This is the human side of separating families due to immigration status. Who takes care of the children if we deport the parents?
This article by Linda Chavez sheds new light on this very complicated issue.
A new report out last week from the Pew Hispanic Center confirms what many observers already suspected about the illegal immigrant population in the United States: It is made up increasingly of intact families and their American-born children. Nearly half of illegal immigrant households consist of two-parent families with children, and 73 percent of these children were born here and are therefore U.S. citizens.
How does the new population of immigrants hearken to your ancestors and mine? Although the immigrants who graduate high school strive to attain some college education, the reality is that their long term earning “prognosis” is poor indeed.
The greater concern for some opponents of immigration – legal and illegal – is the fear that these newcomers will never fully adapt, won’t learn English, will remain poor and uneducated, and transform the United States into a replica of Mexico or some other Latin American country. The same fears led Americans of the mid-19th century to fear German and Irish immigrants, and in the early 20th century to fear Italians, Jews, Poles, and others from Eastern and Southern Europe.
Such worries are no more rational today – or born out of actual evidence – than they were a hundred years ago. It is true that Hispanic immigrants today take awhile to catch up with the native born just as their European predecessors did, and illegal immigrants never fully do so in terms of education or earnings.
Given the reality of this population, how do we deal with their presence in a humane and fiscally responsible manner?
The fact that so many illegal immigrants are intertwined with American citizens or legal residents, either as spouses or parents, should give pause to those who’d like to see all illegal immigrants rounded up and deported or their lives made so miserable they leave on their own. A better approach would allow those who have made their lives here, established families, bought homes, worked continuously and paid taxes to remain after paying fines, demonstrating English fluency, and proving they have no criminal record. Such an approach is as much about supporting family values as it is granting amnesty.
This is a very well reasoned essay but it is based on data and information. I don’t see the two sides coming to an agreement because the anti-immigrant folks have their own “data” and their own “information.” Plus a thirst for vengeance that is basically the opposite of “amnesty” even with fines and learning English and proving they have no criminal record. In other words, the anti-immigrant types are not interested in facts, data, information, or solutions. They want revenge, even if it hurts our country. Who knows better than we do in PWC.
If we don’t base policy decisions on data and information, then what on earth DO we base them on? Policy made in an absence of information, based entirely on conjecture and assumption, is destined to be BAD policy.
We can’t dismiss real data and real information just because a small but fearsome minority wishes to dismiss it. The way forward is to neutralize that small but fearsome minority WITH DATA AND INFORMATION. Even if they turn a blind eye, the American people will not.
After all, there is no Corey Stewart at the Federal level.
My issue with this report has to do with the part that says “The greater concern for some opponents of immigration – legal and illegal…”. I don’t think that many people are concerned about legal immigrants at all. Just the tens, if not hundreds, of thousands of people who come here illegally each year. No idea of who is coming, their intentions, no health screening, no criminal back ground checks, etc…
Before any reform can be done the border MUST first be secured.
Hello, but who was it that decided that Americans should suddenly be so concerned about illegal immigration, and not, say, gay marriage, or Saddam Hussien? Why did Lou Dobbs and Rush Limbaugh suddenly switch topics. Did it strike you as odd when you read in this article that the fervor over undocumented immigrants was orchestrated during a time when illegal immigration was abating?
The answer is clear if you trace it all back to its roots. The article is referring to the root organizations that openly oppose all immigration, legal and illegal, and have for generations. These groups are the ones feeding you the “reports” and “claims” trying to create the necessary fear. It was one of these groups that wrote our Immigration Resolution, but also provided many of the “reports” and “claims” to frighten people into supporting it. They are not ashamed to say they oppose all immigration, legal and illegal.
I understand if that’s not where you are coming from, and I understand if you’d like to distance yourself from that. But most people who say that wouldn’t even be paying attention to the issue if their televisions and radios hadn’t directed them to.
Trust me Witness Too, where I live I didn’t need any group to bring up the issue for me to think about it. I’ve been concerned about illegal immigration for quite some time now. I don’t give much credit to groups who oppose LEGAL immigration nor do I give much credit to groups who label the American Legion a ‘hate group’.
Like I said before, it’s a waste of time to discuss any type of reform without first securing our boarders.
Linda Chavez, an illegal alien apologist, creates a false dilemma. She states that deporting illegal aliens will break-up families, but fails to consider another option, which is to bring their families with them. As someone who has lived in Europe, spent significant time in the Middle East and Canada, I can state categorically that people can and do take their families out of the US for extended periods.
