There will always be people who want to put their own spin on things. Actually the BOCS meeting last Tuesday and the legislative action taken really wasn’t about illegal immigration. It was about good governance. And our BOCS failed the test.
No one I am aware of is arguing that the current process of checking immigration status after one is arrested is a bad thing. Most people I know feel that this is a fair, workable solution to a troublesome problem. No one wants criminals on the street.
The problem Tuesday began with lack of transparency. The final UVA Report was unavailable for preview before the presentation. For $385,000, this just should not be happening. The agenda had irregularities. The posted agenda showed recess was scheduled and a press conference planned during the recess. Again, this was highly irregular behavior and there was no explanation given. Should citizens be suspicious? To add to the confusion and obfuscation, 2 supervisors left during the business meeting and met with the press. Why did the press have to be spoken to before the meeting was adjourned?
When the Chairman and Supervisor Stirrup returned to the room where the meeting had continued, there was a motion to attach a policy statement to the county legislative package that would mandate that all localities in the state adopt the same immigration policy currently enacted in Prince William County. Several supervisors questioned the idea of mandating such action as a legislative recommendation. They felt it was an unfunded mandate for the rest of the state. Frankly, asking for legislation that requires others localities to do what we did WOULD be an unfunded mandate. Citizens should remember that to get where we are currently cost us millions of dollars. All of that training and and various programs are not free. Other localities might not have the money in these tough times.
Corey Stewart would not compromise on language. He wanted to mandate rather than suggest.
According to the Washington Post:
The legislative priority was initiated by board Chairman Corey A. Stewart, who, earlier this year, began a separate campaign to bring immigration reform to Virginia. Although his original campaign, dubbed the Virginia Rule of Law, advocated the state adopt a policy similar to Arizona’s controversial law, Stewart said Wednesday he would prefer the state adopt a policy similar to Prince William’s and direct jurisdictions to follow it.
“Yes this costs money and you could consider it an unfunded mandate, but the reality is some things are worth it,” Stewart said, noting he views illegal immigration as an unfunded mandate. “I want the mandate. The message we want to send is this policy worked for Prince William and it would be good on a statewide basis.”
And that is the root of the problem.
How sad that others have turned the NO votes of Supervisors Nohe and Principi into a vote on immigration when the votes were about the legislative package and good governance. Someone is obsessing about the past it seems.
Apparently ‘Read the bill! Read the Bill!’ is just for Democrats in Congress, and doesn’t apply to our supervisors. Those supervisors needed to have time to read the UVA Report (which does contain a few glaring errors), digest the report, and determine if they were comfortable asking the rest of the state to follow their lead. Most of the supervisors were unaware that they would be asked to vote on such a legislative initiative and none had had the time to digest the material in the report.
The vote should have been tabled. However, Chairman Stewart has places to go and announcements to make. The vote of the supervisors was needed to put his master plan into place before the State Republican Convention which takes place this weekend. Chairman Stewart must have a date with destiny.
“No one I am aware of is arguing that the current process of checking immigration status after one is arrested is a bad thing.”
Except for the federal gov’t when talking about Arizona……
I’m curious. What type of extra training does one need to check an arrestee’s immigration status?
In order to be part of the 287g program our police force had to undergo 8 hours of training. The Criminal Alien Unit, the 6 officers assigned to only do 287g work, had about 4 weeks of training.
I believe some of the training dealt with not trampling on civil rights so you got sued.
My statement was about PW County only. And our policy is NOT like what Arizona was proposing.
I’m all for enacting laws to stop/limit illegal immigration. However, mandating some of the counties in southwestern Virginia and other rural areas to spend this kind of money on something that does NOT effect their community in the least, is quite troublesome to me. I seriously doubt the boys of Franklin Co. are hiring illegal aliens to work for them. Some of these counties barely have enough money to keep the lights on in City Hall and their schools. Think about it.
Still wondering why checking into the status of every arrestee, though, would need training or be a possibility of civil rights violation. If all proper police procedures are followed, there should be no civil rights violations.
That’s the only thing I’m asking about. I realize that the other aspects would take training. Personally, the aspects fo the 287g program should be included in every LEO basic training.
You’re right about process. In an ideal world.
But the situation we live in is a tyrannical federal Government fighting against us, and people like Stewart and Stirrup fighting for what most of us believe in and want. So I support them on this.
@Rick,
But do you know what they actually did? We aren’t debating whether our policy is good, bad or indifferent. We are speaking of transparency. Do you want to mandate that Bedford, Virginia enact this policy at the cost of millions? That is what we are talking about.
The BOCS was asked to vote on something they hadn’t had time to read. And they did. This is not a good thing.
And you are aware that this is all an election ploy? Why does it bother you less when Corey does it than when Obama plays you?
The supposed impropriety here is so much less than that of an Obama and a Holder suing the State of Arizona for attempting to enforce a law that Obama/Holder refuse to enforce because it is not in their political interest. While simultaneously conducting outreach efforts encouraging people to flout that law.
There are a whole bunch of people out there, some of them scholarly even, who don’t feel that the entire AZ law is on the up and up. Many feel the Supremecy clause kicks in.
Secondly, I have no control over what happens in AZ. I can almost get to the point where I can say I don’t care what happens in AZ.
Lastly, I do care what happens in PWC and in Virginia. And that is what I have in my sites.
Cargo, maybe Lucky Duck will come along and explain it. He will know.
“Read the Bill, Read the Bill” Apparently, Stewart needs to read his own bill. From the Post:
“Nowhere in the statement approved by the board does it say Virginia should mandate jurisdictions follow a specific immigration policy. Instead, it says that the county supports the implementation of similar policies and programs because it will “enhance public safety across the Commonwealth.”
