Good bye summer.  Hello school next week.  Hello Democratic Convention.  I don’t know about you but I am getting “conventioned out.”

The Gulf Coast is getting tired of slow moving Hurricane Issac.   Issac brings a new dimension to the word “stalled.”

Kids, it’s time to get back on the “cheese” and head back to school.

155 Thoughts to “Open Thread……………………………………………….Friday, August 31”

  1. Starryflights

    @SlowpokeRodriguez
    Argue with the chair.

  2. SlowpokeRodriguez

    Starryflights :
    @SlowpokeRodriguez
    Argue with the chair.

    Translation, please.

    1. @pokie

      I saw Hiter-staches on a whole bunch of Obama posters all over the place. I sure didn’t have them printed up. In fact, I saw some pretty bad ones today on tv involving monkey faces too. it was earlier this afternoon.

      Partisans who live in glass houses shouldn’t throw bolders.

  3. SlowpokeRodriguez

    Moon-howler :
    @pokie
    I saw Hiter-staches on a whole bunch of Obama posters all over the place. I sure didn’t have them printed up. In fact, I saw some pretty bad ones today on tv involving monkey faces too. it was earlier this afternoon.
    Partisans who live in glass houses shouldn’t throw bolders.

    Lyndon LaRouche Supporters if I recall.

    1. @Pokie are those the post office people?

  4. SlowpokeRodriguez

    Moon-howler :
    @Pokie are those the post office people?

    Ding-Ding-Ding!!
    Winner-Winner-Chicken-Dinner!!!
    You can go to their website right now and see the Obama with Hitler mustache anytime you wish. When Bush was in, it was Bush with a Hitler mustache.
    Although they denounce everything about Larouche, when he did run as a political party, he was a democrat.

    1. Actually I meant to say DMV people. Now I don’t know who they are. I dont think the Democrats accepted Larouche as one of them.

  5. marinm

    Happy Labor Day to everyone!! Please take a few moments of your day off to speak to your fellow workers, friends, and family about the evils of union membership.

    Show SOLIDARITY with your non-union brothers and sisters and DENOUNCE a union anytime you can!

    1. The right to form unions is as American as apple pie. Scott Walker convinced me of that. Marin, you have the right to join or not join.

      I’ll bite. Why is joining a union “evil?”

  6. Lyssa

    I’m doing the exact opposite! Happy Labor Day – bring ’em back on…..A vote for either candidate is a step closer to the third industrial revolution and union resurgence.

  7. SlowpokeRodriguez

    Moon-howler :
    Actually I meant to say DMV people. Now I don’t know who they are. I dont think the Democrats accepted Larouche as one of them.

    I said, the Democrats denounce everything about Larouche.

  8. Marinm

    @Moon-howler

    They drive up the cost of goods and services to the rest of us.

    Are your content with the quality of AT&T or Verizon’s quality unionized labor force? When was the last time you thanked a union for the great customer service during your last flight?

    My heart warns to think that 94% of the public private (correction request by marinm) sector is non union. God Bless.

    1. I have no problem with Verizon or ATT.

      I just think workers have the right to unionize for better working conditions. I also think workers have the right to work without belonging to a union. Somwhere in the middle, let the chips fall where they may. Perhaps companies need to take a firmer stand in their negotiations if unions have gotten too powerful.

      Part of the problem is allowing closed shop. I can sure see why unions want to keep closed shop. If unions do their job, people should want to join.

  9. marinm

    Erg. Error above. I meant to say, private sector.

  10. I fixed it for you, marin.

  11. @Marinm

    Is it wrong to want better working conditions and to get the most you can get working your job?

    I don’t think that is evil. Too many companies would pay crap if they weren’t nudged into better conditions.

  12. Pat Herve

    marin – I suggest you read the history books on the Union Labor Movement – to see the working environment you currently enjoy that was earned and fought for by the Union’s. 5 day work week, 8 hours a day is not something the employers wanted, it was what the Union’s wanted. Look at third world countries where there are no Union’s (China), and see the working conditions.

    Many Union’s provide pensions, 401k and health benefits to members – this makes sense in a multi-employer industry like construction. If it were not for the Union, there would be no retirement savings for those people. From some of you past comments, I do not think you even know why a Union exists or what its purpose is.

