In memory of 4 fallen heroes

Sadly we mourn the loss of Chris Stevens, Sean Smith, Glen Doherty and Tyrone Woods who were killed attempting to defend the consulate in Libya.  RIP, Americans.

The White House has stated that the attack on the embassy was terrorism.

 

This is a regular open  thread, just dedicated to the Americans.

126 Thoughts to “Open Thread…………………………………………….Saturday, September 15”

  1. Here’s a little something that’s completely different. Seen at some science fiction convention:

    http://imgur.com/a/GiYDp

    Burt and Ernie – the later years.

    1. We should all be so lucky. 🙄

  2. I just read the blurb for this thread.

    RIP. God speed.

  3. Earlier this afternoon, a Wisconsin Judge overturned ACT 10, which took away collective bargaining rights for public workers. The law was ruled unconstitutional and is considered null and void,

    now…how come it isn’t unconstitutional for Virginians (or any other group of public employees) to not be allowed to have collective bargaining?

  4. @Moon-howler
    I predict that HIS ruling will be overturned.

  5. Emma

    Hooray for the Osbourn Eagles, finally beating Hylton 23-13 yesterday!

    1. I agree. I heard that they owned the night!!!!

  6. @Cargosquid

    Maybe it will go to the Supremes. I don’t think Walker will prevail. Not in the long run.

  7. marinm

    @Emma

    You are soooooo no longer my friend. 😉

  8. Steve Randolph

    OHS! Go Eagles!
    They upset a really good Hylton team.

  9. Local Fox 5 just cut the Boston/maryland game off, 4th quarter, close game, third down, and put on some baseball pre game stuff. This was like at 339.

    They are irresponsible and got a very nasty phone call from this house. The amount of time it took to find the phone number made the anger even worse.

  10. Steve Randolph

    “If the peoples of the Middle East continue on their
    present path, the suicide bomber may become a metaphor
    for the whole region and there will be no escape from a
    downward spiral of hate and spite, rage and self-pity,
    proverty and oppression.”

    “What Went Wrong?” by Bernard Lewis (2001)

    This book, published prior to 9-11, is a study of Arab history
    and its long fall from a great civilization to what it is today.

  11. @Steve,

    What main reasons does Bernard Lewis state caused the decline?

    Just shooting from the hip, I would say that wealth is in the hands of too few and there is a huge under belly of poverty. I think there is a lot of misdirected anger.

    Its easier to blame us than those who are oppressing. Not saying we are totally innocent. We have propped up a fair share of oppressors, don’t get me wrong….

  12. Cargo, I have listened to Jay Carney. I would have to know what day he said that before resolving to execute him.

    I think what he is saying is that they don’t have enough information to say it is terrorism, 9/11 or anything else other than the film.

    He didn’t say it very well though.

  13. Steve Randolph

    – Good week for Bashar al-Assasd. Even the Foxies are having
    second thoughts about helping another “Arab Spring” country
    gain “freedom”. The suffering Syrians have their fellow Arabs
    in Libya and Egypt to thank

    – The Keystone Pipeline needs a green line. Hold the
    builders to a very high standard but build it.
    Regulate it, watch it like a hawk and if the owners go BP
    on us, stuff any leaks with their heads — but build it — now.
    Depending on the Mideast for a vital necessity has become
    a fool’s game.

  14. Steve Randolph

    M-H, one reason Lewis gives is the second class status of women.
    Lack of education for females cripples half of a society – and the
    “damage” is passed on to children. That might be OK in a primitive
    farming/herding culture, but not in the modern world.

  15. Morris Davis

    Rick Santorum: “We will never have the media on our side, ever, in this country. We will never have the elite, smart people on our side.” I always considered Fox News to be part of the media and the Koch brothers and Mitt Romney to be among the most elite of the elite in this country, and they all seem to be pretty solidly on the same side as Santorum. On the other hand, he’s right about smart people.

    http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2012/09/15/santorum-smart-people-will-never-be-on-our-side/?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+TheRawStory+%28The+Raw+Story%29

  16. George s. Harris

    @Steve Randolph
    Steve–how can the Keystone pipeline ever be “green? They are destroying thousands, if not millions, of acres of ptistine forest to get to the tar sands and it takes as much energy to extract the sands and the oil from the sands as will be produced by the oil. Some calculate it will be a negative deal; more to produce it than will be gained from it. The tar sands are extremely dirty as is the oil. Why not work on renewable energy to include getting away from ethanol enriched gasoline, which drives up the price of food. Then we might talk about “green.”