If he wanted an “unfunded mandate,” maybe he should have drafted his language that way!
F4T: That is part of the issue. No one is really sure what went into the legislative package regarding PW policy. I believe the citizens have a right to transparency. I am not even sure the supervisors know what they voted on. In fact, I would bet on it, since no one has been able to explain it to our satisfaction.
There is a huge disconnect somewhere out there. Bizarro-land.
“Do you want to mandate that Bedford, Virginia enact this policy at the cost of millions?”
Yes. it costs us all less in the end.
“Why does it bother you less when Corey does it than when Obama plays you?”
Stewart does “it” in an honest fashion. We know what he stands for – curbing illegal immigration, spending less. Obama is duplicitous. He says that he wants to reduce health care prices, then colludes with drug companies to keep their prices as inflated as they want them to be. And Obama works hard to maintain the false perception – which is slipping away, year-by-year – that we can’t fight illegal immigration, that we the people need to accept an Amnesty-first from our representatives instead of a sovereignty-first approach.
Corey does it in an honest fashion? Bwaaahahahahaha…I am speechless.
Do you think if another issue came along that would guarantee corey be elected he would drop immigration like a hot potato.
I know people who have been told by Corey that he doesn’t really care about it. Its just been a good ticket to ride.
There are people who truly believe what they are touting. I simply don’t believe Corey is one of them.
I also don’t believe we have the right to ask other jurisdictions to strip their resources to appease us. I hate unfunded mandates. And everyone knows which is my most unfavorite unfunded mandate. NCLB
Cargo, I checked and here is the answer I got:
It was training to be authorized by the Feds to check immigration status. That authority must be given by ICE – they give it by providing training and certifying the officers.
Its just not a step they allow to be skipped. Liablility I guess.
In case anyone is interested.
Virginia Virtucon has information abt something called
“RPV Advance” in Richmond and Corey and Maria Stewart will be hosting
“Corey Stewart’s Conservatives’ Shindig” with open bar and Swedish meatballs.
About three years ago, I asked Cargo’s question to an ICE field supervisor. He showed me a small US governemnt produced booklet that had samples of the 35 or so (CRS sufferer here) most common documents that prove legal status for non-citizens. He explained that these were but a small sample of the myriad of governement forms that could prove legal status. He also said that ICE agents were continually updated on the ever-changing documents that could prove legality. I don’t wonder that when local police try to ensure appropriate documentation that they would need trining equal to an ICE agent’s to be efffective. Cargo needs info on what training ICE agents receive before they are put in the field.
“I know people who have been told by Corey that he doesn’t really care about it. Its just been a good ticket to ride. ”
Well, good for him. I think Sarah Palin’s going to look to ride this issue on a national level.
@punchak
Many PW Republicans will be paying for that Shindig. I thought it was at Tysons. Well, well well, look what someone slipped to me.
See new thread. Your tax dollars at work.
@Rick, well she should. I guess she knows more about illegal immigration than anyone else–her being from Alaska and all.
one of the major issues with unfunded mandates, is that we are only against them, when we are against the issue. Take Medicare Part D – unfunded, but voted in by the majority in Congress.
@Pat, excellent example. Elena keeps bringing this up. And of course I defend it because I sure know a lot of people who take advantage of its savings. Those savings can make a huge difference in a senior getting the right medication and not. It becomes a quality of life issue. After my mother came to this area, and right before part D passed, her meds were in a brief upheaval…policies catching up to prescriptions and all that. For one morth, her prescriptions cost something like $1500 a month. I nearly passed out when I saw her bill. We were able to adjust things because of her own policy but…it is an indication of what things would have cost her had she not had private insurance. That is horrible. Many seniors don’t even make that in medicare!
And you are right Pat, Medicare Part D was an unfunded mandate. I digress…..
Many localities don’t even have a police force…how on earth can they afford a program similar to ours.
Corey needs to visit the rest of the states to see what some localies are like in other parts of the state. He is simply politically big assing. Some of those good old boys from Southwest will sure give him his come-uppings.
Yes, Moon – instead of doing something to fix the rising costs of healthcare, the Congress, in 2003, pushed through Part D – which I actually think is/was needed, but failed to provide any funding for it. (many congressional aides then went on to lobby for the Rx industry). Giving away negotiated drug prices, the program will continue to rise in cost. A responsible Congress would have provided a funding stream – maybe raise taxes.
Same with this proposal (and the Disabled Veterans property tax exemption) – it is fine if the State is going to enforce this, but you cannot expect a locality to pick up the cost, without funding the program. Same goes for Federal mandates.
Apparently, what we need are LESS documents that prove citizenship or residency. NOT more training. Bureaucracy complexity always grows worse.
@Pat, no one has ever explained why ordering in bulk from Canada was never part of that deal. Could it be???? The drug lobby???? [best Jon Stewart voice]
Cargo–whatever happened to being able to get a frequent flier card? Whatever happened to some of the other identity techniques like finger print scanner or retinal scans?
@ Cargo; go ahead and tell your senator or congressman. Fewer documents and less ICE bureaucracy are Federal matters–not county matters.
Careful, dude, you’ll make people’s heads explode saying things like that!! 🙂
Slow, Jon Stewart does a wonderful skit about men voting for Palin. It isn’t too flattering though.
Quite frankly, I don’t see how PW taxpayers are paying for Corey’s shindig. Unless there are some hard facts about that – I think that’s just inaccurate.
HIs shindig isn’t being paid for by taxpayers but he is touting it on the back of a report you and I both paid for. $385,000 in fact.
Some republicans have had quite a bit to say about PWC Republican money going out of the county for this party but I will let them speak for themselves.