Who would have believed that Silver Lake was home to a globally rare forest. I was privileged to be a part of that discovery. It was amazing, to see that little old PWC is home to such a unique asset. Prince William Conservation Alliance has a very expansive story on the find. The Park Authority has truly shown leadership in its endeavor to take advantage of local expertise found in our environmental groups, such as PWCA and the PW Wildflower Society in order to gain a comprehensive understanding of what Silver Lake has to offer within its boundaries.
The most important find on the site is the forest stand on the northeastern portion of the property (possibly extending to the northwestern portion) on what is labeled as the “School Site.” This forest stand is Diabase Flatwoods, a globally rare forest community that occurs only in northern Virginia and central Maryland.
There is meeting tonight, Tuesday, October 6th, at Mountain View Elementary, 7:30 p.m. This is an opportunity for citizens to comment on what they would like to see happen at Silver Lake. Although citizens have already spent the last two years, overwhelmingly supporting passive recreation such as hiking, fishing, swimming, camping, boating, and other non intensive uses, this is another chance to ensure that this unique asset is preserved for generations to come!
If you can’t make it to the meeting, you can e-mail the park authority with your comments.
Some knucklehead will probably cut it down to build a school.
Why is a school going in there anyway?
Moon-Howler,
How ironic, did you read the PWCA webite? THAT is exatly what will happen if the school site is not moved.
No, I haven’t read it. However, I have lived in PW County a long time. Some things are a given.
Who all has declared this site globally rare? What makes it rare and how does it contribute to the environment? I don’t know much about rare VA forests.
Delicate balancing act between humans and natural wonders in the Galapagos Islands- NYT
http://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2009/10/05/world/americas/20091005_GALAPAGOS_audioslideshow/index.html?nl=multimedia&emc=focusema1#
Just to let everyone know, the PWCA contacted the School Board through my colleague Gil Trenum about the possibility of doing a land swap within the overall Silver Lake property so that we could build the school without destroying the environmentally sensitive areas. We have staff looking at it right now to see what impact this would have on our construction schedule and costs, but if at all possible we are hoping to make this work out as a win-win. Stay tuned.
M-H, the reason a school is being built at Silver Lake is because that is the property that Toll Brothers was willing to proffer, and the Board of Supervisors accepted it. We desperately need another middle school at the west end, and we don’t have the funds to go buy another property. Simple as that.
Thanks for answering the question. And yes, another middle school is needed. Somehow during the BOCS foot dragging on Silver Lake, the school property was rarely discussed. If for not other reason, it seems that the need to build another school might have hurried things along.
Again, Mr. Richardson, thanks for your speedy reply. I hope that forest will be preserved. I don’t know much about rare forests, especially in this area, but it sounds ecologically important.
Come on, this is Prince William County – that baby will be a
Wall-Mart parking lot within the year.
Welcome Mr. Richardson! I think you have hit upon the real issue. How DO we find our school sites and why is it we are beggars to whatever a developer is willing to give. The bigger issue is how do we build our infrastructure that can be a more holistic approach. Some schools are under capacity while other are at or over their limits.
I am truly appreciative that so many different partners in PWC are coming together to help create a win-win!
Bullshit Don, the School Board has had plenty of time to negotiate a land swap with the county for a more suitable middle school site, that is if the two boards hadn’t spent so much time pissing on each others legs. Don’t feed us that crap about having to build there “because that is the property that Toll Brothers was willing to proffer”. I was at the hearings where Lucy and the existent School Board (one you sat on as well) practically drooled over the “free” land and came off as little better than a bunch of pandering school kids.
Heaven forbid you conduct any due diligence when selecting a site, unless you consider placing a school between a lake and a flooded quarry the ideal location, not to mention access from Antioch Road (Future headline “30 Teens die in gruesome school bus/fire truck incident”).
While I’m at it, I guess you have some reason for not dipping into those precious funds you have set aside for land acquisition, newsflash, land is pretty cheap right now. You might also consider some of the other lands you have available, I would suggest south of 55 and west of 29 because that’s where the site will be needed when West Market and such are built out.
I’ll stay tuned but please don’t pass on the usual rationalizations and pre-packaged planning office pablum you guys usually do.
Thanks for the laugh, Mom. I have rather enjoyed the leg exercises mainly because:
Some on the BOCS haven’t yet realized that they no longer rule Lord Supreme over the school board. Our esteemed Chair sometimes reverts back to old times and starts telling the SB what they need to be doing.
We wouldn’t need all of those schools if Disney had come to PWC. But no, the area still got developed in that part of the county and too quickly I might add. We are still playing catch up with the schools for houses that were built a decade ago. This was piss poor planning years ago, and we are now paying the price for it.