  17. marinm

    @George s. Harris

    I don’t mind alternative energy streams (I do agree with you that ethanol enriched gasoline is dead and just kills food prices) as long as the govt isn’t involved.

  18. George s. Harris

    @marinm
    The government does have to be involved because as it stands now, those controlling the fossil based fuel industry don’t give a damn, regardless of what you see them say about all they are dloing to advance rebewable fuels. Perhaps the best example of this is Brazil At the time they thought they had noi oil reserves and were being strangled by the prioce of oil, the government stepped in and they have moved to an ethanol based system. Of course. they cut down a lot of rain forest to grow sugarcane but I think they have that under control. Government is the provider of the “seed corn” that fuels invention.

  19. @Morris Davis

    I think Santorum’s wife used to be smart before she got hooked up with him.

  20. @marin, your anti government stance is really qualifying you for the tin foil hat club.

    The only people I have ever met who want to avoid the government at much are people who are hiding something.

  21. marinm

    @George s. Harris

    So the example you use is how government wrecks the environment but its OK because its the government and now they have it ‘under control’.

    Govt should not supply ‘seed corn’. If a market exists people will figure out ways to make money. Let the market assume that risk so they can profit.

    “The only people I have ever met who want to avoid the government at much are people who are hiding something.”

    I guess you have no issue if an agent of the government performs a full search of you and property because of a ‘broken taillight’. You have nothing to hide, right?

    We don’t really *need* a 1st, 4th, and 5th Amendment right? It’ll make law enforcement (the Governments) job easier of “finding the bad guys” if we just submit to searches and ask the government to pre-approve books, newspapers and such for us.. Right?

    I think you ought to visit your local librarian and maybe get a civics lesson from someone like this.

    http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/25751801/ns/us_news-security/t/girls-case-had-library-cops-privacy-standoff/#.UFXLuVFXL0c

  22. Most of us don’t consider food for thought a full course meal.

    Marin, suppose for a minute there were no restrictions on the oil drillers, the coal miners, the railroad owners. (in each case I mean the owners). Have you any idea the hatchet job we would be left with?

    People want to make a profit. Do you seriously think those tycoons go out and make sure they aren’t harming the environment? bwaaaahahahahahahahahahaha

    How do governments get involved? Usually citizens petition them to “do something.”

    Again, no simple solutions for complicated problems. I like balance.

  23. If I do get stopped for a tail light (and I have) I didn’t go all paranoid mainly because I wasn’t hiding anything. Why must everything always be all or nothing. Who suggested throwing out amendments? No one I have heard. That’s why you sound like you need to put on your tin foil hat.

    Are there abuses of govternment? Of course. Industial abuses? yes. Individual abuses? yes. Probably the best example of that on a small scale is the 9500 Liberty property over in the City.

    Its small enough to be able to see the impact of all the players: the individual, the government and the industry in the form of the merchants of the area.

  24. Steve Randolph

    The 11th Annual Latino Festival at the Harris Pavilion
    in Old Town Manassas drew a large crowd today. There
    was great music, food and dancing along with numerous vendors.
    A wonderful event. Gov. Allen and State Senator Colgan were there.

    Then, walking back to my car, though, I saw a new Fernandez
    hate sign at Liberty and PW St. that begins with “Manassas City
    Stop Your Racism!” and goes down hill from there.

    Sad.

    1. Funniest thing his name should crop up.

      I wish I had dropped by. I could at least confront Senator Colgan over the loss of clinics in Virginia. Allen would support the efforts I am sure but he is innocent…this time.

      Did you all ever get the money for hosting the Romney event? Who do you submit the bills to now?

      I figure we get to do it all over again this Friday.

