Open Thread………………………………………….Friday, January 21

Moon-howler

January 21, 2011 at 9:07 pm

How about a little lead up to what youo are talking about, Cargo. Neutral data…what it about?

Did everyone else know that tonight was the last episode ever of Medium? I am so sad. What a great show!!! I feel like someone died.

Cargosquid

January 21, 2011 at 9:14 pm

Neutral data? huh?

I just put those up because they looked interesting or funny. I mean, who builds artificial sandbars in the ocean and expects them to stay there?

The Sharia one is about AIG using Muslim religious law to base legal and finance decisions.

Medium. I feel like someone died. Did you mean to make a joke?

Cargosquid

January 21, 2011 at 9:21 pm

Olbermann is no longer on MSNBC. Tonight is his last night.

I’m gonna miss ol’ whatisname.

Actually, I will. He was such a great bad example.

Moon-howler

January 21, 2011 at 9:51 pm

Ok, thanks. I wasnt sure that the links were about.

re Medium. I will really miss the show.

Olbermann-that was fast. Wonder what happened.

Cargosquid

January 21, 2011 at 9:51 pm

http://www.americancivicliteracy.org/resources/quiz.aspx

Take the test! Amaze your friends! Win prizes!

Actually there are no prizes…..

I did 93.94% 2 “wrong”

And I emailed them to show where I think that their test is wrong and I was right.

Cargosquid

January 21, 2011 at 10:02 pm

The official statement:

21 Jan 2011 8:02 PM
STATEMENT REGARDING KEITH OLBERMANN:

MSNBC and Keith Olbermann have ended their contract. The last broadcast of “Countdown with Keith Olbermann” will be this evening. MSNBC thanks Keith for his integral role in MSNBC’s success and we wish him well in his future endeavors.

“MSNBC thanks Keith for his integral role in MSNBC’s success”

Really? That’s just harsh. It’s not all HIS fault that their ratings suck….. 😉

Pat.Herve

January 22, 2011 at 7:29 am

@Cargosquid

Yes, the Feds invested in AIG to keep it afloat. All the widows depending on an annuity, or foreign investors looking to invest in the US, and use AIG as an insurance company, and others like Goldman Saks and UBS were made hole. The Feds are not running the business. The Feds do not make the day to day decisions on where to put business focus.

What would the ramifications be if the Feds did not salvage AIG – it would have been a domino effect, that could have crippled our country for much longer and worse than the Great Depression – imagine the number of 401k’s that would be wiped out – even today, there are some that are not near recovered (sometimes because of bad decisions on the person). AIG failing, would cause a rush on other insurance companies (remember the rush on the banks in the Depression), and cause them to fail – Allstate, State Farm, etc.

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/03/03/business/economy/03sorkin.html

Do I like what was done, and infuse cash in the business – NO
Should Management be rewarded for running the business into the ground – NO
Did I take my Castor Oil as a kid – Yes.
Sometimes you just have to take the medicine so that you can get better.

When AIG was tetering, and they were paying out bonuses, I remember the pundits saying – but it is a contract, we must stand up to the contract and pay out these bonuses. But when it comes to GM, first thing the same pundit says is – bust up the union contract.

Pat.Herve

January 22, 2011 at 7:51 am

I will throw this one out….

So, on a nice Saturday afternoon, Gabby Giffords is having a meet n greet. She is healthy, in the prime of her life, and life is wonderful with her loving husband. Then – bam – she is shot. Is she worried about the cost of the neurosurgeon, or the rehab? What about the transportation costs? What other costs – how much is the medication she is taking? Did she ask if the anesthesiologist was in her plan? Thankfully, she has insurance – and although not entirely, her expenses will be covered – and it looks like she will recover, and I pray that she does.

