If the deal wasn’t already sealed, here it goes.
From MotherJones.com:
During a private fundraiser earlier this year, Republican presidential candidate Mitt Romney told a small group of wealthy contributors what he truly thinks of all the voters who support President Barack Obama. He dismissed these Americans as freeloaders who pay no taxes, who don’t assume responsibility for their lives, and who think government should take care of them. Fielding a question from a donor about how he could triumph in November, Romney replied:
There are 47 percent of the people who will vote for the president no matter what. All right, there are 47 percent who are with him, who are dependent upon government, who believe that they are victims, who believe the government has a responsibility to care for them, who believe that they are entitled to health care, to food, to housing, to you-name-it. That that’s an entitlement. And the government should give it to them. And they will vote for this president no matter what…These are people who pay no income tax.
Romney went on: “[M]y job is is not to worry about those people. I’ll never convince them they should take personal responsibility and care for their lives.”
Details as to the whereabouts of this meeting have been kept sketchy to protect the informant. Obviously Romney has disdain for those not of his class. Did it ever occur to him that some of those who don’t pay taxes have deductions that clear them to zero? I particularly like how he emphasized the word ENTITLEMENT.
It’s one thing to think that I am a lay about and freeloader behind my back. Its another thing to say it outloud. In fact, I would be willing to bet I’ve worked harder in my life than he has.
So if you vote for Obama you don’t have to pay taxes? Maybe he was with the Koch Bros. I read Daddy Koch was in business with Stalin. Then he decided he didn’t like him. George Soros worked with the Nazi’s. This is absolutely crazy. We deserve better.
I believed that, too, until Obama was elected with zero experience and a total clown as VP (the only man on Earth who makes Palin look brilliant). Then I realized, as a nation, we get what we deserve, government-wise.
I’ve said that many times myself but decided that was far too negative. Maybe the right thing to say that considering our history we’ve earned better and start expecting better. If they could both lose I’d be delighted.
I think greed and talk radio are killing us. Anger, entitlement and getting even….I absolutely agree that we medicalized and excused away personal responsibility – but not in the same context as Gov Romney mentions above.
I was waiting for this video to come up.
I hate to say it but I give Romney points for the video. If only this were more of the candidate that is running than the Democrat he presents himself to be — he might win.
But alas he’s still way to the left and Obama will take it in a landslide.
Yes Slow, we get the government we deserve.
Soros never “collaborated” with Nazi’s. I would suggest putting yourself in deep in Nazi terroritory, as young teenage Jew, and then judge someone else who was there trying to simply survive.
There are WAY too many survivors that are “blamed” for living through the horror. I would suggest reading Levi Primo’s account of survival and then wonder what you would have done to simply stay alive.
When someone steps on his you know what so publically, I simply can’t follow the better angels and not show it.
I don’t know about you all but I was rather offended by what Romney said.
I expect that family would make me come to the kitchen door anyway though so I am not surprised.
Marinm,
Do you know anyone on welfare? Does anyone on this blog know anyone on welfare? I do, and they aren’t the scum of the earth that Romney would have us believe. Furthermore, given the struggling economy for those NOT employed as defense contractors or living off the government military “dole”, there are many fellow citizens who have simply given up, having lost so much, like their homes etc.
Hey, here’s a thought …..”there but for the grace of G-d go I”
Actually, another cool story is that of Michel Thomas, the polyglot. Used his ability to speak German to survive. Not quite the same, but his is an amazing story.
can you post a link Slow, I’m having trouble finding one 🙂
@Elena
“Do you know anyone on welfare?”
I dunno. I don’t ask for peoples tax returns in order to be friends or converse with them.
I think he makes a good point. People that rely on the government have no incentive to vote against their own interest – namely getting free stuff.
If 47% of this nation don’t ante in with respect to income taxes of course they won’t care about how government money isn’t spent because its not their money.
