Tomorrow  the chickens will come home to roost. Many people are predicting a huge shock. Tomorrow, County Executive Craig Gerhart will present the FY10 Proposed Fiscal Plan.

Don’t go looking for any preliminary information. It isn’t there.

This Item Will Be Made Available At The Meeting

Are we going with the 10%, 20% or 30% plan? Will we have any services? Will we have a police department, considering local and state cuts in this area? (Police Officers Converge on the State Capitol Thursday)
Will we have parks, libraries? How many employees will still have jobs? How about our firefighters and emergency responders? Many are volunteer but not all. Will promises made to them be kept?

There will be 2 public hearings tomorrow. Additionally, there will be 2 Citizens’ Times. It sounds like a full day, beginning at 2 p.m.

Prediction: Many people will go to bed with good old fashioned sticker shock.

Agenda
 

53 Thoughts to “FY10 Proposed Fiscal Plan Unveiled @ BOCS Meeting”

  1. Please note part of the plan is to can all affordable housing for the next 20 years.

    I kid you not. It’s in the long-range plan.

  2. Moon-howler

    PAP, please elaborate.

  3. Alanna

    20 years? Why not 5 or 10, why 20?

  4. Stewart says we have plenty of foreclosures to ensure affordable housing. We don’t need to mandate developers to create more. Thus, he advocates against affordable housing for the next 20 years.

    Ironically, he has established an affordable housing plan for employees. So there is obviously some need for it.

    Alanna, great question. I can see putting it off for 5 years until the market stabilizes, but 20? Not only does that show a complete lack of responsible planning, it shows an arrogant assumption that people are all as well off as BOCS members.

  5. Opinion

    I saw this letter in today’s paper. This will be the topic of tomorrow evening’s BOCS meeting. If you are interested in saving a local wetland, you might want to attend.

    Help save a local wetland

    Your View
    Published: February 16, 2009

    I believe we need to save a wetland that contains a natural spring and a perennial stream on the corner of Hoadly and Prince William Parkway.

    It’s the perfect ecosystem for salamanders and frogs, plus the many wetland plants such as the Cardinal Flower, which is seen blossoming there in the spring. Migrating birds are seen landing and
    feasting on the bounty that nature provided for them.

    Prince William County doesn’t realize that this land is beautiful and that it should be saved as open space. County residents can learn about nature on this land. There is not enough staff or revenue for
    the environmental department to map out the perennial streams and wetlands before a developer takes over a piece of property.

    On Feb. 17, members of the Board of County Supervisors are going to hear a developer call this land “Village on the Parkway.” The developer is going to build the same old buildings that already exist in
    PWC.

    I say we should conserve this land by making it a permanent easement, and we should allow citizens and scientists to study this natural ecosystem. High rises can be built around it without disturbing
    this precious piece of historic nature.

    In fact, the land around this parcel will become more valuable. Who doesn’t want nature to be in the back yard? High-end businesses look for land that contains nature so their employees can enjoy it
    during their breaks.

    We have to think of our future. Do we want to look like Arlington? Do we want to look like Fairfax? No. We moved here because we want open space and nature, not the same old buildings over and over
    again.

    CINDY PATTERSON

    Southbridge

  6. DiversityGal

    Just saw Greg on Channel 4…

  7. Rasputin

    Trying to figure him out. So HSM is against illegal immigration but supports the woman who allegedly got roughed up by a MP cop? Is there any proof that the police officer acted inappropriately? Was he not injured? Last I heard, the state cops were doing an investigation and the woman still has not filed a formal complaint. Typical HSM shooting from the hip, asking questions later.

    Why would HSM go out on a limb over an incident when the facts are so sketchy? Are they trying to lose all credibility? So HSM supported part of the demonstration but not all of it. That’s an uncomfortable position to be in.

    Waiting for the facts to come out seems like it would prevent these types of situations from occurring. The organization is gasping to stay alive in the first place and now its leader paints the organization in a corner. All the grafitti washing in the world is not going to right this inconsistency.

  8. Charlie

    Rasputin,

    It is because GL despises any authority figure in Manassas Park, more than he despises an Immigrant (legal or illegal).