Now, what about the 13 other wounded victims? Did they all have health insurance? I do not know. What I do know, is if you are shot, you are not going to ask the anesthesiologist if he is in your plan, or the cost of the surgery. Are they going to go bankrupt and loose their house in order to pay for rehab? And now, many of those people have a pre-existing condition – some bullets or fragments are just not removed, and will need care later on, as it moves around the body. Will they hit a lifetime cap on the care? We hear very little to nothing on the extent of their injuries and their recovery progress – are any of them paralyzed? Were they there for the meet n greet at all – or just walking by into the supermarket? But the thing is, is that they did not think they needed health insurance, as they were in good health….

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2011/01/21/tucson-aftermath-demonstrates-high-medical-cost-shootings/

Slowpoke Rodriguez

January 22, 2011 at 8:18 am

I, for one, will really miss Keith Olbermann. I guess “Countdown to No Ratings” is finally complete, huh?

Slowpoke Rodriguez

January 22, 2011 at 8:21 am

Moon-howler :
Ok, thanks. I wasnt sure that the links were about.
re Medium. I will really miss the show.
Olbermann-that was fast. Wonder what happened.

It has been speculated that it is the same reason Proctologists retire…..eventually, they get tired of dealing with ……..

Big Dog

January 22, 2011 at 8:34 am

http://www.roanoke.com/274594

Thou SHALL NOT raise a ruckus?

Elena

January 22, 2011 at 8:55 am

Pat,
I have been wondering about the rehabiliation. So many people have maximums, they choose that limit to be able to afford their health insurance. You ask great questions, I wonder what the answers will be.

Posting as Pinko

January 22, 2011 at 10:48 am

@Moon-howler
MH, there IS medical research that backs my assertion that nerve endings develop in week 3, maybe week 4.

“Weeks One Through Four

• Ovulation occurs – The time is right; now you just need this egg to be fertilized!

• Conception occurs – Did you know that during your pregnancy that your uterus will increase its capacity by 1000 times?!

• Gender is determined – Immediately upon fertilization your little one is set as a boy or a girl. Ladies, this is one that you can’t take credit for since it is up to the sperm to determine the sex of your baby. Sperm carries either a “X” (girl) chromosome or a “Y” (boy) chromosome. (*Hint:* You will have to hold off on picking out the pink or blue until at least the second trimester when the gender will be visible via ultrasound.)

• Implantation – Some spotting (also known as implantation bleeding) may occur about 10 – 14 days after conception. You may believe you are starting your period but generally this bleeding is extremely light and lasts only a day or so.

• Neural tube forms – It will develop into the nervous system (Brain, spinal cord, hair, and skin). Already your baby has the foundation for thought, senses, feeling, and more!

• Heart and primitive circulatory system rapidly form – While still in its beginning stages, this is the very life support system that will carry your child throughout his or her life.”

http://www.pregnancy.org/fetaldevelopment/weeks-1-4

Furthermore, I can absolutely separate judging women from judging abortion even though abortion makes me uncomfortable. Why? There are many good people who do things I consider immoral, unethical, bad, etc. They do these things because they feel their back is against the wall, because they don’t know any better, because they are screwed up, etc. They aren’t necessarily evil people. Let’s just say I know this from being around friends who have had to make this terrible decision. I have also been around people who make poor choices or who are out of control. That doesn’t make them bad people. It also doesn’t make them irredeemable.

There is a limit, however. Make bad choices over and over and continue to hurt people even though you’ve been taught better and you are in your right mind? Then I start to judge a person even though I probably have no right to.

Lafayette

January 22, 2011 at 10:49 am

Did everyone in PWC get their 18page glossy page copy of PWC Reports yesterday? There’s some good stuff in there, but is that really how our tax dollars need to be sent in this economy? I was so lucky I got not one, but TWO sent to my house with my address on both. I wonder how many other households got two copies? The funny thing is this looks more like a campaign flyer of sorts.

Moon,
If you hated the cost of the postcards paid for by discretionary funds, then I’m sure you going to love this. 👿

Posting as Pinko

January 22, 2011 at 10:58 am

@Lafayette
Yeah, I got it and thought the same thing. And I bet most of the copies get dumped in the trash, not in the recycle bin. Most of them probably won’t even be read.