I propose that any person discovered to be living in the US illegally should be deported without regard to family situation. In the interest of family unity, the US should provide free transportation for family members to the illegal’s native country. If the offer is refused, then a family separation will exist until the alien applies for and is granted legal entry.
Before you accuse me of cruelty, remember that our military families experience similar hardships in the service of our country. And they are not guilty of any crimes.
But paying a fine is not good enough — that will just become the price for amnesty.
Oh no, the dreaded “illegal alien apologist” title…eeeek.
“kelly”,
The reality is that children raised as united states citizens, having lived in this country their entire lives, are not going to go anywhere. I highly doubt that scenario. As Linda Chavez described, for those people who have been working and living a “clean” life, they should have a path to required legalization.
and it is a shame that they put criminals into prison, and seperate them from their families too. So, should it be proposed that all criminals be put on work release, or home release so that families are not seperated??
Elena, what exactly do you deem a “clean” life? Is breaking only some laws but not others “clean”? Is driving without a license “clean”, is driving without insurance “clean”, is committing identity theft by using a false SSN “clean”, is getting paid under the table “clean”, is not paying taxes “clean” (aside from our current administrations staff of course ;-)), what is “clean”?
Look, one thing that gets lost in this debate is that what these parents did to get here or stay here illegally is wrong. They knew it when they did it plain and simple. It’s not the kids fault at all, but when does any kind of personal responsibility come into play? They can cry foul all day long and pull the ‘my child is a U.S. citizen’ card but they can’t admit that what they did, and did on purpose, was a direct result of their own actions?
Secure the boarder, then discuss reform.
I think that we can all agree that the children are the victims in this situation. The question is, do you blame existing laws or do you blame the people responsible for knowingly and directly putting these children in this predicament?
To some how say that families are being broken up by these laws is to ignore the fact that these parents knew what they were doing and knew what could happen if they were caught.
To the Most Recent Posters above:
Yes, I knew I was marrying an illegal immigrant. I also knew that this is supposed to be “the land of the free” and one would think that would include the freedom to marry the person of my choosing and the reasonable assumption that they could then go through a process to be recognized as a legal resident. In fact, at the time of our marriage, that was the case…the law changed about just about a month after we got married and we did not have the money to file the paperwork at that time. By the time we did, the law had changed. I should not have to worry that should I be killed on the Beltway that my son’s father could possibly be deported. I just shouldn’t.
And many of the posters have mentioned that they have children. Well, think about if your child comes home one day and he/she is in a relationship with an “illegal”. And they are in love and get married. Will you no longer support and love your child because of this awful “personal choice?”! After all, they know it’s wrong! Both my parents are lifelong conservative Republican’s and they love my husband like he is their own. They don’t view him through the lens of “legal” or “illegal”. All they know is that they have a beautiful grandson and their daughter has been happier with this “illegal” than she ever was before in her adult life. And isn’t that what every parent wants for their child? So, if you are out there spouting off about how immoral illegals are, wonder for a moment how you would react if your son or daughter loves an “illegal” one day. Then you tell me if you are really the loving parent you portend to be, or a fake that only will live by the “Rule of Law”.
Blah Blah Blah, you break the law you pay the price. Big deal. Take the kids with you, but don’t put the blame on the fact that we have laws against your actions that you knowingly broke. How about we turn our attention to the thousands of legal citizens that could use our support and sympathies instead of wasting it on those who would prefer to be in their own country if it wasn’t so corrupt. Act like a man and be responsible for your actions for once. Just like that ‘pirate’ whose mother is whining about how he got involved in the situation. That defense could be used for every gang member out there unless it’s possible to be ‘born’ a gang member, and where was she while he was off learning a new trade? If he’s a minor, then she is responsible for his actions, so lock her up too!
Society has turned to mush in my opinion. God help us if another 9-11 occurs, because many here will want to send sympathy cards to the killers parents. (at least that’s the impression you’re giving)
Hello,
I guess what it boils down to is with limited resources, what is our goal right now and what is reasonable to focus our collective energy on. I would say, most people who come here as immigrants, come here for the same reasons that your ancestors came and my ancestors came. To have a better life, to have an opportunity to create a better future for their children. I probably sound like a broken record (no comment SA if you see this 🙂 ), but immigration has and will remain a struggle for this nation. This immigrant group is no different. There is no line to get in, there is simply wait decades and hope for a lucky break. Really, the issue is how do we help our “America” neighbors improve their own countries such that people do not have to risk their lives, or the lives of their children, to eak out meager existence, relegated to the shadows of the U.S. I would add, that although we don’t feel the labor loss now, when all the baby boomers retire, we will have severe shortage of a work force, just look at the statistics by the dept of labor. There are lots of different issues facing this country, and I do not see immigration as one of its priorities, I just don’t. Keeping out the bad guys, finding the bad guys, protecting us from 9-11 nutcases is WAY more important than taking a realistic approach to figuring out a way to acheive required legalization for the millions that are here simply trying to work.