  9. Here’s part of the article on housing:

    “The Prince William Board of County Supervisors is scheduled to vote Tuesday on changes to its long-term housing plan that community groups say address only the temporary glut of homes on the market and not the ongoing needs of low-income working families.

    The update to the housing chapter of the Comprehensive Plan is designed to guide development for 20 years.

    Most of the modifications eliminate references to the county’s need for more affordable housing. Board Chairman Corey A. Stewart (R-At Large) took them out because he said the county cannot support the construction of more homes in a flooded market.”

    see http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/02/14/AR2009021400024.html

  10. SecondAlamo

    Talk about making statements before facts. Last nights news reported the incident as a brutal beating by police. If that’s the most damage done in a brutal beating by police, then the illegals have nothing to fear. How about a few snap shots of some MS-13 beating victims for some fair and balanced reporting? No lawsuit yet? No wonder she talks through an interpreter.

  11. Slowpoke Rodriguez

    Moon-Howler, you only forgot one thing in your points on the budget….all will be summarily blamed on the Resolution.

  12. Moon-howler

    Slow, I doubt if we will hear that from the dais. From the rest of us earthlings, you might hear some rumblings about how the resolution impacted our local economy. Surely you cannot deny that there was SOME impact. I don’t see how PWC got to be number one in foreclosures in the state without taking some of our local politics into account.

    SA, you don’t have to go very far to hear or read about that ‘beating.’ Not only is the new making statements before facts, so is the King of the Black Velvets. There is an entire thread dedicated to evil MPPD. I suggest we wait until facts are in. Also, Charlie @1:25 might be on to something.

  13. Moon-howler

    Thanks for that update, Opinion. I would have missed it. It seems so easy to just bulldoze over things in the name of progress.

  14. Conservador

    What some in the conservative movement would like you to think is that Conservative Republicans are racists and that there is no room in the political party for you if you are not part of the hatred message towards undocumented immigrants. That is a well planned tactic created in America and if we read history we might find past similarities in our country. It is a tactic to scare people from the participation of the vast majority of concerned citizens into the political process. If these people keep others away from participating in the political process of the Republican Party, then it is an open field for them to make policy, arguments and agendas on how to run the future of our community. This influence by fear, hate, discrimination, exclusion, and many other arguments have been used by movements in the past. It is to their advantage to have the community divided in the topic of immigration and to not focus on any other problem in the county or country. I will not be subject to exclusion and distance from my conservative principles from any groups that foment hatred and fear.
    We need to look for the future of our county; we need an economical growth plan, a financially responsible budget, schools that will make greater students, a solution to the worse housing market in Virginia, and many other problems that require leaders committed to our needs and not to their own need. Some of these political figures grow so full of them selves that they begin to believe that we can’t make it without their being in power. It is time for many of us to be more active in what you believe. Some of you might not like me for being a Republican, but that is what America is all about; political freedom and freedom of speech.

  15. anona

    Whoa. I think there is a little confusion over the long term effects of the Comprehensive Plan. Although the Comprehensive Plan is designed to be the general direction that the county is taking, by state mandate that plan is reviewed every 5 years. What is put in place now is NOT in stone for 20 years but more of a plan that will be looked at again in 5 years and adjustments can and will be made in the next plan cycle.

    The Comprehensive Plan is what each proposed development project is measured against to see whether it complies or doesn’t comply. A heck of a lot can change in 5 years: supervisors change, the planning staff and planning commissioners change. 5 years can completely change the Plan.

    Think of it this way, if they wrote the new section of the housing plan like they were expecting major apartment shortages for affordable housing, then every developer that came in with a plan for apartments or townhomes would be approved because technically they “complied” with our plan. Do you really want every square inch of what land is left covered with apartments or townhomes? I would guess the answer is no. A glut of homes right now doesn’t help anyone. So this version of the housing section is probably appropriate for our economic picture at this time to protect our fragile real estate market.