  13. SlowpokeRodriguez

    Little story about my friends in the CWA (Communications Workers of America) at Verizon, AT&T, etc, etc. As a young puppy, I was a Novell Server Admin at BellSouth in Birmingham, AL. The CWA union guys would go into the wiring closets and pull a user’s connection out of the switch. The user would call our help desk, a contractor would go to the user, figure out what the problem was. If that contractor dared to push the user’s connection back into the switch, the union idiots would file a grievance, because by their contract, only they were allowed to establish the electrical path. Your much-lauded union guys would deliberately cost the company productivity to play their little grievance games. My dad worked at Caterpillar Tractor as a UAW guy. He could believe how the guys would lay around and do nothing, and if management complained, they’d (you guessed it) file a grievance.
    Don’t confuse the situation in the late 19th century/early 20th century (20th/21st if you’re Joe Biden) and the last 40 years when it comes to unions. People have, as always, abused the concept until it’s not about worker protection anymore.

    1. @pokie

      Sure there are abuse stories. And for every abuse story, there are positive stories. In non-union situations, very often the employee is the put-upon one, with no avenues of redress and almost no due process. You can be salesman of the month and get told to clean out your desk by close of business. Some people like a little more protection than that.

      I don’t think it is our precious unions as much as it is a right to form one and belong to one. I have never said that unions are perfect. I see problems with today’s unions. However, I don’t want to union bust.

  14. SlowpokeRodriguez

    Is there any sort of celebration planned at the DNC convention when the debt passes 16 trillion? You figure it’d be champagne corks flying!

    1. No more so than would be held at the rnc.

  15. SlowpokeRodriguez

    Moon-howler :
    @pokie
    Sure there are abuse stories. And for every abuse story, there are positive stories. In non-union situations, very often the employee is the put-upon one, with no avenues of redress and almost no due process. You can be salesman of the month and get told to clean out your desk by close of business. Some people like a little more protection than that.

    And all of the stories of how teachers act like total garbage and their union saves them. Here’s your problem, people are starting to get saturated with the negative stories, and not hearing any positive stories. But, don’t listen to me, sit back and watch the results for yourself!

    1. I can’t help it if people focus on total d-bags rather than the thousands of decent teachers who are out there educating America’s young people.

      If people don’t hear positive stories it is because they are A-holes and aren’t listening.

      Be speciffic about unions rather than condemning them all. Most unions I know make absolutely certain that teachers get due process. they aren’t protect from wrong-doing.

      I hear positive stories all the time. Maybe I just hang out in better bars than you do, pokie.

  16. SlowpokeRodriguez

    Just heard that Michael Clarke Duncan was engaged to be married to Omarosa when he passed away. Anyone else see the hand of God in this?

  17. @SlowpokeRodriguez
    Man….too soon…too soon.

    I liked him. RIP.

  18. Romney in Iowa: “President Obama, bless his heart, has tried to substitute government for free people, and it has not worked.”

    And THAT is how you use “bless his heart” with style.

  19. Obama was in New Orleans and stated, “When disasters like this happen we set aside whatever petty disagreements we have. Nobody’s a Democrat or Republican.”

    Yep.

    Well, except for that whole Bush bashing thing…..

    “I want to particularly thank FEMA and the state and local authorities, because sometimes in the past we haven’t seen the kind of coordination that is necessary in response to these kinds of disasters.”

    Bless his little amnesiac heart.

  20. That doesn’t even make sense. How is Romney any different than Obama in that regard.

  21. Jeff Bridges is on Morning Joe. He is working on Hungry Kids initiative.

    Hungry kids don’t learn.

  22. Romney didn’t try to take a holier than thou hypocritical position.
    The Democrats attacked Bush immediately for Katrina, including statements that he hated black people.

    Of course, Bush was prevented from using the Louisiana National Guard during those critical first 3 days by that incompetent Blanco. And the national damage control people had their supplies destroyed by the storm. And the damage was hugely worse. No, the FEMA reaction could have been improved. But the damages were much greater than anticipated. And I should HOPE that FEMA improved their record. Its called implementing lessons learned.

    Personally, I don’t think that Obama had to go to New Orleans or that it did anything to improve the situation. Same for Romney. Jindal could brief Romney anytime.