Lafayette

January 22, 2011 at 11:16 am

@Posting as Pinko
I know one copy that’s going to be read for informational and entertainment purposes. 😉

Moon-howler

January 22, 2011 at 11:33 am

@Lafayette

I heard that the report was out and that is was pure Corey self promotion, including misinformation from the UVA report. I guess we bought and paid for that one.

Moon-howler

January 22, 2011 at 11:52 am

@Pinko,

You and I have very different thinking on what judging someone means. It sounds to me like you have judged them if you have made the determination that their back was up against the wall or that they didn’t know any better. That is a form of judgement, by definition. But think what you want.

There is no scientific or medical evidence that a 3 week embryo is sentient. A pregnancy website is a great place for mommy info. It isn’t a good place for scientific facts.

People may feel about the subject any way they want. Its a personal issue. How I feel certainly has nothing to do with public policy and laws.

The fact remains, however, that abortion is a legal procedure. Elena and I will not permit incorrect medical information to go unchallenged on the blog.

Cargosquid

January 22, 2011 at 12:21 pm

@Pat.Herve
Pat,

My post wasn’t a critique of the bailout. That’s old news. It was the fact that the defacto OWNER, the government, is now pushing a religious based legal system.

Sharia is NOT compatible with western law and principles.

Emma

January 22, 2011 at 12:39 pm

“There is no scientific or medical evidence that a 3 week embryo is sentient.”

Of course, there is no evidence that a 3-week-old embryo isn’t sentient, either. It’s possible to anguish over the loss of life without condemning the woman.

The death penalty allows for the state-sponsored killing of obviously sentient human beings.

George S. Harris

January 22, 2011 at 1:07 pm

@Cargosquid
Who really gives a rat’s behind if they sink out of sight? “Not I”, cried the little red hen.

Moon-howler

January 22, 2011 at 1:13 pm

Not everyone believes that life begins at conception or that killing those who have committed heinous crimes is wrong. In fact, many people believe they have every right to decide when they have personally come to the end of the line.

The latter will become the lastest frontier of controversy as the boomers age and find asking those kinds of question are more relevant for aging parents and themselves.

George S. Harris

January 22, 2011 at 1:24 pm

@Pat.Herve
Your points are well made Pat. After my wife suffered two fractured cervical vertebrae, a spinal fusion, two strokes and almost a year of rehabilitation, I am so thankful for medical coverage through military TRICARE and a supplement. I have been afraid to add up the total cost, but I suspect it well over $1 MILLION. And during that time we saw folks who had to give up rehabilitation because they had no more funds. I have a minister friend whose wife is totally paralyzed as the result of a one car accident and no seatbelts on–limited coverage and not eligible for MEDICARE–both waived paying into Social Security–so they have their alms basket out much of the time trying to find sufficient funds.

Neither my wife, myself or the minister and his wife thought any of this was going to happen. But the differences is results is indiciative of the need to make sure you have adequate health coverage. Healthcare Reform (I refuse to call it Obamacare anymore than I would call Medicare “Johnsoncare”) will help that.

George S. Harris

January 22, 2011 at 1:28 pm

@Cargosquid

I think you are stretching things more than just a little bit Cargo. If the government is sponsoring a particular religious view, then why in the hell do we have chaplains in the military? They are paid by the government. And why do they build churches on military bases? They are paid for by the government. And why do we now have muslim chaplains in the military? They are paid by the government. And on and on “ad infinitum ad nauseum”.

Cargosquid

January 22, 2011 at 1:59 pm

@George S. Harris
Go read the article. They explain it better than I can.

They will be basing legal decisions on Sharia. I’m just reporting what they said.