    2. I don’t suppose Guardicio has ever considered that he brings out racism in people where none existed before they dealt with him?

  25. marinm

    While this MAY go in the Mitt thread I think it may be more appropriate here.

    Socialism: You have 2 cows and you give one to your neighbor.

    Communism: You have 2 cows; the Government takes both and gives you some milk.

    Fascism: You have 2 cows; the Government takes both and sells you some milk.

    Nazism: You have 2 cows; the Government takes both and shoots you.

    Bureaucratism: You have 2 cows; the Government takes both, shoots one, milks the other and throws the milk away..

    Traditional Capitalism: You have 2 cows. You sell one and buy a bull. You herd multiplies, and the economy grows. You sell them and retire on the income.

    An American Corporation: You have 2 cows. You sell one, and force the other to produce the milk of four cows. Later, you hire a consultant to analyse why the cow dropped dead.

    A French Corporation: You have 2 cows. You go on strike because you want three cows.

    Japanese Corporation: You have 2 cows. You redesign them so they are one-tenth the size of an ordinary cow and produce twenty times the milk. You then create a clever cow cartoon image called Cowkimon and market them Worldwide.

    An Italian Corporation: You have 2 cows, but you don’t know where they are. You break for lunch.

    A Swiss Corporation: You have 5000 cows. None of which belong to you. You charge others for storing them.

    Chinese Corporation: You have 2 cows. You have 300 people milking them. You claim full employment, high bovine productivity, and arrest the newsman who reported the numbers.

    An Iraqi Corporation: Everyone thinks you have lots of cows. You tell them that you have none. No one believes you and they bomb your ass. You still have no cows, but at least now you are part of a Democracy…….

    Counter Culture: ‘Wow, dig it, like there’s these 2 cows, man, grazing in the hemp field. You gotta have some of this milk!’

    Surrealism: You have two giraffes. The government requires you to take harmonica lessons.

    Fatalist: You have 2 doomed cows…

    A West-Country Corporation: You have 2 cows. That one on the left is kinda cute.

    A Brazilian Corporation: You have 2 cows. You pay taxes for 6 cows. You have to sell one cow in order to pay the taxes. Your remaining cow gets sick and dies while waiting for availability in the public vet hospital.

    An Irish Corporation: You have a million cows because they’re fucking everywhere.

    Tumblr: You have 2 cows. You ship them together and make GIF posts screaming about how much you love your cows, but they should stop existing because they are so perfect.

    Facebook: You have 1 cow. You write about what the cow does everyday and then bitch about it because you wish it were prettier and skinnier. And you make awful grammar mistakes all along.

    1. I wish life were this simple.

  26. Lyssa

    For the simple, it is! It’s a quiet life we should seek, not a simple one.

  27. I have moved the middle east thread up up so it isn’t so far down the page.

    Feel free to continue the discussion there.

  28. @Steve Randolph
    Steve,

    Here’s an interesting perspective.
    http://englishrussia.com/2011/07/21/the-afghanistan-of-the-50s-60s/

    Christianity had the Reformation and other reforms…..and the West keeps hoping that the Muslim world will have something similar.

    I think that they did….and went the other way.

  29. Steve Randolph

    Drove by 9500 Liberty this morning and the Fernandez hate rant
    banner was gone. Thank goodness.

    1. He really doesn’t get it that he isn’t the movie star he thought he was.

      @Steve R

  30. Morris Davis

    Happy Constitution Day to everyone. It was 225 years ago today that the Founding Fathers signed the Constitution. Pasted below is a link to a 10 question quiz on the Constitution (I missed 1). I saw an article today that said 62% of the American public can’t name the 3 branches of the federal government and only 6% can name 4 rights guaranteed by the First Amendment. Lots of people like to talk about the Constitution, perhaps they should stop and read it and a little of the history surrounding it.

    http://blog.constitutioncenter.org/2012/09/pop-quiz-10-basic-constitution-questions/

    1. I got a 90%. I missed the first signer.

  31. Marinm

    @Morris Davis

    Sounds like another win for our public education system.