    In 5 years, perhaps the economy and our local real estate market is back on the road to recovery. Then when they start reviewing that section of the plan, they will make adjustments to allow more apartment type dwellings, multi family units or townhomes or more changes deemed appropriate for affordable housing. In the immediate meantime if there is an economic change, every March the BOCS considers changes to the Comp Plan known as Comp Plan amendments. So next year if we had a miraculous real estate turnaround and people were beating down the doors of the apartment complexes begging for units, the board would have the opportunity to approve an amendment to the plan by approving any developer’s project for affordable housing.

    Every county should have affordable workforce housing and this part of the plan may have been entirely different if it had been written 3 years ago instead of today. But with prices going down 40-60%, previously unaffordable housing has become affordable. Even rents are stagnant, which means there is not a strong demand in the rental market to move prices up. Thus the entire county has essentially gone from being unaffordable to affordable and this review plan should reflect that for the next 5 years.

  16. Alanna

    Welcome Conservador.

    I agree it is incumbent upon each on of us to be participants in this democracy. We can not allow any individuals or groups that rely on hatred and bigotry to be in power.

    Also, I agree with your vision for the future.

    Let me just add, nobody should like or dislike any individual solely for party affiliation.

  17. Poor Richard

    “We have studied the ratio of median home value to median household income.
    This ranges from a low of 3.55 in Manassas Park to a high of 6.09 in Falls Church,
    suggesting that the City of Manassas Park is the most affordable area within the region
    and the City of Falls Church is the least affordable. With a ration of 4.35, the City of
    Manassas is the second most affordable area in the region. (PWC- 4.75). The average ratio of median income for the MSA is 5.06 nationwide. This illustrates that the MSA
    is far less affordable than the national average and the City of Manassas is relatively
    affordable when compared to the region, as a whole.”
    Affordable Housing Needs Assessment
    For The City of Manassas (October 2006)
    Novogradac & Co. LLP
    Thoughts:
    – Granted, much has changed since 2006, but I imagine the ratios are still close
    to the same. Both average housing cost and income have fallen.
    -Immigrants, seeking the most affordable housing, helped push prices up rapidly
    in the boom years and drive them back down by leaving in the bust years.
    (The extremes on both sides, I think, credit/discredit the “resolution” too much
    – it was and is the economy – no jobs – no magnet for new workers).
    – Manassas City, MP and PWC have a great deal more affordable housing than
    the other jurisdictions in NoVa. The focus now should be to maintain and
    nurture the current stock of affordable housing more than adding to it.

  18. Conservador

    Alanna thank you for the welcoming comment and to anona, it is good that you are clarifying the confusion of the plan. I would like to ask if some knows; what are the PW County Supervisors doing to prevent the bad economy? Also what is their plan to activate the economy of our county? The future of the county will be determined by how we can attract new people to the area, new business and how friendly the county is going to be. Business people in the county are not happy and many are thinking that the Board of Supervisors is not doing enough to address the problem of division, intolerance and in-the-closet segregation. It has been called to my attention that business licenses are being targeted with more red tape. We need businesses and jobs and not necessarily more government walls.
    The recent stimulus bill (a bill that I think is a bad deal) that passed in the Congress, Senate and is now ready to be signed by the President is going to bring billions to the economy. Many of these jobs are going to be in construction. Is the county blind that thousands of people are going to go back to work? Companies that will be looking for workers might want to be establishing in PW; are we ready for the future? Or we are going to drum up the intolerance, exclusiveness, and all these other factors that will not welcome anyone once again.

  19. Moon-howler

    Corey Stewart thinks cheaper is better. I don’t want to live somewhere cheap.

    Mr. Jenkins makes sense. Raise the tax rate because it can always be lowered. The county needs to be able to provide services. He is showing leadership and vision. He is also preparing for a rainy day and not boxing us in.