Furthmore, my great grandfather knew he was “breaking the law” when he smuggled his ill toddler into Ellis Island in a suitcase. But keeping his family together was paramount. Seriously, this “rule of law” is so hyprocritical. On one hand you have the “rule of law” crowd chanting “rule of law” mantra, but then they insult the very Chief of Police that enforces the rule of law. So blah blah right back at ya SA. I would add that if you are really concernced about a 9-11, how about focusing our resources to find those possible sleeper cells, not the day laborers!
As I predicted, the new information provided by this study did not prompt the anti (illegal) immigrant bloggers to rethink their stance at all. It’s pointless because they reject any new information that was not available in 2007. These same answers were on the old blog two years ago. It’s as if they’ve been frozen in a block of ice ever since. Or just cut and pasted from a Word document without reference to new information. I think at this point these folks should just be assumed lost to the discussion of how to move forward. We passed Civil Rights Legislation with half the country opposing it. We can pass Comprehensive Immigration Reform with 22 percent of the country opposing it.
Elena, that is a great point.
@Elena
That wasn’t directed at you Elena. The comment was my overall opinion on the subject.
I think that you hit the nail on the head. Many of the students that I teach that are here illegally are here because of the severity of their disability (I teach middle school/high school kids with autism/moderate to severe mental retardation). One parent from El Salvador said that her ped. told her to risk it and go to the US to help her child. I don’t fault that at all. If I was in a situation where my child needed help, I would seek it out.
But we need to reach out to other countries and help them establish up to date medical care and education. Think about it – not even 35 years ago the kids I teach today would have been institutionalized. It took a major movement to get special education where it is today. We need to take that same information and show it to other countries who are struggling. Show them that it isn’t difficult to do and can be done. Provide them with people who are willing to help these countries out in the beginning. Support them through the process and help them see the benefits of raising their society up instead of beating it down.
@TWINAD
If you want to stay with your husband thier is nothing stopping you from moving to his country. I don’t understand what your whining about. You have made your choice knowing the consequences. You said “Yes, I knew I was marrying an illegal immigrant.” So what is the problem? Now don’t think you should live up to the obligations you made when you married?
It’s really tough, when you have chosen the wrong parents!
@Punchak
Its worse when the parents raise their children to think they are above the law and if they can think up a good enough excuse they can get out of obeying the law,
Just In Time, I don’t really think you know enough about Twinad to make the remarks you have made. You also didn’t read what she did say very closely. THE LAWS CHANGED.
Re-read what you have written. Do you think you could have expressed yourself in a way that wasn’t rude to Twinad? As a very good friend once told me, you can’t help who you fall in love with.
Don’t anyone here try to tell me that they have always obeyed each and every law that is on the books.
Just in Time,
I wonder, if you met Twinad, her husband, her child, if maybe your harsh opinion might change. I think it is easy to villify someone if you have no personal connection.
Just In,
And if you have ever followed what I have said on this blog, I will gladly up and move my family if that is the decision that has to be made due to the “law”. I have gone on record as stating such, but I just fail to see why we should have to. Why shouldn’t an American citizen be able to marry whom they choose? Why should an American be able to go on a website and get a spouse from another country and go through a legal process to make that person legal, but people who met, in real life, and fell in love and have a family do not have that opportunity? Where is the sense in that? That’s all I want to know.
Twinad, you are a very brave and honest person to discuss what most people would not in this climate of fear.
I hope everything gets worked out with your husband. The whole thing is just so unfair.