I would also, add the Silver Lake issue should’ve NEVER been drug out for years. Talk about BS. I’m glad to see it’s finally open. I wonder what other rare things they might find with land actual being enjoyed by the rightful owners, the citizens of PWC.
M-H, I might laugh with you if it weren’t so damn true. Neither Board could effectively plan an efficient sandbox in spite of the need for a large one to contain some of their egos. (Don’t leave it up to Griffith or Utz in PWC or Beavers in PWCS either, they would like build a quicksand box)
Mom, you are on a roll today. 🙂
Is there really a person named Beavers or are we talking about the beavers of Silver Lake?
Sorry, that Toll Brothers proffer BS just struck a nerve, uhhh, I feel another spasm….
Hey Don, where’s that balanced approached and letting the teachers decide what works best in the classroom. I went to back-to-school night and was informed by one of my children’s (as yet untrained in MI) teachers that he had to teach MI from the text every day and he did not have the freedom to use traditional techniques to the extent the Board promised. Why you ask, direct instruction from the school administration and the math department. I would note, every parent I have spoken to who had this 5th grade teacher last year (pre-MI) marveled at their kids math scores and understanding of the material.
Rest assured, their progress in coloring and cutting out game pieces aside, if my children’s math scores decline this year I will be attending a few School Board meetings, flamethrower in tow.
The war thread is the next one down. Seems that MI just brings about flame throwers. Those who like it and approve are never as loud as those protesting. I suppose that is human nature.
To Don Richardson – Thank you for your forward thinking approach to protecting natural resources at Silver Lake and also for taking the time to let us all know what’s happening. Your efforts here are greatly appreciated by many.
To Mom – Even when something good happens, you do nothing but complain. It seems there’s nothing that will make you happy.
Perhaps you can explain the “good” part of acres of parking, paved road surfaces and other impervious surfaces draining into the lake, not to mention changes from sheet flow to point flow, once the school is built and landscaped.
I am glad that Don Richardson took his time to come here and explain what was going on from the school board point of view. His response gives us the information to now at least think about what we want out of this and to give citizen input.
He didn’t have to come here and answer questions. Mr. R, I hope you will continue to post here. Silver Lake is a good place to have a win/win situation.
Congratulations Tree-Huggers, in all sincerity. God love ya.
Mr. Richardson,
It is clear that people have strong opinions here. I for one am appreciative of your efforts to move the school to another location on Silver Lake. I would prefer people work towards a positive solution and saving a globally rare forest IS a win win!
I would like to know more about that globally rare forest. Surely that should help go to win/win and move the suture school site.
Where can we find out more information about the area?
Also, I know of someone who needs a flat screen monitor on the cheap. Is there anyone out there with one they are no longer using? Monitors aren’t good for landfills so recycling it to my friend (and your friend too actually) would help you have a greener year.
M-H,
Just visit http://www.pwconserve.org and there is a plethora of informaton there.
This is amazing news! Silver Lake sounds like it would be quite the treasure. A feather in the cap of Prince William County Government! What does a rare forest look like anyway?
Openspace,
As I said to M-H, just visit http://www.pwconserve.org 🙂
I think Mr. R. has probably been scared off.
Here’s what I want: hiking trails, a beach and a dock for kayaks. You can’t have those things if all the land is getting eaten up by other projects.
what do you think of a Disc Golf course(frisbee golf)? Fairfax put one on the old lorton prison site and that seem to keep alot of the land open space.
Mr. Richardson does not scare easily.
As long as you could incorporate it into what is already cleared that would be fine. However, I don’t think it would be possible without clearing a large expanse at Silver Lake so my initial reaction would be probably not a feasible idea at Silver Lake.
I would say no also. I just got back from Silver Lake. It isn’t like old Silver Lake. It is all cleaned up, almost too much so. However, it will grow back.
I cannot imagine a school on that site where one is designated.
Standing ovation to all those people who helped with the clean up, especially Dominion Power employees.
Is bike riding not considered passive recreation? I understand that back on the trails trees have been sawed down across the trails.
Elena, frisbee golf is actually a great idea for Silver Lake. My husband is very into the “sport”, and I’ve been once. It is played in a wooded area usually with trails. They have a course at Burke Lake and at Bull Run Park. If you’ve ever seen those baskets dangling by chains that look like incomplete trash cans that’s the hole.
I hope the weather is decent this weekend I want to take my husband and daughter to see this newest “county jewel”. Of course I really shouldn’t say new, because this park should’ve been opened quite sometime ago.
