Corey thought he was only insulting Annabel, Eric, and I am sure, he was thinking of me also in his kind words (major sarcasm)when he called Coffee Party participants “fruit cakes” and “nuts”. What he did not realize was that many of the attendees were military vets. One of whom holds the rank of Colonel. Colonel Morris Davis served in the Air Force for 25 years. He resigned after being appointed Chief Prosecutor at Gitmo due to his insistence the trials be fair and spoke out strongly against torture as he felt it compromised the integrity of the prosecutors.Corey Stewart’s Nuts Are OutLast Saturday, I attended a Coffee Party Day event at the town hall in Haymarket, Virginia. The Coffee Party is a new group that encourages civil discourse on public policy issue. About 30 people attended the event and, based on a show of hands, at least a third of the attendees were military Veterans. I’d estimate the median age of those in attendance was over 50 years of age. The common theme was there are a lot of problems facing the nation and screaming at each other is not going to solve them.The Honorable Corey A. Stewart … my representative.
Corey Stewart is the Chairman of the Prince William County Board of Supervisors. On the official county website, he is listed as “The Honorable Corey A. Stewart” and supposedly he represents me and all of the other citizens of the county, including those of us that met at the Haymarket town hall last Saturday. Here is what he said in an interview with a reporter from the Gainesville Times:
“The Coffee Partiers are a bunch of fruitcakes; yeah, they’re a bunch of nuts. If they’re going to be a coffee party, they’ll be a hazelnut party.” Stewart elaborated, saying the Coffee Party is “just a phase; it’ll disappear.” He derided one of the co-founders saying, “does (he) have a job?” Stewart described the Tea Partiers as patriots “concerned about the direction of the country and about the vast amount of spending that happening.” He called the Tea Party a “legitimate movement” while saying the Coffee Party is “just a load of crap.”
So, my representative, The Honorable Corey A. Stewart, considers me and the other Vets who were there on Saturday fruitcakes, nuts, and a load of crap while he believes the Tea Party group are “patriots.” It seems that a lot of people like The Honorable Corey A. Stewart, Newt Gringich, Karl Rove, Rush Limbaugh, and Glenn Beck, among others, like to use the word patriot to describe themselves and those who agree with their ideology, while none of them ever felt the urge to put on the uniform and defend the constitutional right to belittle others by calling them fruitcakes, nuts, and crap. Apparently he, like former VP Cheney, had more important things to do than serve in the military. To him and the others; you’re welcome.
UPDATE: Title changed to appear less leading.
I got almost all my initial information about the Tea Party off of Fox News. Blame them if I got the wrong impression.
Those they strut out and are proud of might not hit me the same way.
Actually I got the initial story about Bret Baier off of Fox News. I then went to you tube for the video. MSNBC’s was up. I took the shortest one. All one needed was a taste of the rudeness.
Fair enough – I was actually confused as I missed the part about Colonel Morris Davis at the top of the thread – I searched on “Colonel Davis” and obviously it skipped over that.
Anyway, I never said I agreed with what Corey said. My argument was that some of his constituents said even nastier things than he was saying.
And, I would tell Colonel Davis – that most likely there’s plenty of veterans in the Tea Party, and I know for a fact I’ve seen Democratic elected officials say equally nasty things about the Tea Party members.
So that’s what i would tell Colonel Davis. Actually, I’m not sure why I should be asked to be a spokesperson for Corey Stewart. Actually, I would tell Colonel Davis to e-mail Corey directly – as I’ve found in getting some issues solved with my property in Gainesville – his staff have been very helpful. I’m sure one of his staff members would be happy to discuss with Colonel Davis what Corey said.
Anyway, that’s it. I’m done being Corey’s spokesperson, and really – I think it was an unfair question to ask of me – since I never ever said on here I agreed with what Corey said. If you think I have – search through my posts and you’ll see I never ever said that. So I’m not sure why I’m now being asked to defend what Corey said in this “hypothetical conversation I’d have with Colonel Morris”.
Sometimes, I have to wonder about some of the questions asked on this blog. I never ever said I agreed with Corey on what he said – yet somehow I’m now being asked to hypothetically defend what he said.
I doubt other people on the other side would enjoy being asked to do a similar thing.
Part of the highly unequal treatment that’s sometimes dished out on this blog by some of the posters on it.
Our forefathers were not all that civil. They hollered and shouted at each other and left the room. Some challenged others to duels and fisticuffs have broken out on for chambers floor.
Perhaps they aren’t role models. I like to think we have progressed past those days.