  32. Morris Davis

    @Moon-howler

    That’s the same one I missed.

  33. Lyssa

    I got 100. Sticking my tongue out 🙂

    1. I didnt remember who signed first. I had the other Virginian.

  34. Lyssa

    News flash check your mail

    1. Thanks Lyssa.

      Is that where McCain had his rally? Does anyone remember? I wonder why Obama didn’t use the Fair Grounds again.

  35. Lyssa

    McCain was at the plaza at McCoart.

  36. Morris Davis

    @Cargosquid

    Me too. I thought it was TJ.

  37. Lyssa

    Wasn’t George the boss?!

  38. Starryflights

    Breaking news

    Posted at 05:08 PM ET, 09/17/2012
    Romney: I’ll never convince Obama voters to take responsibility for their lives

    By Greg Sargent

    The Huffington Post and Mother Jones both post audio of what may be a blockbuster moment: Mitt Romney telling a private fundraiser that 47 percent of the American people — the voters who can be counted on to vote for Obama — are “dependent on government,” “believe that they are victims,” and think government “has a responsibility to care for them.”

    “I’ll never convince them they should take personal responsibility and care for their lives,” Romney says. Mother Jones’ video is here.

    The Romney press office repeatedly refused to comment on the video. Here’s a transcript:

    “There are 47 percent of the people who will vote for the president no matter what. All right, there are 47 percent who are with him, who are dependent upon government, who believe that they are victims, who believe that government has a responsibility to care for them, who believe that they are entitled to health care, to food, to housing, to you-name-it. That that’s an entitlement. And the government should give it to them. And they will vote for this president no matter what…

    “Our message of low taxes doesn’t connect…so my job is is not to worry about those people. I’ll never convince them that they should take personal responsibility and care for their lives. What I have to do is convince the five to 10 percent in the center that are independents, that are thoughtful….”

  39. Starryflights

    Never in my lifetime have I heard a presidential candidate hold nearly half the American electorate in such contempt.

  40. Apple stock hit $700 a share in after hours trading tonight. wowowowowowowowowwow

  41. @Starryflights
    So…you missed that whole “bitter clingers” thing, didn’t you….

    @Moon-howler
    Sooo…you’re buying the beer, right?

  42. Censored bybvbl

    Sideshow Bob and the American Tradition Institute just lost the first round in their fight over Michael Mann’s emails.

    Sheridan ruled that Mann’s correspondence while a professor at U.Va. qualified as public records, but they were exempt from disclosure under one particular exclusion listed in the Freedom of Information law: “Data, records or information of a proprietary nature produced or collected by or for faculty or staff of public institutions of higher education…in the conduct of or as a result of study or research on medical, scientific, technical or scholarly issues…where such data, records or information has not been publicly released, published, copyrighted or patented.”

    http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/the-state-of-nova/post/uva-wins-key-ruling-in-prince-william-global-warming-foia-case-involving-michael-mann/2012/09/18/6c422d98-0133-11e2-b257-e1c2b3548a4a_blog.html?hpid=z6

  43. If this is true, we should be seeing evidence of it in the papers soon. If this actually happens…what do you think?

    http://www.redstate.com/2012/09/18/obama-negotiating-release-of-omar-abdel-rahman/

    1. I was never offended by that. I don’t he was speaking down about those people. He was almost justifying why they were the way they were.

      I guess I dont think it is too awful to be bound to guns and god thought. I am not but I know lots of people who are.

  44. No one should ever think about suggesting that we go to war with anyone without viewing PBS American Experience Death and the Civil War.

    Fact: There were about 35 million Americans. over 700,000 killed, more than all other wars combined.

    Proportionally, it would be like we went to war and there were 7,000,000 deaths.

    There was no means to identify bodies or notify families until the Civil War. There were no National Cemeteries.

  45. I don’t care who you are…this is funny.

    Ok, MAYBE if you’re part of the Westboro bunch…it’s not funny, but other than that

    http://www.duffelblog.com/2012/09/fred-phelps-dies-westboro-baptist-church-plans-to-protest-funeral/

    Duffelblog is awesome.

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