I know this will get me kicked out of the Rand club but I found out my unionized neighbor lost his job. I was going to go to the local 7-11 and pick up some ‘persons of questionable legal and mortal status’ to do the work. Instead I hired him and his vet family member to do the work. Is it in my financial best interest? Nope. But, I did it anyways.
How would a vote for Obama or Romney ge a vote against someone’s own interest? What is it that you all think Obama is giving away? Tell me you aren’t falling for that welfare lie?
People who work pay payroll taxes. They have FICA taken out and Medicare taken out. In all probability they have State and Federal taxes taken out.
Some peope have enough gross adjusted income so they don’t pay federal tax. You know…sort of what Romney does to reduce the tax on his millions.
Different people have different stories. However, it is a mistake for Romney to show distain for 47% of the Amnerican people. If he craps out on 47% I wouldn’t be thinking I was in the safe zone.
He was dancing tonight when he gave little justification speech. I almost felt sorry for him. And then I remembered we pay about the same rate…and my pity went down the drain. He just keeps shooting himself in the foot. It is painful to watch.
If the deal wasn’t already sealed……that wasn’t supposed to be funny, was it?
OK, I’m caught up on the video. If a man tells the people the truth, and the people vote for the other guy, then yes, we get the government we deserve. I’m not saying that in a nasty way, just an observation.
Makers vs. Takers 2012!
@SlowpokeRodriguez
I would like to see it to.
@marinm
What kind of work does he do?
@Cato the Elder
I trust this is the next stage….you know where all the non taker people are supposed to feel guilty for voting for the white guy who has macaca’ed so many times he has become mitt the twit?
I am trying to figure out who all is getting something for free. It sure isn’t me. Everything I get I have paid my dues for.
So….nice try. I don’t feel guilty at all. I am better off than I was in Sept. 08 when the bottom was falling out of the stock market, for sure. Romney disqualified himself in my eyes, forever by accusing the president of being disgraceful.
@Moon-howler
He was a union steamfitter. I have him doing some misc work on the exterior of my home.
@Cato the Elder
+1. no, +2 !!
Thanks. Not sure what a steam fitter is.
I feel sorry for Mitt Romney. I honestly do.
Does he really feel that 47% of the people pay no taxes? Does he realize you can’t opt out of FICA? Does he realize that many couples can get their income down because of kids, mortgages, etc so they don’t have to pay federal income tax on April 15?
He really doesn’t understand how the bottom 98% live.
I didn’t say collaborate.that’s a very strong word -.and yes, I can be sympathetic and see the struggle and yes I’ve read more literature on Nazi occupied countries, Armenian genocides and Stalin genocides and personal family histories of mistreatment granted MUCH milder by comparison. I can only imagine what I’d do – but I know I’d feel bad for it.
Our intelligence is being insulted by those stirring up this mini-controversy. There are a record number of Americans receiving government checks–some of whom will definitely vote for whoever will keep the checks coming.
But this is designed to distract from the primary question, which is who will perform best as president? Obama just came off one of his worst weeks ever with the embassy attacks, yet his supporters deflect from his performance to issues like this. The president should be running on his record of accomplishment, but we see very little discussion of his accomplishments. Why? Perhaps because there are so few accomplishments to discuss.
I think it speaks to the nature of the candidate, Kelly. Sorry, you weren’t the one being called a layabout and a freeloader. I was.
I don’t see why I should be blaming Obama for embassy attacks. I didn’t blame George Bush, Bill Clinton or Ronald Reagan for them either. I blamed those who did it.
Accomplishments? I have mentioned one this morning. I am a lot better off today than I was this time 4 years ago. I believe Obama kept us ot of depression. But why should I bring it up just to have the hounds of hell on me.
@Moon-howler
So how is this any different than Obama talking about people who “cling to their guns and religion?”
You mean politicians talk differently to fat cat donors at fund raisers than they do at campaign rallies? Say it ain’t so!!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T1DEG6BWgp0
Why is it different? 47% of the American people are layabouts and freeloaders. That’s getting close to half there, buckerooo.