And while I am offering up disclaimers. I have read several places that I am a coffee party member. Actually I am not. I am a fan and a supporter. I don’t have time to be a member of anything. I have dogs, grandkids and PT regularly.
I refuse to sign their form that I won’t punch someone in the face who gets in mine.
From GR
Do you mean saying nastier things about the vets and the coffee party?
No, I didn’t quite mean that – thanks for offering me the opportunity to clarify. I meant nastier things in general – aimed at other directions than vets or the coffee party. I can see how it may have been misinterpreted what I meant – my writing is not always that clear. English was not one of my better subjects…
Being civil does not mean ignoring horrible behavior. Glenn Beck has touted himself as the poster boy for the TEA party. Of this no one can argue. He has called the President of the United States “a racist” and I quote. He has likened him to Hitler and Communisim. WHERE is the outrage from the TEA party leadership…..nowhere! Just recently he said there were “code names” in churches, they were “social justice” and “economic justice” and if you church leadership promotes these values you should run as fast as you can. Do you know why? Because THOSE are dasterdly code names for Nazi’s and Communists. The coffee party will NEVER allow such demonization of Americans, even TEA party members.
@Gainesville Resident
Ok… Now you know why I could never run for anytjing… A modest learning disability that manafests itself by confusing names that aren’t “hard wired” yet. Col Bill Golden, and I are the ones who enjoy a continuing discussion of the Constitution. We are both conservatives; however, he is the more conservative between us. (Blackberry – no warranty on spelling or grammer).
I don’t think it matters what others say. I think Stewart was wrong in saying what he said and I think he ought to just man up and apologize. Many people would forgive him, as they often do when polticians have been louts. He needs to say:
“I am sorry, I spoke before I thought or knew the facts. And for that I apologize. If I offended anyone, and I am sure I did, since people don’t like being called ‘crap,’ I am sorry and it certainly was not my intent to offend veterans.”
One of those vets might just come along and hand him his ass like the errant school boy he sounded like. I hope that happens. How dare he! I want a Vietnam Vet to do it. While they are at it, I hope one of them decides to give him a good run for his money. There’s a lot of military, both active duty and and retired, especially on the other end of the county. They might not like hearing one of their own called ‘crap.’
Maybe one of them wants his job.
I am terrible with remembering people’s names. I have a very good memory for other things, but somehow remembering a person’s name I’ve met is something that doesn’t work well for me.
And Corey Stewart also has been labeled a Nazi repeatedly by many poster’s on this website? Where’s the outrage in that? Glen Beck – last time i checked – is not an elected official. I thought the rule that most people on this website said was: “It is OK for non-elected officials to engage in name calling and labeling people as nasty things, but it is NOT OK for elected officials in doing such”. Now, Glen Beck is being called out here.
Either say it is not OK for anyone (including consituents of Corey Stewart to engage in name calling) or else don’t say it is not OK for Glen Beck to engage in name calling. Last i checked, he is not a public official.
I still see a double standard here. I think the true rule is – it is OK for someone you agree with to engage in name calling, and not OK for someone you disagree with to do it.
So far, evidence on this blog not just now but in the past – has convinced me that my paragraph above – is the true rule that most posters on this blog believe in.
And by the way – good luck in finding a post of mine ever that has engaged in name calling. You won’t, because I don’t believe in it. Many other posters on this blog don’t have clean hands in that regard.
Names are not my forte either.
@Al Alborn
We have something in common there, Al. Sometimes, even if the names ARE hardwired, I am afraid I will mess them up, so I often don’t call people by their names. I’m a big fan of name tags.
Looks like a lot of people have problems remembering names. I’ve tried every trick in the book – as far as things I’ve read and heard. Who knows how the brain works, but mine is not wired for remembering people’s names.
Glenn Beck claims responsibillity for being a founder of the Tea Party. I don’t believe they have elected officials. He has access to millions of viewers.
As for Corey Stewart being labeled a nazi on this blog? I can promise you that has not happened on Moonhowlings.net. You must be mistaken.
This is not a bi conditional situation. What an elected official says about constituents is not the same as what constituents say about elected officials. That just isn’t how it works.
1. the Coffee Party had done nothing to Corey Stewart
2. Even if it had, it’s is a mighty foolish politician who responds by calling people crap. I could laugh if I were called a nut or a fruitcake (I think they are nasty also) Crap is a whole different league.
3. Constituents are who can make or break you as a politician.
I think you might be unwilling to admit Corey has goofed.