  20. Conservador

    With all due respect Moon-Howler, I have never seen a tax lowered. I have the opportunity of moving my business to any other county, and why not? If it becomes expensive to live here, I will move my residence too. We can create more revenue and make adjustments like everyone is doing in this difficult economic situation. My previous post has referred to what the PW supervisors are doing. Our business is doing fairly well so far, compared to previous years. We are hoping to keep it that way for the rest of the year. More taxes to my business are a bad deal for us under the economic circumstances.
    If we pay more, let’s say 3% more in taxes, it will cost my business between seven to ten thousand dollars extra per year (some people might say, that it is not to much. You are rich; you can afford it!). That means that I have to increase my gross revenue another $150,000.00 to offset the tax increase. First, the economy is not going to give me that possibility now. Second, that means that I have to risk $150,000.00 dollars to make the 3% tax payment. Also, I have to make sure that I get a profit and still be able to control costs, payroll and possible extras in the business.
    Increased taxes to citizens and businesses are some of the things that we in PW should not consider now. By the way, I am not rich…..

  21. Of course the resolution has drastically magnified the effects of a general economic downturn.

    Otherwise, the number of foreclosures would be in the same ballpark as the other counties. It would not be off the scale. The resolution is the only explanation.

    And now all the new businesses to serve immigrants are leaving, and none will be coming to take their place.

    Why would anyone open a business here, when a quarter of the population has been ethnically removed? A business needs clients, doesn’t it?

  22. Moon-howler

    This would be an advertised rate, not a set rate. The bottom line is, business will not want to move in to the county if we have crappy schools, outdated libraries, and limited recreational facilities.

    I think we need to set a higher tax rate so there is some wiggle room. Corey wants to have that no new taxes wrapped around his neck. I don’t like paying taxes any more than the next guy. However, I like having services and not being ashamed to say I live in Prince William County.

  23. GainesvilleResident

    MH – I don’t get it – what’s the difference between an “advertised rate” and a “set rate”. In any event, in the long run all that matters will be whatever the tax rate is once it gets determined.

    Anyway, I notice they put up the presentation “Proposed FY 2010 Fiscal Plan” at http://www.pwcgov.org/docLibrary/PDF/009675.pdf

  24. ShellyB

    I can’t believe Corey Stewart is this bleeping dumb. Doesn’t he know that a lack of affordable housing is what created the problem he was chest-beating so much about solving????!!!! That, combined with greedy developers and an imprudent BOCS approving way too much building, meant that you had new immigrants, many with darker complexions, living in residential neighborhoods instead of in affordable housing areas. This created an opening for the creation of Help Save Manassas, which through their extreme tactics divided the county and blinded us from the real challenges that we faced! We got caught up in “who is an immigrant” and “who is a patriot” and “who is not from here” rather than asking “who is ready to meet the challenges of an economic downturn?”

    So now Captain Corey wants the foreclosure crisis, which he helped create, to be the answer for affordable housing?!?!!?!! Don’t you realize that if the majority of houses in our streets become affordable housing rental units, we’ll start the same cycle going again? How blind is this guy?

    Conservador, you make a lot of sense. I would like to see people like you come to represent the Republican party, both here and in national politics. We can’t afford to have the “here’s who we hate” crowd dominate the Republicans.

  25. Yes. People want to complain about over-crowding in homes, but then Corey doesn’t want to make homes affordable.

    HSM and company, he isn’t solving your alleged problem.

  26. Conservador

    Moon-Howler, you missed my point. What it is wrong with creating incentives for industry to move in to the county? Why not create an atmosphere of inclusiveness and welcoming to invited new or previous residents? How about inviting future companies to invest in PW? Why don’t we ask the county supervisors to be preparing for the future economy? I live here, my business residence is PW, I can pay maybe some extra real state tax or other personal taxes but, my company can’t afford any new or extra increases in taxes. My company is capable of functioning in any other county or state if I choose to do so, and with an increase in taxes that will be what I will have to do.
    Do you think that at the present situation it is feasible to increase taxes for businesses that are laying-off employees, and are reducing productivity because the US economy is in contraction? I pay 3.7% in business property tax. This means that I pay for every tool, equipment working or not working, trucks, machines, etc….. Most companies have thousands of dollars invested in equipment and machinery; most of the time this equipment is idle. Business property taxes have to be paid, equipment loans have to be paid, work has to be found for employees to be working and most of these companies don’t have a bright future.
    The business community is worried about the global economy. People are concerned about their jobs. Companies are being bailed out; people are losing their houses because they have lost their employment and others because they got a crappy mortgage deal. Hey, I have a business; I’m not asking the Feds for a hand out, or a bail out, just asking the government officials to take action by creating a better place for people and business in the county.
    First you make the money, and then you pay taxes. Later you take those taxes and provide services to the community. You are asking businesses and people to pay more when most people have less. That doesn’t sound right to me. Look around; ask people what they think of the economic situation, ask employees, ask businesses and especially ask minority and small business owners.

