I can tell you, on many occasion I saw this very quiet peaceful protester on 234 throughout the past several years. All he did, was stand in the grass, next to his signs. I don’t recall it saying anything incendiary, but he was definitely against the Iraq and Afghanistan wars. He never shouted, he never waved his arms crazily,he just stood there, like a man on his own private mission to make his voice heard.
I was very surprised to read in the paper, the thuggish behavior of a young person in “uniform”. This “teenager” exited his van, kicked Mr. Hersch’s poster and then got back into his van.
He said that about 12:30 p.m. a green van with an advertisement on the side that read “1-800-Marines” drove up to the intersection and a teenaged passenger got out and kicked down one of his signs.
That’s when the act of civil disobedience or disorderly conduct came into play.
Hersch said he stepped out in front of the van to prevent the driver — who he said was in uniform — from driving away.
Does this “teenager” not understand the very foundation of America IS our ability to express our opinion without threats of violence or intimidation? His action, by getting out, and kicking the sign down, was meant as a form of intimidation, NOT a very “marine” like behavior. Maybe this kid missed the recent events in Egypt and other places in the middle east, where people fought, and died, to have their voices heard.
Mr. Hersch, believing this act was indeed wrong, forced a situation where the police would be called. But instead of having them mediate what happend upon arrival, from his perspective , he was the one being accused of wrong doing.
As he expected, people did call the police and a lot of them soon showed up.
Hersch said that at least 10 cruisers arrived, including state police, sheriff’s deputies and Prince William police.
According to Hersch, a Prince William police officer named L. Lewis took the lead and the outcome of the situation was not what he expected.
“I really thought that once the police were there they’d pull us both over to the side and say, ‘Alright guys, what happened?’” he said.
That’s not how things went.
Hersch said that police gave the teenager and the Marine his name, but wouldn’t give him their names.
In addition, Hersch said, the officer wouldn’t answer any of his questions.
It is clear to me, that this “teenager” provoked the entire event. The ACLU is intending to discern the facts and determine if Mr. Hersch’s right to freedeom of speech was infringed upon by the police.
The officer made Hersch remove the signs, which Hersch considered an infringement of his freedom of speech. He thought he was within the law in placing his signs 15 feet from the road.
“We thought we had permission … to place signs as long as we were in attendance,” he said. “We’ve never been challenged.”
Hersch said he would do the same again given the same circumstances.
Kent Willis of the ACLU of Virginia said he would have to to talk to Hersch to get details of what happened, but the organization is interested in freedom of speech issues.
wow, the all american clean as the driven snow aclu is interested in freedom of speech issues, sure right
This man has been here demonstrating for years. Apparently he is the heir of Hersh Farm where all the kids went when in elementary school.
It seems to me that the young thug who jumped out and kicked his sign was the one out of order. That is threatening. Too bad someone didn’t call his commanding officer. Back in the day, his head would have rolled.
I don’t want my govt. making neither jobs nor war so I have double the reason to be annoyed and kick down his annoying signs. I wouldn’t though because I’m not a hot-headed teenager.
If this went down as Mr. Hersch said, then his rights were infringed, IMHO. If I were to speculate, based on the details, I would guess that the the uniformed individual to be a recruiter, and the teen one of his “poolees” (someone enlisted or preparing to enlist, who has not yet attended bootcamp).
But, I try to give the responding officers the benefit of the doubt, and experience tells me that rarely is the one cited completely innocent. Still, if it was just him, and he was with his signs and was deliberately provoked, I would consider this a mitigating circumstance.
@Steve, how does one private citizen infringe upon the rights of another? It’s different if we talk about the police (as an agent of the government) infringing upon Mr. Hersch’s rights but how exactly did that happen — didn’t they give him his sign back? What exactly was said about ‘removing the signs?’ That’s open-ended.
I don’t see this as a ‘rights’ issue as much as I do a civil tort. If Mr. Hersch was assaulted he should file charges. But, he was also in the wrong by blocking traffic with his body (criminal offense IIRC).
I think the ACLU has provided a tepid response because the questions here are murky.
The man up there near K Mart has been there for years and has never been a problem. He doesn’t interact, wave or anything. He just walks or stands. He is very unobtrusive.
Mando, that isn’t one of his signs, I just pulled out out of a picture bank. In all the years he as been up there, I have never taken his picture. Sorry for the confusion.
What is the difference between Mr. Hersch and his signs and the folks outside the abortion clinic on Sudley Road? It seems the police may have been about as thuggish as the teenager, who may well have been encouraged by the driver of the van–an active duty Marine? It would seem that the teenager could possibly have been cited for simple asault, which doesn’t require actual touching (battery). But instead, the police chose to take sides–perhaps because of the Marine driver?
@ Mando–what do you want your government to do? In general governments are the largest employers in the country. Oh–I know, you want them to do nothing–right. Then why have government? Duh!
The nine most terrifying words in the English language: ‘I’m from the government and I’m here to help.’
@George, the abortion protestors are in the city and need a permit to demonstrate. Mr. Hersh demonstrated in the county and did not need a permit to demonstrate.
Steve,
I agree, your comment is very “well rounded” and I also await more details. But I have seen this man for the past several years, and he never seemed to bother anyone.
Disagreement does not mean disloyalty. I work with many who think if you criticize the war rationale you are a traitor. It saddens me to think intelligent people can’t fathom the idea of a loyal opposition. It scares me even more.
@Moon-howler
Hmmm–so the corner of Sudley Manor Drive and Sudley Road is in the county vice in the city? I note that PWC police showed up or at least that is what the article says. Where does the city end and the county begin?
Disgusted is correct–George Bush started the whole idea of “If you ain’t with us, you are against us” and that idea has stuck even though you rarely read anything in the papers about the war any more. I served with Marines long enough to believe the recuiter could have had a hand in the whole thing.
@George. Too funny. Nope, Sudley Manor and Sudley is county pure and proper. Unless something drastic has happened, demonstration permits are not needed in county.
Point of information. Does paragraph 4 of this thread constitute a rule change? Will the males of the species now be able to enter discussions freely on the female reproductive system? Having asked this question, I will now flee — against the possibility that a lightning bolt could come through my computer screen and singe off what is left of my hair.
did you need that fire extingisher Wolverine! 🙂
You are free to have an opinion, just don’t force it on my uterus!
Elena — You missed. But my neighbor is probably wondering about that big black spot on the bedroom wall of his townhouse.