63 comments so far and nobody has pointed out that Corey Stewart didn’t say a thing about veterans?
Unless somebody can point out a specific statement Corey made about veterans in the Coffee Party, it seems like Col. Davis is overreacting. Corey didn’t say the veterans were nuts or fruitcakes because they were veterans. He said that the Coffee Party members, some of whom happen to be veterans, are nuts or fruitcakes. There’s a big difference.
Let’s play Col. Davis’ game: I say that child molesters are evil. But I’m sure that there has been at least one child molester who was in the military. So by Col. Davis’ logic, I just called veterans evil, because some veterans happen to also belong to another group of people that I called evil.
Perhaps Col. Davis should draw a Venn diagram like a 6th grader before he starts making more wild accusations.
If you are a person going to the coffee party meet-up, then you were called crap (and a nut and a fruitcake). It is inexcusable. There were veterans in that subset of coffee party attendees. Mr. Alborn was a published leader of the coffee party. Mr. Stewart knows Mr. Alborn and also that he is a veteran.
So the logic says……????
Sometimes not everything is linear.
Why is it so difficult to admit that public officials, even St. Stewart, can sometimes be wrong?
Should bloggers not mention when government or government officials have done things wrong?
Should public officials ever say that a sub-group of their constituents are crap? I don’t much care if Corey Stewart says child molesters are crap. He and I would agree. But a group of citizens who are not even about him? Foolish. He saw Elena, Al, Eric and Annabel’s name and formed an opinion. Wait, doesn’t Al serve on several county committees either now or in the past?
I never said that what Corey said was right. I agree that Corey should have kept his mouth shut too. But Corey didn’t insult veterans.
My point is that this is a second thread on exactly the same comments made by Corey, this time with some phony spin on how Corey ‘insulted’ veterans. Corey didn’t insult veterans. He insulted Coffee Party members, and there is already a thread here to discuss that.
This thread is pure flamebait and wouldn’t be here except for the fact that some people around have a bone to pick with Corey.
For a place that complains about Fox News so much, you sure seem to have some of the same tactics.
Remember, perception is reality, Visitor. 🙂
I knew that – I figured people were just saying he was saying bad things about veterans because there were several (or more than several) who were at the Coffee Party meeting.
Now, I also figure – that’s just part of the hyperbole I often see in these sorts of political debates – and I’ve seen plenty of it lately!
OK, I guess I should do a better job of separating Moonhowlings.net from its predecessor. Sorry for that – I did not mean to imply it had been said on Moonhowlings.net.
To be honest, I had no idea Glenn Beck claimed responsibility for being the founder of the Tea Party until I read this. Shows you that I really don’t have a lot of knowledge of what Glenn Beck says or does. I know of him, and have caught his show a few times, but actually not since sometime last year have I last seen his show. Maybe I’m just showing my ignorance then of Glenn Beck and the Tea Party.
I thought (I’m pretty sure I did) say that what Corey did wasn’t smart, in some post about maybe he needs some people to advise him more before he says things. It was in some other thread. However, there’s been so many threads and posts on this – that you may have missed it, or I may be misremembering what it was I said.
Although, I’m not sure you can make the leap that Corey made those remarks just because he saw Elena, Al, Eric, and Annabel were involved. Maybe, but I haven’t seen proof to make that leap of logic – but maybe I’m missing something. I don’t say it isn’t possible, but I’m not 100% convinced that’s why he made those comments.
He insulted all of the constituents who were in attendance, many of whom were vets. I don’t think it was intentional that he insulted vets, although he knows Al Alborn and he knows Al is a vet.
Visitor, let’s see where to begin. You are aware that the post came off the Veteran Coffee Party site, with their permission, of course? Lafayette is correct. Perception is reality. If they are insulted, who are you or I to tell them that they should not be? They are the ones who wore the uniform.
This thread is made up of comments from many different people with varying opinions. That is what a blog is for…to share opinions. I feel that everyone here has contributed something important and said it in a productive tone. The Chairman of the Board of Supervisors is not a private citizen. He is very much in the limelight and therefore open to public scrutiny.
The difference in this thread and the original thread is that the first one, the basic premise was out outaged Elena and I were that constituents were called crap.
This thread is now about how Coffee Party Veterans feel about being called crap. I plan on giving them time on this blog. If Corey would like to post a response I will gladly give him equal time. See the contact us menu at the top.
Obviously people feel they have something to say or there would not be 69 comments.
Americans love their vets, and rightfully so. Corey should have thought about what he was doing.