  27. Moon-howler

    The advertised rate is what the supervisors post as a maximum tax. It does not have to go that high. IN fact, I believe last years’ advertised rate was more than the final set rate.

    The final tax rate is set by May 1 (I think that is the date). It cannot be higher than the advertised rate but it can be lower.

    Any my point is, the future is somewhat uncertain. Set the rate higher so it can be higher if need be.

    You all must pardon me if I look at things from a non-business point of view. Actually, PWC has always tried to attract business. Sometimes it has been a raging battle. Other times things have been smooth. However, the county must also provide services for the bedroomers…those of us who live here and send our kids to school here. We want quality of life services like parks and open spaces. We want to feel safe in our communities. We want police response when we call and our fires put out.

    The taxes will supposedly be lower this year for each residence. We shall see. Meanwhile I am going to be pulling for the Caddigan/Jenkins money solution which is to go in with the higher ADVERTISED rate to allow leeway.

  28. ShellyB

    I hear you Conservador. Our county needs to make things more inviting for business owners. Not less inviting. Let’s hope Corey Stewart was sincere when he said he’d rather focus on pocketbook issues. Our situation is too dire to allow people to use our local government as a way of expressing their social and cultural resentments.

  29. Moon-howler

    and Conservador, I don’t think I missed your point. I think my priorities are different.
    I am all for business incentives, just not at the expense of schools, libraries, parks, roads, beautification. I get the impression you are new to PWC.

  30. ShellyB

    M-H, if only we could raise taxes on the bedroomers but not raise taxes on business owners. But I’m told that it is impossible to change this strange rule. That would be the solution I could go for, even though my family is a bedroomer family!

  31. Conservador

    M-H, what do you consider new to PWC?

  32. Lucky Duck

    ShellyB, I believe to have different rates on Commerical and Residential requires an act of the General Assembley (to grant authority) and good luck getting anything passed in one of the most dysfunctional State governmental bodies in the US. The State House and Senate are polar opposites and we’re stuck in the middle.

  33. Conservador

    M-H I’m still want to know what it is consider new to PWC?
    Can anyone help to define “new” to PWC?

  34. ShellyB

    Conservador, my guess is that “new” is a way of saying people who arrived recently. The irony of ironies is that the Immigration Resolution, and all the damage it has done to our economy and our reputation, was championed by three people who do not have long term ties to our county: Greg Leteicq, John Stirrup, and Corey Stewart.

    Then, come to find out, the Resolution was written by an anti-immigration lobbying firm in Washington DC. So it just feels like a slap in the face for people who have the kind of ties to a community that you can develop over two or three decades, or a lifetime.

    This is not to say that we feel that people who came here from Arlington to have a bigger house shouldn’t have some say in how we define our priorities in PWC. But now that we are suffering the consequences, it is more than just the feeling of powerlessness but also a feeling of regret that our government was so easily overrun and thrown off in the wrong direction at JUST THE WRONG TIME.

  35. ShellyB

    By just the wrong time, let me explain. In 2007, all the warning signs were there for the national economic collapse, but we were so distracted by the false “immigration crisis” that was being generated for an election and that’s it.

    We knew the housing bubble had burst, and anyone will tell you that if property tax is your main source of revenue for government services, then PWC was going to be in for a rough year. But instead of preparing for that, we got this stupid immigration hysterics to distract the people and the government as well.

    What were they thinking????

    Certain people just wanted us to focus on immigration. Immigration was a superficial issue compared to the economic life blood of the county budget going bust. Was this just a distraction campaign? An act of evasion? The Board of Supervisors KNEW this was coming, and yet they voted for a policy that spent a whole lot of money, millions of dollars we didn’t have, in order to FURTHER DAMAGE OUR LOCAL ECONOMY!

