Is everyone getting ready for the big Turkey Day? Congratulations to the Osbourn Eagles for another great win!
122 Thoughts to “Open Thread Saturday, November 20”
Comments are closed.
Archives
Categories
Blogroll
- 9500Liberty
- Bacons' Rebellion Blogspot
- Bearing Drift
- Blue Virginia
- Citizen Tom
- Counts of Monte Cristo. The
- Derecho, The
- Dixie Pig, The
- My Side of the Fence
- My Star Journey
- NARAL Pro-Choice VA Blog
- New Dominion Project
- Nova Common Sense
- NovaTownHall Blog
- One Libertarians's Point of View by Al Alborn
- Pete Candland's Blog
- Potomac Local
- Prince William Muckraker
- PW Conservation Alliance
- PWC Moms
- PWCPolitics.com
- PWCPolitics.com
- Red NoVA
- Shad Plank, The
- She the People
- State of NoVA, the
- The Jeffersoniad
- Townhall
- VEA Daily Reports
- VivianPaige
- WDGolden.com
- You, Me and the Lamp Post
All contents copyright Moonhowlings.net
Blogroll
- 9500Liberty
- Bacons' Rebellion Blogspot
- Bearing Drift
- Blue Virginia
- Citizen Tom
- Counts of Monte Cristo. The
- Derecho, The
- Dixie Pig, The
- My Side of the Fence
- My Star Journey
- NARAL Pro-Choice VA Blog
- New Dominion Project
- Nova Common Sense
- NovaTownHall Blog
- One Libertarians's Point of View by Al Alborn
- Pete Candland's Blog
- Potomac Local
- Prince William Muckraker
- PW Conservation Alliance
- PWC Moms
- PWCPolitics.com
- PWCPolitics.com
- Red NoVA
- Shad Plank, The
- She the People
- State of NoVA, the
- The Jeffersoniad
- Townhall
- VEA Daily Reports
- VivianPaige
- WDGolden.com
- You, Me and the Lamp Post
I agree with Wolverine, Pat. Herve, and NTK. At this point the scanners seem to be the best way to screen large numbers of travelers flying in the US.
Marinm, you and your wife could take the Autotrain to Florida – get on in Lorton around 4 pm and get to the general Orlando area by 9 or 10 am. Sleeping is a bit rough but the food and companionship is good.
Cargosquid,
I’d venture to say that it’s because hijackers generally used planes in the past for ransom or reaching a destination, not for blowing up. A person hijacked could hope that he/she had the right passport/nationality and not be shot but merely scared and inconvenienced. Now everyone on the plane will be murdered if the current terrorist MO is followed.
Actually, in the 80’s, the threat was one of bombings. This is what I mean:
“Middle Eastern terrorists hijack a U.S. jetliner bound for Italy. A two-week drama ensues in which the plane’s occupants are split into groups and held hostage in secret locations in Lebanon and Syria.
While this drama is unfolding, another group of terrorists detonates a bomb in the luggage hold of a 747 over the North Atlantic, killing more than 300 people.
Not long afterward, terrorists kill 19 people and wound more than a hundred others in coordinated attacks at European airport ticket counters.
A few months later, a U.S. airliner is bombed over Greece, killing four passengers.
Five months after that, another U.S. airliner is stormed by heavily armed terrorists at the airport in Karachi, Pakistan, killing at least 20 people and wounding 150 more.
Things are quiet for a while, until two years later when a 747 bound for New York is blown up over Europe killing 270 passengers and crew.
Nine months from then, a French airliner en route to Paris is bombed over Africa, killing 170 people from 17 countries.”
From http://www.economist.com/blogs/gulliver/2010/11/terrorism_context?page=1
The only thing that has changed is that the terrorists seem to be suicidal now. However, one other thing has changed…..passengers are willing to take on the terrorists now.
My question is, “where do we draw the line?” How invasive and widespread do we want the TSA to become? Their authority covers all public transport.
Cargosquid, another change is that these attacks and attempts at attacks have taken place over US soil. It’s no longer safe to assume that a person won’t be threatened by avoiding overseas travel.
Cargo, another change is that these acts are occurring over US soil and on flights that originate here. One can’t assume that one will be safe by not traveling overseas.
Censored, I thought about that but Amtrak isn’t too different from air travel and the rules for transporting firearms make it unattractive. It doesn’t really hurt {me} too bad as Florida is nice but maybe someplace closer to home will offer me just as good of a vacation/tourist experience as Florida. And, as a consumer of goods I’m speaking with my dollar to voice opposition.
To Wolverine’s point — I don’t think it’s impossible to profile at all our commercial (non-general aviation..that’s still a weak spot) just hard. Real security measures are HARD. Security theatre isn’t.