He made it sound like they were trash. You can cling to your guns and religion and not be trash, just people who might not vote for you.
big difference in tone.
http://www.nytimes.com/2012/09/18/opinion/brooks-thurston-howell-romney.html
http://directorblue.blogspot.com/2012/09/campaign-that-wrote-off-white-working.html
“Obama campaign abandons white working-class voters”
“‘All pretense of trying to win a majority of the white working class has been effectively jettisoned in favor of cementing a center-left coalition made up, on the one hand, of voters who have gotten ahead on the basis of educational attainment… and a second, substantial constituency of lower-income voters who are disproportionately African-American and Hispanic”
Methinks that all this hullabaloo over Romney is a bunch of wind signifying nothing.
Besides, Moon, you weren’t going to vote for Romney anyway.
A majority of the half of the country Romney dismisses as clinging to their government checks and victim mentality are subject to payroll taxes that Romney does not pay since he makes his millions on investment income rather than earned income. Payroll tax is normally 12.4% on whatever wages the person earns (the rate is currently reduced to 10.4%), which is about equal to the percentage Romney pays in income tax (and they can’t reduce their taxable income by deducting their ballet dancing horses).
When you scratch off the half of the country Romney dismisses and then add the smart people and media folks Santorum said aren’t on team GOP, plus most of those who are non-white, pro-choice, pro-same sex marriage, anti-gun, pro-secular government, concerned about climate change or pro-labor and they’ve really reduced their claim of being a big-tent party to a joke.
@Morris Davis
I don’t know…it takes a big tent to hold all those people that voted in 2010…..you know…the majority?
We’ll see if those people are still under the GOP tent in 2012. Who knows…the Stupid Party may NOT pull defeat out of the jaws of victory…. again. The Evil Party may have more…or less. That’s the whole game. Who has more people on voting day.
As for claims of a “big-tent”….why would you want people that don’t have the same political principles under the tent? If those people that you list DON’T have the same principles and philosophies..then…. they stay with the progressives. If they change their minds….they are welcome under the GOP tent any time. Of course, the GOP also fights among themselves, trying to decide which of THEM belongs under the tent…so there’s that problem.
Romney was right in this context. If the 47% of the population pays no income tax then they don’t care how much gov’t spends. If they are dependent upon gov’t and see that as an ENTITLEMENT, then they will vote for the candidate that will give them more stuff. Obama went into office promising the moon to his supporters…so much so that some thought that they would get free mortgage payments.
I think that Romney is also wrong in thinking that ALL of the 47% are lost. I think that some of the 47% are sick and tired of the spending and over regulation and just want a chance to get back to work.
@Morris Davis
Morris I think you on on to something. No matter that Romney was talking about Federal income taxes, the liberal elite, those single issue voters with an ax to grind and the entitlement rights folks will make this into an interesting and a distorted election. It really is about makers v moochers, welfare v. entitlement, dependency v. self sufficiency, victims v. libertarians. And the winner is, ===== not the America we knew. As I have said before on this blog, the price of freedom is falling in direct proportion to the rise of the transfer State.
Romney spoke the truth. In an unguarded moment, he laid bare what we all know, the country cannot overcome its change of heart, putting reliance on the government over personel responsibility. From free condoms to a free lunch, from a teachers union that counts on hurting the lower and middle class in order to prevent professional evaluations to a AWOL President on 9/11, we will get not what we and others deserve and died for but what Tocqueville saw coming –when the poor and under privileged realize that they can vote to get what they could not earn or save for themselves. We are there and as he noted, that is when America and freedom ends. The troubles in the middle east are nothing compared to the worlds problems when America falls, financially, militarilly, morally. Build up your food storage folks, come November Pax Americana is about to crash.
http://www.theatlantic.com/business/archive/2012/09/the-47-who-they-are-where-they-live-how-they-vote-and-why-they-matter/262506/
Interesting data. Glad to see Virginia isn’t a “moocher”.