    1. I watched the entire convention in 2008 and I don’t recall Obama ever saying that Bush hated black people.

      As I don’t blame all Republicans for stupid statements made by some, I don’t blame all Democrats for stupid statements made by some.

      I am awaiting the short form of the platform that is to be approved tonight.

  23. A new game for those watching the convention. Print out your cards and have fun!

    http://www.tobytoons.com/td/cartoon/20120903/dnc-buzzword-bingo.html

  24. Bush: 5 trillion in debt. 8 years.

    Obama: 6 trillion in debt. 3 years 8 months.

    16 trillion in debt as of tomorrow.

    15.6 GDP. Smaller than the debt.

    Not good.

    Tell me again how re-electing incumbents, repeating the past and expecting a different outcome is NOT insanity?

  25. @Cargosquid
    I think a good calculus course might explain some of the debt.

    Just a hunch.

  26. SlowpokeRodriguez

    Moon-howler :
    Hungry kids don’t learn.

    That’s a little harsh! What is it you want them to learn! 🙂

    1. Kids that always come to school hungry often have achievement problems. They don’t learn as well if their stomachs are growing.

  27. @Moon-howler
    I didn’t say that Obama said that. I said that Bush was attacked and it was said. There were some on the Democrat side that said that.

    1. Many people said that, including Republicans. I think it was the “good job, Brownie” that made it a bi-partisan effort.

      There are also a lot of people who had something to say who probably wouldn’t describe themselves as either. Mistakes were made. In some cases, the perception was the reality. Mother Nature ruled and human beings, including political parties got the blame.

      How about the people who blamed the democratic major, governor and senator for the screw ups. Are you going to let that slide?

      2005 was 7 years ago. Let’s not make statements that make it seem like it has anything to do with people in power today, at least nationally.

  28. @Moon-howler
    Probably. Might explain it. Wouldn’t help it.

    You know what would REALLY help the debt?

    Teach basic arithmetic and finance to Congress.

  29. @Cargosquid

    He hurt nothing going to NO. He sure did have to go once Romney raced down there. Romney didn’t need to go. What is he going to do about any of it?

    I am surprised it would be the POTUS you think needed to stay home rather than the candidate with no power to do anything.

  30. From Corey Steart:

    In America, the average worker spends about 1787 hours a year at their job:

    Spain: 1692 Hours

    Britain: 1625 Hours

    France: 1475 Hours

    Germany: 1411 Hours

    Whoever was acting like the Germans were the industrious ones sure needs to set Corey straight.

  31. @Moon-howler
    How about the people who blamed the democratic major, governor and senator for the screw ups. Are you going to let that slide?
    Heck no….I was one of them. Because I watched the whole disaster unfold.

    Blanco was incompetent and partisan. And greedy.
    Nagin was…. in over his head..yep, had to say it that way….and incompetent.
    The senator? That one I don’t know about. Which one?
    The citizens of New Orleans….the real problem. They keep reelecting crooked politicians that rip them off….its a tradition. They did not prepare. They did not evacuate on their own. They kept waiting for others to tell them what to do. Then they looted instead of helping each other, in many cases.
    The media was worse than useless and made matters worse.

    1. Every situation is different.

      Obama did right by showing up there. Historically every president has gotten bitten in the butt by hurricanes.

  32. @Moon-howler
    Both of them played politics.

    As politics, Romney did well….forcing an error on Obama…in game terms.

    As reality, neither one needed to go there and get in the way. I applaud Obama for originally staying away. Of course, that’s hypocritical that the Democrats savaged Bush for not immediately flying there and ignored the same with Obama….but that’s normal for politics. Obama should have responded to Romney, saying that he didn’t want to interfere with the efforts for a “photo op” which would have made Romney look bad.

  33. middleman

    @Cargosquid Cargo, you’re leaving out the fact that the Republicans left the economy in free fall, bleeding millions of jobs a month and with credit frozen. It takes a few bucks to fix all that, and some time for the economy to regain the ability to pay it all back.