Disc Golf can be played in wide open fields also. For the most part most people don’t even notice when a disc golf course is in a park, and the baskets look more bird cages than trash cans. I think if there was every a sport the PWCA would like to see in Silver Lake, Disc golf would be it. Would look and be alot more natural than another round of the same old soccer and baseball fields that nobody can use when they want to
Flecks, afraid I jumped the gun on that one. I saw golf and thought immediately of the mini golf that was at Splash Down.
I think the horses are going to take the area over anyway. They seem to go where they want to during my brief excursion today. They didn’t bother me but very few people were around.
What will become of that quarry back behind the black fence?
flecks,
Bird cages is a much better description. I’ve only played once and it was a 105 degrees that day. I absolutely hated it, but I’ve know many that have enjoyed the game for decades. When I first heard anyone talk about Frisbee golf I thought it was some code word men used to get away from their women for a few hours.
Moon, it’s nothing like the the mini golf course that was once upon a time at Ben Lomond. Did they have anyone scooping up behind all of those horses? I sure don’t want to go to a park and tip toe through piles of horse waste.
No. No manure scoopers. No dog bag holders either. Fortunately, from what I saw, none of the animals present relieved themselves.
However, it will become a problem if a few rules aren’t established and territories aren’t marked. There were very few people out there today. I can’t wait until Corey Stewart has to sit up there on dais and listen to citizens bitch and moan about horse manure during citizens’ time.
I knew it wasn’t like mini golf but I didn’t read it correctly. I saw golf…park…and it was a trigger. So now I can look forward to having my head clipped off by a frisbee and stepping in horse manure…ah life is good!!! 😉
Seriously, the park is neat. Right now it is a little too ‘new’ looking. Lots of straw down for new grass, and things are really cut back. Amazing that it opened this quickly. It will be a work in progress for a while, I suspect. I hope it stays the best kept secret in the Gainesville District.
I was told by a native that there are huge cat fish in that lake.
Greetings all, I have some additional information about the upland swamp situation that may be of interest. Sorry for the delay, but I needed to meet with staff to get an exact site layout for reference, and on Friday, Mr. Trenum and I walked the site with various County folks and environmentalists to better understand what the situation is.
First of all, at least 75 percent of the area defined as “upland swamp” is already on Park Authority property. The remainder is mostly on school property but almost all of that is slated to be left undisturbed by the school construction. That’s the good news. The concern that remains, for those folks looking to preserve this rare resource, is that construction of 2 of the ball fields for the school would remove a number of acres of old-growth oak and hickory forest that, in addition to being somewhat rare itself, is also essential in regulating groundwater going into the adjacent swamp area. The worry is that removal of the forest would have a destructive impact on the swamp.
What has been suggested is a land swap: the forest area (at the north end of the school site) would become part of the park property, and in return the school would receive acreage adjacent to the site on the west side. This area is not old forest; it’s previously-cleared land that is currently covered with scrub trees, bushes, and a variety of invasive plant species. We’re going to have further discussions as to the viability of this plan.
From the School Division’s viewpoint, the major concern is that we cannot do anything at this point that would delay the Middle School’s opening beyond Sept 2012. For those who may have missed it, we received our official Sept 30 student population numbers at our Oct 7th meeting, and this year we grew by 3,000 students – 4.1 percent – the biggest annual increase in almost 20 years. But we will explore whether this can be done without major cost and schedule impact. If we can make it work, it would be a good thing.
While I’m here I need to correct a few mistaken points that have been made during this discussion:
— The school is NOT situated between the lake and the quarry. The quarry is on the far side of Silver Lake from the school site. And the Park Authority has already put a fence around it.
— While a firetruck vs school bus demolition derby might be fun at next summer’s County Fair, it isn’t going to happen on Antioch Road. The busses (and all school traffic) will access the school from the Dominion Valley side.
— No matter where we put a school, it will have a roof, parking and other impervious surfaces that create runoff. The responsible thing to do at any school site is to manage the stormwater to avoid pollution of the watershed. Every new school we build has stormwater management factored into the site plan. There will not be polluted runoff draining directly into Silver Lake.
— While there is some money in the County’s proffer accounts that we have not yet tapped, it would not be enough to buy an entire middle school site – at least not somewhere near the population centers. Also complicating things is that some of the proffer money comes with strings attached – in some cases, the funds must be used in a particular Magisterial District, so they won’t be available for projects in the other 6 districts. Other than the proffer accounts, I’m not aware of a hidden pot of gold anywhere in our system that is available for land acquisition.
I’d be happy to address any other questions that may come up, and I will try to post further once we know what we can do about the forested area.
Please Don, I can read both a map and a budget.