Moon-howler

January 22, 2011 at 2:23 pm

Is it possible that IAG has a certain client base that requires this? If that is the case, it doesn’t bother me. Perhaps they also hold a client base for polygamists or other groups that might need special provisions that regular law just doesn’t cover.

Cargosquid

January 22, 2011 at 2:29 pm

Recent news has mentioned China’s almost monopoly on “rare earths”.

Apparently, its cheaper to mine them there……go figure.

Monopoly though? Not so much….

http://newenergyandfuel.com/http:/newenergyandfuel/com/2010/11/24/a-new-fact-check-on-the-rare-earth-elements/

Posting as Pinko

January 22, 2011 at 3:08 pm

@Moon-howler
“You and I have very different thinking on what judging someone means.”

I see what you mean. I always think of “judging” people in a negative context because people don’t usually care if they are judged in a positive way 🙂 I also thought of figuring “their back is against the wall” etc. as understanding, not judging. Damn. Now I have to do some denotation/connotation/deconstruction ruminating.

And I also agree that abortions should be done safely.

Emma, I think when a being has a brain and nerve endings, it’s sentient at some level. Maybe that makes me weird, but I figure anything that can feel pain must be sentient on some level.

Red Dawn

January 22, 2011 at 7:57 pm

Lafayette, I received 2 copies in the mail and thought the same thing!!

George S. Harris

January 22, 2011 at 11:36 pm

@Cargosquid
Please don’t insult me by suggesting I read the article. There are billions of OUR dollars in the Middle East–if we are to get our hands on those $$ it just might be that in order to deal with them we might have to so some things differently.

BTW–you didn’t answer even one of my questions. Our government sponsors religion all of the time. Even our esteemed Congress has a chaplains–guess who pays them? And you know who else starts with an invocaton? SCOTUS!! “God save the United States and this honorable court.” So where doyou want to start? Pick a place…your choice.

Cargosquid

January 23, 2011 at 1:05 am

George, That wasn’t an insult. And I wasn’t worried about Chaplains. I was talking about seeking Sharia based legal decisions. And the people involved explain it better than I do. Geez, take a chill pill. There’s a difference between Chaplains and using foreign law for precedent. Are you suggesting I have a problem with religion IN government ie, chaplains and prayers? Boy do you have it wrong.

Just thought someone might be interested in something I found on the net. Go read it if you feel like it. It was a different take on law, business, and religion. If you don’t want to, don’t do it. I don’t care.

Disgusted

January 23, 2011 at 9:43 am

Hiya. Figured you all would get a kick outa @Greg L’s deleting my post on Del. Bob Marshall’s bill to restrict gays from serving in the VA National Guard.

I’ve been needling Greg about when this would finally get submitted, seeing how open minded he is on things like this. Mr. Marshall beat the clock and finally submitted it by Friday’s deadline. It has one patron listed…Mr. Marshall, by the way. I predicted it passing the HOD and being defeated in the VA Senate, but the thing I think that lead to my post being defeated was my prediction that 100% of the BVBL die-hards would go insane. I confess I did call Mr. Marshall a re-social engineer. Anyway, they are a rather vocal bunch over there and loads of fun to verbally spar with. Anyway, he deleted it. I’ve since reposted on his open thread…ahem…and called him out. I’m anticipating another delete. Oh well.

Thanks for offering a sane and respectful site. The air is so much more free over here!
Keep the faith – fight the good fight.

Moon-howler

January 23, 2011 at 10:22 am

Greetings and welcome, Disgusted. We are glad you have found your way over to the light screen. You were in the dark too long!

Side-show Bob’s bills often die a slow and painful death, amongst the hoots and snickers of the general assembly.

Glad you are here. I hope you will be a regular contributor. MH

George S. Harris

January 23, 2011 at 10:42 am

@Cargosquid
Does being stupid hurt? If so, you must be in pain all the time. I read the article–but you were apparently too supid to understand that I did. Do you honestly believe that we don’t follow the laws of others when we are doing business with them? It is not always USA uber alles. You might read this article to see what your wild eyed ultraconservative friends are saying and the refutation of those comments: http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-503544_162-20019405-503544.html I doubt that you will get much out of it. You can lead a horse to water…

Moon-howler

January 23, 2011 at 11:21 am

Reminder about what the President said. Kinder gentler us!