Again, he is more than welcome to have equal time. He may email me.
But, it was written at times that Corey Stewart said nasty things about veterans.
In that case, I can take almost any politician – who’s made negative remarks about the opposition, and say that since they have to know that opposition is composed of veterans, they made bad remarks about veterans.
I find that statement to be misleading – but obviously it is to get a particular point of view across – that Corey did indeed directly make bad remarks about veterans.
I just think this is an example of how someone reading it, who doesn’t really see the bigger picture – can then go around and say “Corey Stewart is making bad remarks directly about veterans”.
This is like the old game of seeing how distorted news can become, by taking something out of the broader context and starting to connect dots, and then the connections between the dots get left out – leaving a direct connection.
I am sure Corey Stewart doesn’t purposely walk around saying nasty things about veterans, but I do believe that some posters on here would love for everyone to believe that! To me, that’s total distortion of the news, and just as bad as news reporters and what they do.
OK, that paragraph is fair enough, and I’m glad you wrote it. I can’t argue with that.
Yes, and some people on the prior blog loved to portray PWC as a Nazi state, etc. etc. I guess perception is reality there too!
Am I going to have to make ‘Nazi’ a moderation word again? I did have to do that on Anti, with Alanna’s permission. I had hoped we could avoid that.
Here’s an example of someone who would like us to believe that Corey Stewart directly said bad things about vets. And, I can find many other examples on this blog. Shameful distortion of the news.
Yes, Corey should resign immediately! He directly insulted the veterans! Let’s all march down to the county offices and call for him to resign! How dare he insult veterans like that!
I’m sure there’s posters on here that would love to see the headline in the newspaper as “Corey Stewart insults US vets” – no matter how untrue it really is (OK, he indirectly insulted him – but I know they’d think that headline is accurate – even though it is VERY misleading).
Sometimes, this just gets sillier and sillier – and you know what – I’m tired of debating a topic where people say outlandish things like above – and I can find more equally outlandish examples by other posters here on the topic of “Corey Stewart insulted veterans”. Enough said.
However, I wonder how many on this blog agree 100% with Starryflights. I’m guessing apparently more than a few. That, I find to be disappointing.
Headlines sell newspapers. What can I say.
It is also a known fact that Davy Crockett is dead and has been for at over 170 years. Headlines should be attention grabbers.
And again, if there are this many comments posted, people have something to say.
How many of you would be willing to give Reid, Pelosi, Obama and any of the other “Demon-crat anti-Christs” the same break as I just gave Corey?
And it seems headlines sell this blog too – as look at the headline at the top of this thread.
Deliberately misleading – just as bad as any news reporter.
I believe I’ve given Obama plenty of breaks. OK, Pelois/Reid – not so much.
How many posters on here would be willing to give Bush the same kind of break? My guess is nearly zero.
Somehow, I still find people on one side being held to a different standard than people on the other side.
Starry flights is just as welcome to post on here as the next person. I don’t even know if Starry is male or female. He/she hasn’t attacked Elena or me which is more than I can say for some.
He is voicing that as his opinion. I have seen similar comments made about the 3 names above. I have not taken them down. Yes, the remarks are inflammatory. Respond to him and tell him why you disagree.
By the way, I know for a fact that Elena took down some language about Corey that she felt was over the top. We rarely clean up what people have written unless requested to do so. In this case, she felt it was necessary.
We don’t always call attention to those sorts of things. They are just done quietly.
Anyway, I can see this is a losing argument, and quite frankly, I give up. Let everyone think Corey directly insulted veterans, if that’s what you want them to think. I kind of think it’s so ridiculous and out there to suggest that – that this blog is losing all credibility for me lately in how the topics are getting so sensationalized. I don’t read the Washington Post most of the time for the same reason.
So, that’s kind of where I’m at – and as I’m just repeating myself, I’m done debating this particular topic on here. I think it’s just as distateful the skewed headline at the top of this thread – than what Corey said in the first place. Others will disagree. But it’s clear that some people have such a bias that they just want to make others believe things that aren’t 100% true. And, it is not 100% true that “Corey Stewart Insults Coffee Party Military Vets”. Anyone reading that without any knowledge of what REALLY transpired – would easily say “Corey Stewart must have made insulting remarks about military vets who are members of the Coffee Party”.
I guess others will disagree, and they are more than entitled to do so, but I personally don’t see how you can draw any other conclusion from that.
I find many headlines in the press distasteful the way they distort things from their true meaning. I find this headline equally distasteful.