If you can take an iPod, an iPhone or a laptop on a plane we are still very vulnerable. Yet, we want to look through some woman’s skirt and play with medical implants.
Have you seen THIS shit????? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XSQTz1bccL4
Pinko – have you seen THIS shit???? – http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=45hLKiedoDM
marin – what makes weapon travel on amtrak not attractive – is it the 11 pounds of ammunition limit, or the weapon needs to be in checked baggage? Disney also has a zero weapon policy.
As long as people who wish to do us harm are willing to blow up kids, I don’t think that was all that unreasonable. That also isn’t what ‘strip searching’ means.
Oooops, I agreed with Pat before I even looked at the video.
A roving reporter has reported that there is a haz mat situation at the courthouse on the lower level. It unknown if the entire building will be evacuated or not.
Pinko, the screaming 3 year old girl is worse as she keeps screaming “Stop touching me!!”
An ABC reporter was felt under her underwear and TSA admitted that screener “didn’t follow correct protocol”. I mean, the list goes on and on.
Here’s a montage of a few things: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RhkQoiaf7Uc
I like this quote from Politico. “For the moment, conservatives often critical of what they regard as the Obama administration’s inadequate response to terrorism and liberals who have been railing for years against a variety of intrusive measures undertaken by the national security apparatus since the September 11 attacks seem to have reached a rare consensus.”
So, I have a question. Can I request a female groper instead of a male? And, are we supposed to tip at the end? 😉
@Censored bybvbl
Except that the cases that the TSA cite all originated overseas. Those flights still have the original security. In the case of the Undies bomber, the US was TOLD that he was probably a terrorist. As for the Shoe Bomber, he was stopped in France. Why then did the US allow him to fly THE NEXT DAY?
Mom, Where are you?!!
Steve Griffin is retiring!!! Merry Christmas PWC.
I’m picking my jaw up off the floor and ordering a case a frosty beverages to celebrate. I just hope we don’t go through another Peacor exercise and end up with Utz in his place.
Btw, has anyone else noticed that the TSA agents do not change their gloves between passengers? And they are now touching skin on some of the passengers……
Togetherness…..its so wonderful…..
Corks are popping in the homes and offices of all who care about integrity in government – Griffin is gone!
The dark side of this wonderful news:
Mom’s fear that Griffin’s mini-me, Ray Utz, might take is place is well-founded. If Stewart will promote Peacor, Utz is a likely move also.
Corey Stewart shows his total corruption again in praising a guy who declared Mike Lubely his best friend and rolled out the red carpet for him in the Planning Office, and who protected perpetrators of multiple incidents of harassment and sexual discrimination, of which Stewart was fully aware.
Leave it to Mom to point out the painful possibility of Utz. I too agree it’s well-founded. Let’s say Utz moves up. I hope that doesn’t mean a move up for Myers too.
I don’t know how I missed this on the agenda last Friday. Of course, no image available of this big retirement. Why post a view option if documents aren’t available half the time to review before the meeting. Geesh.
@Cargosquid
Eeeeeeeew!!!!!!
I’m all for security and tough security, but with the technology we have, there has GOT to be a better way to make sure kids aren’t carrying bombs and make sure people aren’t getting felt up..unless they want to be felt up, that is.
And Pat, that clip you showed is disgusting. People have been using kids in war since the beginning of time. You would think we would have evolved by now, but we have not.
Something going on in Gainesville today? I’m hearing all kinds of crazy stuff. Snipers on the roof of La z Boy, problems at the gas station there across from Lowes. Helicopters on the ground right there? Anyone know anything? Could be bogus, but had to ask.
Slow, I have no idea. I think the entire area has gone nuts. Let us know if you find out.
Slow,
Insidenova is saying it’s a suicide at the Hampton Inn and Gainesville on their FB page. Nothing at insidenova.com yet.
@Lafayette
Where did you see that on their page?
And individual posted the question on their wall. There’s about 20 comments.
Never mind. Got it.
I’m watching the BOCS meeting now and the presentation on Obamacare. While I would likely agree with Corey on many of his views on Obamacare, I have some questions.
How did Wells Fargo get involved in this? The resolution passed on May 4 directed staff to conduct a study on the impact of Obamacare. It authorized no expenditure of taxpayer money for outside consultants. I looked at the presentation online and it has only one, vague page specifically related to PWC. The rest is general information on Obamacare that anyone can find online for free (I know, because I’ve done it).
Why would we spend any PWC taxpayer money studying something that is a Federal mandate whether we like it or not? The job of the PWC government is to implement relevant laws, not spend PWC taxpayer money to study and campaign against them.