    I blame myself too. We were all distracted. How could we be so easily distracted by someone like Gospel Greg Letiecq?

    We could have been preparing for lean times. Instead we made it worse by destroying the fabric of our community, making businesses feel unwelcome, causing people to abandon mortgages and abandon homes. It’s not fair that we have to deal with PWC economic blunders on top of federal economic blunders at the same time.

    Sorry. I’m just really anxious about the future.

  36. Any high tax rate is irresponsible right now. People should be allowed to save as much money as they can in order to weather the financial storm that’s coming.

    People should be encouraged to do for themselves because you’ll be forced to do that anyway by the circumstances. Instead of more police, encourage more people to purchase firearms and open carry. Instead of more firemen, encourage and educate more people on how to make their homes more fireproof.

    Forget about parks. Forget about wildlife. Build a factory there if you can. I’m not kidding. The news around the world is very bad and getting worse. People are starting to riot in country after country. Iceland used to be a first world country. Almost overnight, they’ve been wiped out. Eastern Europe could implode if Western Europe does not give them massive aid. But what aid can anyone give anyone? Schwarzenegger is sending out 20,000 pink slips on Tuesday. Tax refund checks in CA and Kansas have been halted.
    Everything that is not an essential service should be cut and every effort should be made to attract new business. Repealing the resolution is only one step in that direction, but it’s an important step. Circumstances will force us to cut nonessential services anyways. Raising the tax rate is nuts.

  37. Conservador

    Thank you ShellyB for the explanation, I am grateful that you took the time to explain what the word “new” meant.
    Perception and assumption are two situations that I always try to avoid. I don’t ask people what they feel; I like to put myself in their position to analyze objectively and not only from my point of view. I learn by experience first hand if I can and not only by reading something. I like to investigate and make as few assumptions as possible. I like to know from within to have a real prospective and not to fall on the wrong perception.
    I raised two beautiful daughters here in PWC and bought my home here 14 years ago. I built and created a business from the start in PWC 7 years ago. My wife and her family have owned property and businesses in PWC for 30 years.
    I don’t know if I am considered new or old, but the sentence “new to PWC” was not a sentence of inclusiveness; the fact that I am a resident new or old of the county doesn’t give me less knowledge of the situation that the county is going through, like you say ShellyB.
    My priorities are not only for me and my family, but for the families that depend on the jobs that I provide, my employees and their families. Those families have children that reside in Manassas and are counting on the employment as well as I am counting on their wonderful work ethics that they provide to my company.
    Looking from a non-business point of view would be like me saying, I only think of my business and not the county and the people that are present here.
    M-h, I don’t expect you to think like me or to share my point of view, but you should consider thinking about the employees in the private sector, the business people that provide revenue for the services that “we the people” of PWC receive; services that most of us will never be able to pay for in taxes.

  38. Moon-howler

    Shelly, Thanks, that pretty much summed it up. Thanks for filling in for my answer. Sorry, I don’t blog 24/7 and was watching TV.

    Conservador, I suggested you were new to PW because you didn’t seem aware of some of the things that have gone on in the past to attact business and to make PWC the fine place it used to be. As for what ‘new’ means…it depends on who you ask. There are people who blog here who would say less than 20 years, you are a newbie. Some people have even tougher standards.

    Too bad we cannot have a different business tax rate from residential. However, if we keep business happy, there go the schools, there go the libraries, our PD is shorted as are the firefighters. Not to go full circle but what businesses will want to come into the county if there are bad schools, high crime rate, libraries with limited areas and run down, understaffed parks? Successful businesses generally want to hire high quality people who value the things I just mentioned.

  39. anona

    There was proposed legislation that was proposed that would let the board bifurcate the rate for business and residential, but I’m not sure if it died in committee.

    The rate they’ve currently set will raise business taxes 5% and lower residential taxes. That is because homes have decreased in value but commercial property has gone up, although that will likely be headed south by next year too.

    So by imposing an even higher rate for businesses than the currently proposed 5%, we are going to lose prospective businesses and that is the last thing we want to do.