    Actually, the Republicans have played out a pretty good strategy- tank the economy after enriching their masters, run a presidential campaign designed to lose (Palin-really?), sticking the Democrats with picking up the pieces and then take over 4 years later after the Dem’s get things moving in the right direction, while blaming them for a “weak” recovery. Then as soon as the Repub’s take over in 2013, they can start a war with Iran for their military-industrial complex masters and get back to their real goals- denying civil rights to gays and controlling women’s bodies and making sure all the children get their religious indoctrination…

    1. They won’t take over the economy in 2012. It will be up to us to see that doesn’t happen. @Middleman

  34. SlowpokeRodriguez

    85% of the entire entertainment industry is liberal, the upshot? Better entertainment at the DNC convention!

    1. Don’t they have a DJ this go-round?

  35. No one trots out “others” like the Democrats. What great speeches tonight.

    I am looking forward to hearing the first lady. She has a real success story and was not to the manor born. The Robinsons sacrificed and prioritized.

    Michele’s brother is head basketball coach at Oregon State.

  36. @Cargosquid

    Katrina was in 2005. 7 years ago. Cargo, you make it seem like Katrina was yesterday and that Obama was holding Bush’s feet to the fire.

    I am not sure how it was hypocritcal to criticize to criticize Bush. To call someone hypocritical is to imply comparison. What are we comparing?

  37. I am comparing the way Bush was treated for NOT landing in NOLA during the height of the disaster relief with the way Obama is being treated. Obama’s lack of visit was a non-story until Romney went. Bush was castigated and some stated that he didn’t care if black people were dying.

  38. @middleman
    Man! You really have drunk deep of the kool-aid.

    Where did I leave any of that out? I mean, since I didn’t talk about that in this thread. I did mention that both Bush and Obama spent wildly.

    But since you brought it up…..

    You say that the GOP tanked the economy. How so? Bush and co wanted to increase regulations on the housing/financial industry and was shot down by the DEMOCRATS. Fannie/Freddie were fine…said Barney Frank. Both sides are responsible for the removal of and the refusal to re-instate Glass-Stegall. And the GOP is enriching their masters…HAHAHAHA! So, apparently, you’re blind to the crony capitalism going on in this administration. Ok, then.

    And playing to lose…Palin? Yep. I love it when a liberal Democrat tries to tell me what the GOP was doing. Palin was McCain’s desperate attempt to shore up the base, the same base that really, REALLY disliked him. Palin was the only reason he got ANY votes from the base.
    The GOP can blame Obama for a “weak recovery” NOW. Because there isn’t a recovery. If, and its a big IF, the GOP can turn it around, it will be because they reverse Obama’s policies of over taxation, over regulation, and crony capitalism.

    And then there’s this:
    “Then as soon as the Repub’s take over in 2013, they can start a war with Iran for their military-industrial complex masters and get back to their real goals- denying civil rights to gays and controlling women’s bodies and making sure all the children get their religious indoctrination…”

    Really? REALLY? And you were doing so well during earlier arguments. And it turns out that you’re just another OCCUPY-lite liberal, demonizing half of America. You’re no longer worth the effort to argue with. And ask Moon. I’ll argue with almost everybody.

  39. SlowpokeRodriguez

    Cargosquid :
    THIS is just cool! I want two!
    http://biolitestove.com/campstove/camp-overview/features/

    That may have to go in the Zombie Prep kit!

  40. Second Alamo

    Talk about your conspiracy theories, “run a presidential campaign designed to lose” … Really? Tin foil hats all around!

  41. middleman

    @Cargosquid Wow- I really hit a nerve there, didn’t I, Cargo? Must have been the “masters” wording!

    Your post I was referring to where you left some facts out was:

    “Bush: 5 trillion in debt. 8 years.
    Obama: 6 trillion in debt. 3 years 8 months.
    16 trillion in debt as of tomorrow.
    15.6 GDP. Smaller than the debt.
    Not good.”

    That’s where the context of the crashed economy comes in. I think you’ll find that economists have decided that the ONGOING costs of the two unfunded Bush wars, the unfunded prescription drug payments, the extreme growth of the military and the duplicative Homeland Security under Bush are all major contributors to ONGOING debt. There’s a reason why Bush was nowhere near the Repub. Convention last week. And where was Palin? Doing more reality TV, no doubt.

    There isn’t a recovery? Who’s on Kool-aid now? Please name one indicator that’s not on the upswing. Unemployment isn’t coming down as fast as we’d like, but our economy has been shedding blue collar jobs for 40 years, and those jobs aren’t coming back, which exacerbates the problem.