With regard to the lake and the quarry, although the site may not be between them, its less than 200 yards to the lake shore and about 300 to the edge of the quarry, hardly at the far side of the property. In either event, its too close unless you are going to position security personnel at the perimeter to shoo the kids back. With regard to the fence, you could top it with concertina wire and ring it with landmines, neither will keep teenage boys (and some girls) from attempting to get in. I seriously doubt a pair of park rangers and the odd school security guard will be much more effective.
Yes any site will create runoff and it is the school systems responsibility to manage and monitor their stormwater but you can’t be serious if you consider this site anything but unusual with regard to the potential impact.
With regard to site acquistion, if I read this year’s budget correctly, you have allocated 11.5 million on that line item. Similarly, in FY06 it was 8.5, FY07 15.8, FY08 1.07 (why the dramatic difference), and FY09 16.8 million, so pardon me if I’m a little skeptical when the School Board of Budget Office cries poor.
You’re throwing meat pitches right in my wheelhouse.
BTW (pull pin on hand grenade, count to three, throw in general direction of School Board, Park Authority, supporters of the Rural Crescent and the environmentally conscious), did I just read the words ball fields (emphasis on the plural)? Does that mean lighting, night-time use, use of fertilizers and other chemicals?
So what do you propose doing to protect all the teenagers who come out to the Park with their families? The middle school kids spend the vast majority of their day inside, and when they do go outside it’s for P.E. and they have adult supervision at all times. They are also supervised as they get on and off the busses each morning and afternoon.
Polluted runoff getting into the ecosystem is a bad thing no matter where you are… it all flows downhill to the Chesapeake, eventually. As long as we manage the water properly, it shouldn’t be a problem. Do you worry about the runoff from the parking lot at the Dominion Valley Giant? At your church? At the local 7-11?
We have to acquire sites all over the County, not just in the Gainesville District. We had to put down a tidy amount to get the site for the 11th HS and the adjacent ES. We buy what we can afford to buy, but we also will take it free if we can get it. Some years we have to spend less because we got a proffered site, or perhaps there is less of a need for acquisitions that year. Our funds are limited by what we get from the State and the BOCS, and there are limits on what we can borrow as well. We have no taxation authority of our own. 80 percent of our budget goes to personnel costs. We cannot afford to buy land before we absolutely need it. It would be nice if we could, but that isn’t going to happen.
…and are you really shocked, SHOCKED to find out that a school will have ball fields? In case you hadn’t noticed, there’s a big national movement to try to get kids to get more exercise. For the record, the site plan includes a running track, baseball field, softball field, 4 tennis courts, an outdoor basketball court, and one full size and one half size soccer field. I am not aware of any plans to put lights on the fields. This is pretty standard for a middle school.
I’m just trying to provide facts, and an idea of what the view is from my chair. I don’t mind if people disagree with me (they often do) but I fail to see how being nasty aids your cause – whatever it is.
I sense you’re getting a little defensive, I’ll have to admit I didn’t expect you to rise to the bait like that. I will try to address your latest points as objectively and factually as possible.
Children at the park with their parents is in essence a red herring, they would be the parent’s responsibility and not the school’s, nuff said.
Is it your position that the school will mandate that all students ride the bus or be picked up by their parents? What about those who live within a half mile of the school? Are you going to run a special bus just to accomodate that portion of Dominion Valley adjacent to the Silver Lake property? If you are going to allow them to use the present trail systems existent in Dominion Valley then you are going to face the potential liability I expressed.
Polluted runoff, whatever its source, is always a concern and your response is simplistic at best. It is much easier and less expensive to manage the storm water in most other areas of the county. The special circumstance given the terrain and proximity of the school site to the lake are self-evident.
With regard to site acquisition, no I don’t expect the focus to be entirely on the Gainesville district but given the demographics and areas of projected growth, I do expect about 95% of it to be in the Gainesville and Brentsville districts, something that should have been planned for more than a decade. Reliance on future proffers is no more responsible than relying solely on a high-risk investment fund and under most municipal accounting practices generally not acceptable with regard to budgeting and planning.
No, I’m not shocked at the extent of the athletic fields, rather I question the propriety of them adjacent a “passive” recreational park. Those fields will require grading, paving, more storm water management and extensive chemical maintenance. My concerns are site specific in this instance given the fragile nature of the surrounding property.
Lastly, its got nothing to do with being nasty but rather disgusted with the (lack of proper) planning by both the county and the school system. Neither body tends to take the 5000 foot view but rather accepts whatever manna the developers proffer, generally without question. That situation is not likely to change or get any better, particularly (if I understand correctly) given the most recent resolution by the School Board regarding review of county rezoning requests. The hands off policy suggested at your recent meeting was nothing more than a cop-out and abdication of your responsibility.
Amost 24 hours and nothing but crickets