    The BOCS has flexibility. They can leave the rate as proposed, but give schools a set amount on top of that. That might be away to help the schools out without raising the tax rate. As far as people being willing to pay more to have better schools, in normal times I’d agree. But people are desperate right now to hold on to their pennies. Their homes have lost tremendous value and their stock portfolios have also gone down. Retirees and fixed income people are hurting and to see taxes go up is going to really hurt them.

    I wouldn’t quibble over a penny or two but anything more than 5 cents is going to hurt business and fixed income people. I’m not sure any supervisor is willing to go that far during the crisis we have now.

  40. Chris

    “New” is NOT necessarily a bad term. I would say “new” is like “beauty”..it’s in the eyes of the the beholder. 😉

    Well, if my tax bill savings is the projected $548 less. And if high school sports in the PWCPS start charging a fee of $50 per season(possiblity, not yet a reality). There goes $150 of my savings. I’m left to wonder how much will that savings really be after paying for services that had previously been included in my real estate tax bill. Some how I’m left to believe I’ll be spending that $548 plus some. So, is there a real savings?

  41. D. Bornstein

    Large and small businesses choose areas that are advantageous from the standpoint of profitability; it might sound cold, but it’s that simple. The benefits of doing business here have to outweigh the costs. If it’s not cost effective, than the business will find another area where it can profit. If you raise the business tax rates higher than they are in other areas, you’ll push the bussiness out along with their tax dollars and the jobs they provide. I’m speaking as a businessowner and as a PW resident.
    Conservador: If they raise the taxes in PW County you could move your company. I’m checking rates elsewhere just to be proactive and I’ll let you know what I find.

  42. Moon-howler

    Taxes aren’t going up on residences. They will all go down. Everyone has lost home value. Here is an explanation of the disagreement between Jenkins and Stewart from insidenova:

    Already, the rate caused some board dissension.

    “I would hope we could advertise a tax rate much higher,” said Supervisor John Jenkins, D-Neabsco, during Tuesday’s board meeting at the McCoart Administration Building. “There are some very serious cuts here … and I hope the rate is high enough to give some latitude … and some room to manipulate the numbers.”

    But that’s exactly the wrong attitude, said Chairman Corey Stewart, R-at large.

    “This board issued guidance to county staff in October. You’ve given us a budget based on that guidance,” Stewart said. “It’s taken a tremendous amount of effort to get the budget whittled … and the only thing the board can do is now support you.

    “If we leave it open,” he continued, “the debate would become much larger and [focus] on how much we’re going to spend, rather then how [to keep within budget].”
    That’s what happened last year, when supervisors could not agree on a tax rate to set for advertisement and budget discussions were alternately contentious and delayed. The significance of setting a rate to advertise — which the board has scheduled for early March — is that it reflects the highest level the county can then legally adopt.

  43. Charlie

    The issue is that the real rate cannot exceed the advertised rate, it can be lower.

    Have they reassed the properties yet, do they really know how much will be coming in – they should not box themselves in. Last year, it was a big deal to keep the advertised rate below $1.

  44. Conservador

    Tax payers pay many taxes and expect the best use of their tax dollars. We do not want wasteful spending, and like wise, as consumers we want the best deal for our money.
    I’m married with two children living in PWC. Do my taxes really pay in full the education that my children are receiving in the county? Is the amount of property taxes and personal income sufficient to pay for the quality of services that I’m obtaining in the county? PWC residents have to be sensible and understand that we can’t ask the private sector and the people of the county to foot the bill for everything that we wish. The county supervisors are responsible for the economic situation that the county faces. They are responsible for the solutions that they will implement. I’m expecting an expedited plan of action for how to attract business and residents quickly back into the county. Also they will be responsible for the language, tone and respect that they will transmit to the businesses and the people as the prime embodiment of the county.

  45. Moon-howler

    Charlie, I don’t believe the new assessments are in. I know I sure haven’t gotten my new tax notice. I also do not see it on landrover.

    We are in agreement. Don’t box yourself in, supervisors. (especially for political gain, Corey)

  46. Opinion

    I was talking about tax rates with a wise man yesterday. To paraphrase, he said, “first figure out what services you want to provide, than tax accordingly to pay for them.” He was quoting John McCain (who, fortunately, is back to the “John McCain” I’m rather fond of).