    Please give us some examples of OBAMA initiating new taxes or new regulations that interfere with the economy. This is pure unsubstantiated Republican campaign dogma. In fact, Obama has instituted a number of tax cuts.

    The GOP will turn the economy around? Again with the Kool-aid! Let’s see- Reagan: increased deficit. Bush I: increased deficit. Bush II: you guessed it-increased deficit. Maybe there’s a reason the Repub’s are using Bill Clinton in their ad’s- he created the best economy in decades. He’s a Democrat in case you didn’t know, and he WILL be at the Democratic Convention.

    You seem to take the most offense at my last paragraph, but it’s clear what the priorities are whether you like it or not. You need look no farther than Virginia, where McDonnell (who WAS at the Repub. convention, quite prominently) and Cuccinelli campaigned on jobs, jobs, jobs, and got right to work on social issues as soon as elected. Does vaginal ultrasound ring a bell? How about Cuccinelli’s legal attacks on Virginia institutions in the name of the anti-gay and anti-environment causes (since shot down by adult judges as mostly frivolous). Meanwhile, we’re begging for infrastructure maintenance and upgrades, school class sizes are increasing, funding for colleges is at an all time low, and on and on. McDonnell is claiming a surplus while the state pension fund is hundreds of millions in the red. And the only reason that the state is doing as well as it is is because of federal spending in NoVa!

    I’m not surprised that you don’t want to “argue” anymore. I’m not demonizing anyone except the clueless politicians and those who blindly follow them, and that’s considerably less than half the American population, thank God.

  42. Steve Randolph

    Golden Moments-

    Let’s Go Nats!! They have the best record in MLB and have moved
    to 7 1/2 games over second place Atlanta in the NL East.
    How sweet it is!

    As a plus, for those of us who “adopted” the O’s while we had no team,
    Baltimore last night moved into a tie with the Yanks in the AL East.
    Amazing, in part, because they have scored fewer total runs this
    season than their opponets. (Washington, on the other hand, has
    the largest plus difference of runs vs. opponet runs than any other team
    in baseball).

    Almost over-heated the remote going from the games to the convention
    and back. A great night. Plenty of home runs.

  43. Steve Randolph

    “Governments can err, Presidents do make mistakes, but
    the immortal Dante tells us that divine justice weighs the sins
    of the cold-blooded and the sins of the warm-hearted on
    different scales.

    Better the occasional faults of a Government that lives in a spirit
    of charity than the consistent omissions of a Government frozen
    in the ice of its own indifference.

    To some generations much is given. Of other generations much is
    expected. This generation of Americans has a rendezvous with destiny.”

    FDR (Convention acceptance speech, 1936)

  44. @middleman

    Can’t resist.

    From Instapundit and http://news.investors.com/ibd-editorials/090412-624523-were-not-better-off-under-obama.htm

    FOUR YEARS AGO IS LOOKING PRETTY GOOD: Investor’s Business Daily: Better Off? Let’s Count the Ways We’re Not.

    By most measures the country isn’t making slow progress; it’s falling further behind. Some examples:

    • Median incomes: These have fallen 7.3% since Obama took office, which translates into an average of $4,000. Since the so-called recovery started, median incomes continued to fall, dropping $2,544, or 4.8%.

    • Long-term unemployed: More than three years into Obama’s recovery, 811,000 more still fall into this category than when the recession ended.

    • Poverty: The poverty rate climbed to 15.1% in 2010, up from 14.3% in 2009, and economists think it may have hit 15.7% last year, highest since the 1960s.

    • Food stamps: There are 11.8 million more people on food stamps since Obama’s recovery started.

    • Disability: More than 1 million workers have been added to Social Security’s disability program in the last three years.

    • Gas prices: A gallon of gas cost $1.89 when Obama was sworn in. By June 2009, the price was $2.70. Today, it’s $3.84.

    • Misery Index: When Obama took office, the combination of unemployment and inflation stood at 7.83. Today it’s 9.71.

    • Union membership: Even unions are worse off under Obama, with membership dropping half a million between 2009 and 2011.

    • Debt: Everyone is far worse off if you just look at the national debt. It has climbed more than $5 trillion under Obama, crossing $16 trillion for the first time on Tuesday and driving the U.S. credit rating down.