Far be it from me to step into an altercation between squid but come on, guys. All squid are smart, even if I don’t agree with them.

marinm

January 23, 2011 at 12:23 pm

MSNBC is seen as too progressive and Comcast will be moving it more to the right? My head hurts. I must be in bizaro world. 🙂

Cargosquid

January 23, 2011 at 1:00 pm

George,

Look, jerk. I didn’t put that up there as a political, OH NO! I put it up there because it was an interesting take by a the Thoma More center. Nothing I’ve posted on THIS thread has “wild eyed”. You’re the one bringing up extraneous BS. You’re the one talking about insults. You’re the suddenly being insulting. So Eff OFF.

Moon-howler

January 23, 2011 at 1:41 pm

@marin,

Who sees MSNBC as too progressive? Progressives?

Anyone watching Morning Joe might worry that MCNBC is becoming too fair and balanced.

Even Rachel Maddow is extremely polite.

George S. Harris

January 23, 2011 at 2:09 pm

Cargosquid :@Pat.Herve Pat,
My post wasn’t a critique of the bailout. That’s old news. It was the fact that the defacto OWNER, the government, is now pushing a religious based legal system.
Sharia is NOT compatible with western law and principles.

I don’t know how you can not call this being “critical”. By some personal measurement you have decided that, “Sharia is NOT compatible with western law and principles.” While I am not a Sharia scholar you might want to consider some of this:

Shariah-compliant assets reached about $400 billion throughout the world in 2009, according to Standard & Poor’s Ratings Services, and the potential market is $4 trillion. Iran, Saudi Arabia and Malaysia have the biggest sharia-compliant assets.

In 2009 Iranian banks accounted for about 40 percent of total assets of the world’s top 100 Islamic banks. Bank Melli Iran, with assets of $45.5 billion came first, followed by Saudi Arabia’s Al Rajhi Bank, Bank Mellat with $39.7 billion and Bank Saderat Iran with $39.3 billion. Iran holds the world’s largest level of Islamic finance assets valued at $235.3bn which is more than double the next country in the ranking with $92bn. Six out of ten top Islamic banks in the world are Iranian. In November 2010, The Banker published its latest authoritative list of the Top 500 Islamic Finance Institutions with Iran topping the list. Seven out of ten top Islamic banks in the world are Iranian according to the list.

Further–Sharia banking doesn’t allow for usury and Islamic law prohibits investing in businesses that are considered unlawful, (such as businesses that sell alcohol or pork, or businesses that produce media such as gossip columns or pornography, which are contrary to Islamic values). In the late 20th century, a number of Islamic banks were created to cater to this particular banking market.

Does really sound to bad to me. Perhaps if Goldman Sachs, AIG and others had followed some of these ideas, we might not find ourselves in the situation we find ourselves.

But, of course, you have already decided this would not be compatible with western law and principles.

Cargosquid

January 23, 2011 at 2:29 pm

Yep. Because once you let the sharia camel nose under the tent flap, you cannot keep out the rest of the camel. Once court decisions are based upon sharia, we have precedent and you know how much loved precedent is in this country.

Sharia banking and Sharia legal systems are not separate.

And we can tell that Sharia based banking is so good how? They have to put the oil money somewhere. If they want to isolate their finances, great. If the muslim countries wish to use sharia banking, fine. If you believe that basing our government decisions on sharia is a good thing, hey, that’s your thing. But whenever the some part of the government is even indirectly involved in a Judeo-Chirstian supported operation, cries hypocritically rain down about separation of church and state. Where are the cries now?