HAhahaha -I laugh at all this now, because the fact is that there are 20 million migrants here in the U.S. and no matter how the “weak minded that blame everyone else” feel the numbers will ONLY continue to grow. Get it out of your pathitic heads – that the answer to all your economic woes is caused by immigrants. The reason American citizens fail and are unemployed-is beacuse their lack of education in a country where they had evey oppotunity obtain the knowledge needed to succeed. And the govts abuse of taxes.If u lose a job to a bilingual migrant DUMMY- learn a second language- Oh here is an idea- build a great big wall and charge more taxes so there is less competition AMERICA was built on competition. Where I live Westchester NY- migrants keep the stores and businesses running -if there is prejudice here , I don’t see it.Migrants are going no where- Mass deportations and ICE are coming to an end with OBAMA , most of his family are not citizens of the U.S. And for all of u “get the proper documents and stay here leagaly” idiots- You have more luck winning the lotto- The INS office is like the DMV holding the fate of your life in their hands. So u guys can smile at the deportations, cause hell, it’s not your life and ur grandparents didnt miss the boat. But now we too can laugh because although its a struggle- ITS A STRUGGLE WE R WINNING- look at the numbers, look at all canidates addressing LARAZA the NCLR ! y? cause we MATTER !! hahaheha. btw i was born & raised here- & my parents were citizens 2. I welcome culture and people and all who love work and play hard
I think someone needs to switch to decaf… 🙂
Hi Kristina,
We are a fairly friendly group here, so you don’t necessarily need to feel compelled to come in like a whirlwind 😉 Do you know people who are here undocumented?
@kelly3406
yeah thn you complain becuase the remaining family memeber ask for government help to pay the bills when the family provider is gone.
one funny thing people talk about crime they committ, how many americans comitt dui and kill people can they get deported? for getting drunk? they only get 5 days and out to do it again, and are more likely to be involved in dui accident but they dont get deported all of us here were brought here or came in illegally the only true cititzens are the indians who were denied of their rights and we brought the dieseases here when we came here.
A little off topic …It looks like OUR Marie does her homework and Greg doesn’t. While he tried to vilify newly elected judge Steve Smith, Marie posted the city council vote on 287(g) to prove Greg wrong. Of course, Greg never apologised and also got in a dig that Marie was from Anti–oh sin of sins. Did anyone expect anything different? Some of the black velvets will just continue to drink the kool aid.
Go Marie!
Hahahah, good point Elena about Kristina, hahahah she came on a little strong hahahah 🙂
Maybe she has strong beliefs 😉
Guns a’blazin’ strong beliefs.
M-H, It looks like Marie is the cat that got the Dark Master’s tongue.
Why Marie goes into the “belly of the beast” I will never understand, but you go get em girl!
I hope Kristina comes back and engages in a some good debate. She does sound very passionate and she makes some powerful points.@Moon-howler
Kristina, I also hope you stick around. We have much to share with the rest of the country because of the tragic experiment our politicians attempted. But we also have a limited perspective as a result. And, language on this debate is often racially charged, so our writers who are people of color often leave and don’t come back. I hope you come back.
@dooer
Great points Dooer!
Kristina, I hope you come back as well but with actual logic, calling people with opposing views “weak minded”, “pathetic”, “idiots” doesn’t help your cause or do anything for constructive debate. People tend to read such things and skim the rest of it, at least I do…
I agree with hello. I know we can all get “passionate” but when we name call, the reciever cannot “hear” any valid points you may make. I am sure we have all been guilty of that at one time or another.
Kristina, please do follow Hello and Elena’s advice. We want the rest of the country to know that people from different backgrounds discussing immigration can have a calm and solutions-oriented exchange without using insults. That would be very productive.
Cant stay on all day got things to do but will check back from time to time- caught this site from Citizen Orange. I am Mexican and Polish I dont lable myself. How bout this I give u random WISDOM & u guys scratch the old cranium and give feedback btw Im Kristopia5 on utube.
1.My Polish mother was born in Palistine cause my grandparents “migrated” there after bing misplaced in the Holocaust.(we r catholic if it matters) Then they came here to America& my grandparents being of adults were allowed to apply for citizenship for themselves only thru HOST Family- nt the minor child (my MOther) K Quick- What country does she belong to??
2. 6 MILLion immigrants payed taxes into the IRS in 2007 in the combined amount EXCEEDED the amount payed out in welfare country wide? That means they payed for impoverished American citizens too? what No-YES
Its called a tax id number for the unaware.
3. EVERYSINGLE item in the supermarket reads in Spanish too por que? Could they be like spending their money here? Guys have u been to a mall outside rural nowhere?
4. OBAMA already was pushed to answer this question when he met with the president of Mexico last week- his almost exact words ” I will not seperate any more migrant families on my watch”
BOTH presidential canidates addressed LARAZA befor elections- laraza has HUGE financial supportes like MICROSOFT the **# computer u r on (koo-koo;kookoo) Im sorry i just cant help but b sarcastic. If u want a list of the hundreds of other supporters go to their website- NCLR- every product u use put a penny towards the cause.
