than this. You can’t teach or shame people like them. They are devoid of any breeding and nothing can make up for what is missing genetically.