My conspiratorial mind in all things Stewart leads me to believe that Corey is again using PWC taxpayer money to get something written by an outside and ostensibly independent party that is consistent with his own political agenda. If he wants to use some of the massive pile of developer campaign contributions he has received to crusade against Obamacare, I’d say more power to him. However, using PWC taxpayer dollars to fund a study of something over which the PWC Government has no control over, and that helps advance his own personal ambitions, is exemplary of the fraud and abuse he supposedly opposes.
Repealing or modifying Obamacare is a worthy objective, but one that should be pursued through the open political process and funded by those who share that view. A local jurisdiction has no business using taxpayers’ money to fund a study of and campaign directed against a Federal law.
I hope somebody remembers the cost of these studies come budget time when the BOCS decides to whack more things like senior transportation or elder-care programs.
NTK, I’m all for dumping the lobbyist PWC pays for every year as well.
Any fans of Mythbusters here? Adam Savage talking about TSA and the full body scanner.
Warning about language in the clip. 🙂
http://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/news/2010/11/adam-savage-tsa-saw-my-junk-missed-12-razor-blades.ars
No need to apologize to John Stirrup, Ms. Caddigan. Your vote said it all. Well, here’s another example of a the “power of 5”.
Thank you, Supervisors Stirrup, May, and Principi!!!
Go John Stirrup and Mike May! The BOCS is voting on the economic development strategy as proposed by Stewart’s developer council. See the page at:
http://www.pwcgov.org/default.aspx?topic=040086003790005842
This “task force” is nothing but Stewart’s developer cronies, including Mike Lubely, and a few others such as people from GMU thrown in to make it look legitimate.
John is arguing against the extension of the Rt. 234 bypass into Loudoun, which the task force recommended but would be nothing more than a developers’ road to open up the Rural Crescent to more residential development, as Stewart and his campaign contributors want. Mike May spoke against it. Frank Principi didn’t comment but voted no also.
This is the same “Gang of Five” (Stewart, Covington, Nohe, Jenkins and Caddigan) that gave us Avendale last summer, and the same three (Stirrup, May and Principi) who stood up for the taxpayers.
NTK,
I couldn’t believe what I witnessed earlier. The “Road to Dulles” is a road to nowhere. I can’t imagine Gum Springs road being four lanes. I doubt the folks out there want to see their windy little back road wider and more cars. The additional cars would just be sitting in traffic. Loudoun has no plans to expand it’s roads. Furthermore, where’s all the money supposed to come from for such a project.
NTK,
That’s quite a cast of characters on that list in the link you posted. Thanks, but no thanks. 😉
I have been told that one of the key parts of the Israeli profiling system is that they actually interview every passenger That’s right. You get a face to face private meeting with a security agent who passes judgement on you. It seems to work on their scale, and more power to them.
Now, imagine doing that at O’Hare with four times the number of passengers as Ben Gurion in a cultural variety that is likely much greater. Good God, there would be total chaos. I cannot remember a time going through O’Hare for a connecting flight when my arriving flight was not late, and I had to run from one end of that huge terminal to the other. ( Try that with kids when you are trying to keep to at least two international connections to get to someplace in Africa.. It turned into NASCAR with strollers.) And you want to add a security interview to that while my critical foreign connection aircraft is starting to close the doors? I’d rather use a few seconds to get my picture taken naked by a scanner. As for intrusiveness, you think a scanner is more intrusive that having to be questioned by a security agent in a closed-door interview?
I tell you that, if you want to have full protection through the Israeli method in this country, you are going to have to hire a cadre of profilers with absolutely the right skills and talent which could become a security force as large as the US Army. Imagine yourself as a profiler. You punch the traveler’s name into your computer tracking system. The response is “No traces.” Does that mean the traveler is pure as the driven snow? No, it just means that YOU don’t know anything. Then you have to make a judgement based on a short interview of a person whom you have never seen or heard of in your life. The natural reaction will to go negative on those who fit your own version or the common version of a potential terrorist for whatever reasons; and then TSA will start to get the discrimination law suits until they are coming out of their ears. On the other hand, the technical scanning methods and the body searches are non-discriminatory. Eventually TSA will get the personal techniques down right and end most of the complaints now hitting the internet.
I recall once going from one place to another in Africa when a young African student boarded the aircraft. He was on his way home for the holidays from his studies in Paris. That kid was the original “Nervous Nellie.” Flying obviously scared him to death, and that fright was highly visible. He sat next to me, and all through the flight his hands gripped the seat dividers until the skin on them actually turned white. I tried my best to calm him down a bit; but it was not until the plane hit the runway at our destination that the kid relaxed his grip and then started saying more Praise be to Allah’s than you would hear in a mosque at Friday prayers. How would you like to be the security profiler on that one?