But instead of disputing that article, and bring out YOUR ideas that counter their argument, you decided to insult me. So, again….don’t care.

marinm

January 23, 2011 at 4:02 pm

Moon-howler :@marin,
Who sees MSNBC as too progressive? Progressives?
Anyone watching Morning Joe might worry that MCNBC is becoming too fair and balanced.
Even Rachel Maddow is extremely polite.

Sorry, I thought it was clear but to clarify — Comcast, the new owners of NBC, think that MSNBC is too progressive and will move it to the right to make it more fair and balanced.

🙂

Question, as I don’t know. Does islamic banking laws allow women to own property and get bank loans? Just wondering how progressive these rulings really are. 😉

Wolverine

January 23, 2011 at 6:28 pm

I think you are right, Cargo. In 1980, the Islamic Council of Europe published a work entitled “Muslim Communities in Non-Muslim States.” It is an open blueprint for the Islamic takeover of Europe. The first step is to separate the Muslim minority from the rest of society and place it totally under Sharia law — in effect, to create a Sharia legal system parallel to the secular legal system and totally apart from it. Once that is accomplished, you then proceed to an effort to become the majority and eventually to replace the secular state with an Islamic state under Sharia.

The Brits, in my opinion, made the mistake of letting that camel stick his nose under the tent flap, obviously thinking they could handle it while demonstrating a dedication to “diversity.” Now their High Court is having to deal with sharp conflicts between Sharia and the tenents of British Common Law, which apply to all residents of Britain regardless of religion. In fact, the involvement of the British High Court is in and of itself a violation of Sharia, since Sharia admits to no higher authority and certainly to no higher authority by non-believers. There is a old song called: “There Will Always be an England.” Maybe. But these days it is beginning to look like there are two Englands — this one here ( the one I remember) and that one over there (the one I do not recognize).

Moon-howler

January 23, 2011 at 7:20 pm

@marinm
Actually, I would find that offensive. As long as there are the Foxies, America needs a counter voice. Maddow and Matthews do a fine job. Morning Joe is already fair and balanced.

The righting of America is getting more and more offensive.

Moon-howler

January 23, 2011 at 8:24 pm

Wolverine, my Brit friends pretty much tell the same tale you do. They aren’t happy. In fact, they are thinking about immigrating once they no longer have the care of elderly parents. They are conservative Brit and admittedly somewhat xenophobic as a self description.

Emma

January 23, 2011 at 8:49 pm

Eleven more minutes, Lafayette and Juturna!

Moon-howler

January 23, 2011 at 9:49 pm

I also watch Big Love.

However, it got recorded because of the Jets and the Steelers. I hate that the Steelers go to the Superbowl…again. Go Green Bay!!!!

Lafayette

January 23, 2011 at 10:22 pm

Emma :Eleven more minutes, Lafayette and Juturna!

@Moon-howler
There were some classic quotes in there tonight. What was Margene on at the begining?

Morris Davis

January 23, 2011 at 10:56 pm

Jack LaLanne dead at age 96. My earliest memories include my grandmother watching his show on b&w tv. I think until his mid 80s he could have kicked my butt, and I’m no junior petite. http://us.mobile.reuters.com/article/idUSTRE70N0JQ20110124?ca=rdt

Starryflights

January 24, 2011 at 12:54 am

“Progressives are … communist revolutionaries. Revolutionary is what
you need to focus on tonight. …. they are dangerous. You’re going to
have to shoot them in the head.”

Glen terrorist Beck

http://mediamatters.org/mmtv/201101220005

Moon-howler

January 24, 2011 at 3:45 am

Thanks for bringing that to our attention, Starry. Beck has toned it down quite a bit. I guess he got warned enough times.

He has lots of minions though. He probably speaks in code to them now.

Starryflights

January 24, 2011 at 5:27 am

Beck is the leader of the teahadis as bin laden is leader of jihadis.

Open Thread………………………………………….Friday, January 21

206 Thoughts to “Open Thread………………………………………….Friday, January 21”

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