The freedom to move around this EARTH is MY right buy GOD- yet my gvt punishes me from visiting CUBA? nobody owns earth but if they could they would kill to- JUST to draw their dam line in the sand
happy Earth DAY Everyone
Hi Kristina,
We are forty miles from D.C. I imagine that most of us have been to several malls outside the “rual” area ;). This blog was “born” as a reaction to stem the mob mentality that was growing in Prince William County against Latinos. I urge you to do a little research about the people who mostly visit this blog before you go on the attack. I feel like we have some common points, but, honestly, you are even making me uncomfortable.
Elena and ShellyB are right, Kristina shows no respect for people who are concerened about the negative impact on this nation caused by illegal immigration. Kristin’s behavior is an example of what has gone wrong with America as a result of the influx of 15 Million Illegal immigrants, and some 45 million formerly illegal immigrants.
It is the arrogance and sense of “takeover” that concerns people the most, and the hidden and blatant racism and hatred toward all others not of the same cultural and legal ideology of “la raza”.
Kristina,
You are right, nobody owns the Earth…but you better believe people own big parts of it! Try this….go up to Ft. Meade and stand there yelling out “you don’t own this land!” Some very nice people will come and pick you up.
Look where we came and look where we are going. The future is far more bleak than the past and will only get worse as the “illegal” population gets larger and “does” whatever it wants because it is “la Raza” and “NOT AMERICAN”. That kind of blatently militant ideology has to be stopped and replaced with a society of “legal” and non-destructive individuals who do not focus on their race, but on their contribution to a better, more respectful society that respect law.
The greatest threat to this country caused by illegals and people like Kristina appears to be their total lack of respect for the society’s law and their fierce devotion to the “aparthied” of thier race and ethnicity.
In every case in the history of the world where “race, became more important than the individual and upholding of democracy and law, nations of opposing “races” ultimately turn to conflict and war.
I am certain as the “illegal” population reaches some future threshold, this nation will divide into ethnic “sects” at war with each other.
Just hearing recently that “TEXAS” threatened to cecede from the US and become its own soverenity, is proof of how the nation has degraded into citi-states bounded by “ethnicities” rather than a soverign nation of individuals.
On the topic of the survey…I believe that anyone can write anything and find data to support any point of view. Rarely are such “reports” unbiased and truthful regarding “all” sides of the issue.
It is equally possible to give reasons why families who have “illegal” immigrant members, will suffer little personal hardship if they decide to leave the country as an intact family, rather than a divided family. It is a presumption that deported “illegals” will automatically cause divided families. In fact just the opposit is true. When the main bread winner is deported, the “family” will not remain if they have no income or job, and will instead choose to keep the family together. No one says they even have to go back to their home countries, they can choose to go anywhere together that they are legally entitled to go to.
In my opinion the negative “impact” of continuing an un-controlled growth of “illegals” of such magnitude as to destroy our entire democratic society and all of the “legal” ideals of our constitution, is of such threat to the well being of the rest of US citizens, that deporting a family member who willingly came across the border illegally rather than legally is the price the family must pay, to save the rest of the nation from irreversable corruption, continued global financial failure and political upheaval, likely to be eventually followed by a very ugly “separatist” ethnic war.
I also have the opinion that the current 12-15 million “illegal” immigrants in the US have so shifted the political “ideology” of the nation away from law, away from democracy and away from the constitution, that allowing them to stay is already past the point of no return if they are not “self-deported” and convinced that the “legal” way is the only way to preserve American ideology and democracy. We are on the brink of collapse as a nation in my opinion and FAR MORE CONCERNED ABOUT THE WELFARE of FOREIGNERS THAT WE ARE OF OUR OWN US CITIZENS.
The thrreat is not “la raza”. The threat is any group of “illegal” immigrants from ANY nation, that comes into the nation illegally in such numbers and with such racist ideologies, that only “the race” matters to them. When the “law” does not matter to them, and “democracy” does not matter to them, and the constitution does not matter to them, then you no longer have an “american”. What you have is a potential future combatant that will attempt to replace your national identity, concept of government by the people and respect for all individuals ONLY as individuals, and values based on majority “rule of law” with their own seperatist, socialist, facist, anarchic, and militant “dictatorships”.
When that day comes I will reluctantly be forced to become a soldier (again) protecting my family, my American ideology and my nation from INTERNAL rather than EXTERNAL political warfare and destruction.
I have only to look at the lessons of history to see how this will unfold.
Hahaha, Slow. Now that was sort of mean. What if she does it? You could try the same thing at the White House and see how that worked out for you also. How about the Bush compound up at Kennebunk? I always had this secret fantasy to do that.
Michael, are you obsessing over immigration again? We don’t ALWAYS talk about it here. It probably is a good idea to give it a rest in one’s mind periodically.