Wolverine, I just love it that you are blowing all the pat answers to smitherines. You know me and those simple answers to very complex problems that end up being sound bites. You go guy!
Good job, NTK. I feel like I live in bizarro world every time I watch the BOCS lately. Confuse and obfuscate. That’s how the chairman does business.
No one authorized an outside agency to do business. I gave up and took a power nap. Apparently I missed seeing El Jefe get his butt handed to him.
@Cargosquid I plan to politely demand that the TSA agent change gloves before putting a hand on me. They would expect no less from their own doctors and nurses.
Hey, a gal’s gotta find some control where she can.
Stirrup http://www.opensecrets.org/revolving/rev_summary.php?id=75999 and his wife http://www.opensecrets.org/lobby/lobbyist.php?lname=Stirrup%2C+Heidi+H&id=Y00000091620&year=2008 have been registered industry lobbyists for a number of years.
I flew from Dulles to JFK and back today and I didn’t see anyone getting scanned or patted down. Security seemed to move like normal and the people I spoke with said they’d put safety first … of course none of us went through the full treatment.
First time I ever flew Jet Blue. More leg room than other airlines. On time both ways. Full can of soda and chips or cookies. Pilot stood at the cockpit door and handed wings to the kids and the flight attendant gave everyone mini prepackaged toothbrushes as we got off. Screen on the back of each seat with multi-channels of free TV. It reminded me of the old Piedmont Airlines where they appear to value their customers and appreciate the business. On the other hand, I will never take the Super Shuttle van again. I spent more time in vans than I did in airplanes. I can’t believe the last driver didn’t crash or run over a pedestrian, and I’m surprised the horn isn’t worn out.
Wow That brings back memories of getting a coloring book, crayons, and a plastic wings every time I boarded a Pan Am, Delta, or Flying Tigers plane. And mid-flight, we kids were allowed to enter/tour the cock pit, as the pilots created mini field trips mid-pacific for us. Even on military space A flights we we as kids were given a tour of the cockpit. Back in my day we were given hot meals, and yes we had a movie “Coal Miner’s Daughter” with free head phones. One screen in the front.
Moe, I like Jet Blue also. However, I hate that trashy waiting room area in JFK. Has that improved?
The TV is very nice, especially cross country.
Their waiting area was okay. It had an area where you could plug in a laptop or recharge an iPhone, and there was a pretty good bar right at the gate. They also had plenty of gate personnel who were pleasant and informative. It was on par with the one for the Delta Shuttle at LaGuardia.
I flew out of Dulles a few weeks ago and I didn’t see any full body scanners. I’ll be flying out of there again this Monday so will see what happens…
There’s a much better way – called explosive trace detection. It uses a portable sniffer unit that doesn’t need to make contact with the person or the cargo – you just wave it around close by and it samples the air. Most explosives leave trace residue and this can definitely detect PETN which is the substance that was in those cargo shipments destined for Chicago.
If the TSA would just get moving on these sorts of things we wouldn’t be needing to subject people to full body scans or invasive pat downs. Also, a large amount of cargo right now must be visually inspected which is time consuming.
Moe, when I was there it looked third world. I think it must have moved. There was a lot of up and down on very acrophobia catwalks.
GR, I think they are rotating their location, but I couuld be wrong.
A great way of spreading around germs – especially during the flu season time of the year. Not to mention it is just gross.
I think you are right – at this point not enough to deploy full time at all airports. By the way, one of my comments is stuck in moderation for some unknown reason – you can fix it when you get the opportunity – no rush.
Two years ago I flew JetBlue to Boston and then came back from Burlington, VT via JFK since there was no direct flight from Burlington to here. I had a 3 hour layover and thought there would be plenty to do at JFK to kill time. Little did I know I was stuck in that stupid ugly terminal and there were no shops, nothing! I’m glad to hear it may have changed for the better as I might be visiting up north again this summer and would have to come back the same way.
Governor McDonnell and the Virginia delegation met with the SECDEF yesterday to try and stop the closure of JFCOM and sharp cuts in spending on defense contractors. It highlights the hypocrisy in the “cut taxes, cut spending and reduce the deficit” right-wing mantra … people like McDonnell and Cooch are all for reining in government, so long as it’s reined in somewhere else.
@Gainesville Resident
GR, you and I are speaking of the same place. No shops other than a very limited snack bar. Getting to it made you think you were being hurded through a prison system. The guards weren’t so friendly either. I thought it was just because I was in NYC though.
Moe, what do those things stand for?
@Gainesville Resident
GR, you have been freed up from moderation. I don’t know why you got stuck.