    Ironically, the only people better off under Obama are corporate chieftains, who’ve seen corporate profits climb more than 50% under Obama’s “recovery,” and investors, who’ve benefited from a near-doubling in the Dow industrials from its March 2009 lows.

    Given this record, we can only hope Obama doesn’t have the chance to get a “complete” on his plans.

    Indeed. Oh, what the hell, let’s run that graphic again:

    http://pjmedia.com/instapundit/wp-content/uploads/2012/08/OBAMAUNEMPLOYMENTFAILCHART.jpg

    Also, it wasn’t the “masters” comment, it was the implication of starting a war.

    But, hey! Let’s take your statement at face value. AGAIN, you have a problem with reading comprehension and projection.

    Nowhere did I NOT blame Bush on spending. YOU politicized the simple statements illustrating the spending problem. Nowhere did I say that the GOP WILL turn the economy around. I said, “If and its a big IF.”

    Implementing new taxes: ACR. EPA closing coal plants. Energy prices rising.

    What has Obama done to stop the spending…since what Bush did was so bad? Or are you supporting Bush’s policies since they supported the poor…ie the Drug plan?

    And if the wars were unfunded……I seem to remember that a whole lot of Democrats voting for it….where were they? Funny how Bush could live with a 450 billion dollar deficit in 2008, at the HEIGHT of the wars, but we need 1.2 trillion. Bush’s deficits are horrible but Obama’s ……(crickets)

    So, Middleman…when are you going to, at least, acknowledge that Obama and the Democrats are responsible for their mess…if only their part. Or is it always going to be Bush’s fault. If Obama is re-elected, shall we STILL hear that its all Bush’s fault? Or is he going to be honest and blame the previous administration.

    If you can’t honestly admit that the Democrats are also at fault, there is no point in discussing things with you.

    And that is on the national level.

    If you want to argue about Virginia…. I actually agree on McDonnell. Infrastructure needs works. The “surplus” isn’t. The ultrasound bill was stupid move of desperation to advance the pro-life side of countering pro-choice tactics of impersonalizing (I made up the word.) abortion, hoping that more information would prevent more abortions.

    Cuccinlli’s “attacks”…whole ‘nother subject. All were based upon good ideas. Why is it partisan only when a conservative uses the law, but not so much when a liberal uses the law? He was doing his job. And applying the law AS WRITTEN. If those colleges want to do certain things….then get the law changed.

    1. Your “facts” are from a biased source. All it took was reading the first paragraph for me to know the feelings of the author.

      Lets talk about facts and figures that everyone agrees on.

      Realistically, under Bush, there was only 1 D Congress and then the Senate was tight as a drum. Your taunts are falling on deaf ears over here.

  45. Btw…nothing prevented Congress during the Democrat majority from repealing anything that they felt was too expensive or bad.

    Drug plan…they kept it.
    DHS: they like it. They support it.
    War: Still there. AND we attacked Libya, a country that DID NOT attack anyone else.

    They were too busy screwing with some pie in the sky medical “reform” and putting the politicians that caused the financial meltdown in charge of fixing it. Fannie/Freddie…still losing money..no reforms.

    1. No one hated the drug plan. Most of us felt that Canadian drugs should have been involved and that the drug companies should have been willing to contribute more. the drug plan is just an example of big spending that could have been handled better.

      DHS- I haven’t heard anyone bitching majorly about it.

      War- Thats an entire different topic now. I think Iraq is over, now isn’t it? You can’t just dump something midstream anyway.

      Libya? We helped out NATO. We didn’t go to war alone. They were clobbering their own people. You want those other countries to help us out? Give a little get a little. Name me one American who was killed. You can’t.

      I actually resent what you are saying about Chris Dodd. He certainly didn’t cause the meltdown nor did Barney Frank.

  46. SlowpokeRodriguez

    Who’s ready for “Sitting Bull” Warren tonight! Think she’ll do a rain dance?

    1. I have all the respect in the world for Elizabeth Warren. She doesn’t make up the course catalogs. Indian “blood” isn’t the easiest to prove. If that’s the only thing you have to pick at her about, she must be a pretty good candidate.

      What shall your Indian Name be, pokie? 2 dogs? Surely you have heard the old joke?

  47. 7.6 earthquake hits Costa Rica. Lots of Amerians live in Costa Rica–rich ones.

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