    I believe Corey Stewart is looking at County tax policy “backwards”. He is focusing on the tax rate first, then attempting to see how many services fit within the rate (sort of like bringing the wrong bucket to a fire… if it’s not a big enough bucket, the house burns down).

    We should focus on the services we want the County to provide its citizens, and then determine the tax rate to support these services. Once a model is constructed using these parameters, it is possible to re-evaluate the size and priorities of services the County provides in the context of the rate (or resulting revenue) that is required to support them. I suggest that the upper bound for the tax rate be current actual tax bills (not the current rate) and that Corey Stewart’s proposed number ($1.13, I believe) perhaps be the lower bound. The answer is somewhere in the middle and driven by data on how much the County can actually produce in revenue in the current economic environment (considering the jobs situation, home values, other revenue sources, etc.). Simply put, it’s a math problem (and , I believe, a nice Linear Programming problem).

    John Jenkins has a pragmatic approach. He would like to advertise a higher rate than is suggested by the Chairman so the County has a bit of flexibility in establishing the actual tax rate (Charlie’s assessment, above, is correct. The rate cannot exceed the advertised rate; however, it can be lower). As a matter of policy, Supervisor Jenkins approach would give the County the ability to focus on services vice driving to a number.

  47. anona

    “I’m left to wonder how much will that savings really be after paying for services that had previously been included in my real estate tax bill.”

    You make a very good point. I also have kids in high school sports, and middle school sports. But I guess if my taxes go down and then I use that money to pay for the sports it actually works out a fair trade during bad budget times.I don’t even mind paying a little extra in the sports fee if it means helping out less fortunate families so their kids can be involved. And I would rather me and my husband pay for it by fee since my kids are involved than my in laws who are living on fixed income. I would feel guilty that my in laws would have less money for monthly groceries for example,if the tax rate was set higher, just so my kids could play middle and high school sports. Once the economy gets better, we can get rid of the fee.

    Now if you are talking police and fire support, that is different. Essential services must be paid for, but sports? The kindergarten assistant cuts and increasing class sizes worry me more. But a tax rate hike so we can pay for sports when people are cutting everywhere and seniors are going without groceries or all their medications is kind of sad.

  48. D. Bornstein

    Anona, I agree. I preferred to pay for the special programs my kids had also, rather than letting it be a tax burden to someone struggling to pay for meds. Just recently I witnessed the look on an elderly woman’s face at a pharmacy when she was told her meds were $80 (with insurance, without it was $350). I could tell she was wondering what else she could do without in order to pay the $80.
    Just a general note on the present living standards in PW County compared to when I was a child: My father came to PW to open a restaurant in Centreville on Rte 28 in the 70’s when all of the homes within 5 miles had out -houses- No indoor plumbing. We used to find neighbors in our restrooms taking sponge baths and brushing their teeth.It was businessmen like him who built this county by struggling to survive and generate tax dollars. Businesses still struggle the same way. The county should always remember to not bite the hand that feeds it.

  49. Chris

    I’m more than willing to pay for these services(high school sports). I’m just trying to point out one way that the “savings” will get spent out of my/our pocket(s). We might be paying more to visit the pools and water parks in the county too. Frankly, I’m in favor of realistic tax rate, and not one that’s the lowest in the region.

    I certainly don’t want seniors to suffer. I’m of the “sandwich generation”. I want programs in place for our most vulnerable. I want businesses to locate in the county as well.

    The county does have some type of senior drug discount program. However, I don’t think it gets the publicity it deserves. I’ve heard John Jenkins promote the program. Information is here, and it offers a discount.
    http://www.pwcgov.org/default.aspx?topic=010009000850003416

  50. Moon-howler

    Chris, I think it would be cheaper for the average tax payer to pay taxes than to get nickel-dimed to death for some of these things.

    I would always trust Mr. Jenkins and Ms. Caddigan on budget matters. Does anyone need to review the film footage which both supervisors try to warn the others of the error of their ways?

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