And with that, I’ve had enough debating this particular thread. Although, quite frankly – this isn’t the only thread with misleading headline or misleading intro – and I never noticed that before – but in the past few days I’m noticing a disturbing trend here.
Well, was a Coffee Party military vet insulted? Yes. Why is that misleading?
I didn’t say that he/she wasn’t welcome to post here. I was just questioning if others agreed with what he/she said. I don’t know how anything I wrote could have possibly been interpreted as my saying he/she should not be allowed to post! That’s ridiculous! Give me a break.
It directly implies he made a remark directly about a military vet. He did not.
I guess we’ll have to agree to disagree on this one, and I sense I’m the only one who feels the way I do. That’s fine, and everyone else is entitled to say that the topic is fine and not at all misleading.
That’s why people should read the entire article. Colonel Morris Davis was insulted. And if he feels he was, that is his reality. We gave him space on this blog the same as we give contributors the right to respond.
I am sorry you feel that way. I am also sorry Colonel Morris feels the way he does.
And Davy Crockett has been dead 170 years.
OK, fair enough. I can’t disagree with what you said above.
I am sure others agree with you, GR.
I believe the content of each article explains further. Headlines are attention grabbers, just like topic paragraphs. If the headline or title is ho hum, who will read it.
OK, and that’s a good policy and I’m glad to hear that was done. And, yes, it makes sense not to call attention to that – for obvious reasons – as it’s better for those kind of posts to “go away quietly” as it were.
OK, I suppose that is fair enough too, as far as a boring topic may not get anyone to read it. I see your point on that.
Perception is reality has a sarcasm alert next to it. I had a Republican wannabe(must use this term as to NOT give away the person’s identity) utter those very words to me. This was after a whining, crying, BITCHing(again do NOT want to reveal identity) elected official of PWC contacted them about me with something that had absolutely NOTHING to do with the individual that made this comment to me and wanted me to conduct myself according their world. HA! I live in the real world, and not some fantasy land. This person thought they were schooling me on the phrase. I’d known that phrase long before that newcomer hit this county.
We can not get into one’s head to determine what their perception/reality is. I do believe that perception is reality. Opinions are just that and nothing more. We all have them and thank goodness we all do not think the same.
I don’t think that Corey intentionally insulted veterans. However, he should have engaged his brain before his mouth. Logically, making a generalized statement about a group applies to all members of the group. Corey said that all A’s (people at the meeting) are B’s (fruitcakes, nuts, etc.). However, since C (a veteran) was at the meeting he is thus also an A. Therefore, C is a B. The statement was likely uttered without such a process of logical reasoning taking place first.
The larger problem is making an uninformed statement with no basis in fact. Specifically, what have people at the Coffee Party said, done or advocated that you disagree with? An ad hominem attack against people simply because they were all present at a function is nonsense (I won’t shift into Spock mode and say illogical).
I like spirited debate of opposing points of view very much. This is one of the most important processes we can use to hone our own views and iron out logical imperfections in our arguments. However, the process must be based on respect for the other person and their point of view even if you believe adamantly that the other person is incorrect.
I have no problem with Corey saying that he opposes the Coffee Party movement. However, give concrete reasons why you don’t support them rather than just calling people names. We need a process of logical thinking and reasoning applied to public policy, rather than a calculation of political expediency or just attacking people you don’t like.
@Visitor
Visitor, he insulted everyone who attended this event. Veterans constituted about a third of the crowd… and some of us vets (I can only speak for what I believe to be the opinion of five of us) take umbrige with his remarks. An insult is a rather subjective thing and difficult for someone who isn’t the target to understand so I discount the opinions of those who weren’t there (nothing personal).
In the larger context, I found the fact that the Chairman would insult and disparage a group of folks he represents for disagreeing with him, exercising their constitutional right to free speech, and perhaps implying that we were not patriotic (with the Tea Party comparison) troubling. If he were not an elected official, I would dismiss his remarks as free speech and ignore them. Since he represents me and I helped elect him a couple of times, it’s not so easy. I’m having trouble remembering another incident where an elected official singled out members of the constituency he represents for such particular scorn.
People may analyze it any way they want; however, it’s as simple as that. When you insult that which you don’t understand or haven’t bothered to investigate, you suffer the consequences. It’s like driving on a dark road at night with your headlights off… you never know what you will run into. It’s better to turn on the lights to see where you are going.
An apology to the entire group would go a long way… things such as this don’t get better with age.
Al, did we just both say sort of the same thing but in different words at the same time?