Thanks, Steve. Very valuable info in that article!
There are many working poor that qualify for the earned income tax credit, are they worthless scum? There are those who are on unemployment due to job loss, are they worthelss scum, to be dismissed by a possible man who would be president.
I have never heard of anyone running for office so easily write off so many of his fellow Americans, what a fool, what a fool.
This was a major eff up and the romney campaign gets it, listen to them try to back track today, it isn’t pretty.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Michel_Thomas
His story is shrouded in controversy, but wow, what a story it is.
Thanks, Pokie. I will read in a few.
How soon we forget, those of us who cling to our guns and religion.
Would you rather be a gun clinger or a layabout freeloader?
I think I would rather be characterized as a gun clinger.
@Elena
Calling the unemployed or those on welfare scum is not the point and your questions belie the liberal media’s diversion and spin on the entire discussion. A helping hand is not the same thing as a permenent entitlement solution. Romney understands the difference and has experience in using and managing a successful welfare system that employs and balances charity, work and training.
But I agree with you Elena, I do think there are some in that group of 47 percenters that still have a moral compass, that want to work, respect themselves and their families and want to pass on their achievements to their next generaltions that they can do better. The problem is the Obama types that wage war on small business through the estate taxes on a the multi-million dollar family farm or the corner store in the central city. This is were employees and the next generataion of owners come from. I do noth think Obama is interested in owners, he seems to want to keep us emplolyees and dependent on the government.
Obama has not changed the estate tax laws. I believe you have to get above 2 million to even qualify for estate tax. Why are we worrying about something that hasnt happened.
As for income, I think people making over $250k are better able to afford an increase of a percent or two. I dont feel particularly sorry for anyone facing that.
“I am for doing good to the poor, but I differ in opinion of the means. I think the best way of doing good to the poor, is not making them easy in poverty, but leading or driving them out of it. In my youth I travelled much, and I observed in different countries, that the more public provisions were made for the poor, the less they provided for themselves, and of course became poorer. And, on the contrary, the less was done for them, the more they did for themselves, and became richer.”
Benjamin Franklin, quoted from “On the Price of Corn and Management of the Poor,” November 29, 1766.
I wonder when all of these greedy, selfish, anti-American right-wingers are going to show some compassion and stop calling for an end to the entitlement mentality and for people to show some peronal responsibility.
There’s that entitlement word again. I have to ask, is this good entitlement or bad entitlement this time?
I have the entitlement mentality…big time. Why shouldn’t I?
No one has told me yet why I shouldn’t have it.
Of course, Obama’s campaign wants you to forget that THEIR message is basically, “if you vote for Romney, then he’ll take away the free stuff.”
Did you forget about “Julia?” http://www.barackobama.com/life-of-julia/
Jim Treacher says it well. Of course, I expect many here to not agree.
http://dailycaller.com/2012/09/18/democrats-think-romney-just-self-destructed-by-pointing-out-um-their-entire-strategy/
@Elena
This doesn’t look like “backtrack” to me. Transcript of Romney’s remarks.
“Of course, there’s a very different approach of the two campaigns. As I point out that among those that pay no tax, approximately 47% of Americans, I’m not likely to be highly successful with a message of lowering taxes. That’s not as attractive to those who don’t pay income taxes as to those who do. And likewise, those who are reliant on government are not as attracted to my message of slimming down the size of government…
The president and I have two very different approaches to the future of America and what it takes to ignite our economy and put people back to work. The president believes in what I describe as a government centered society. Where government plays a larger and larger role and plays more and more of the needs of individuals. And, I happen to believe instead in a free enterprise, free individual society where people pursuing their dreams are able to employ one another, build enterprises, build the strongest economy in the world. I happen to believe that my approach is the approach that will put 23 million people back to work again.
We’ve watched the approach of the president’s approach over the last 3 1/2 or 4 years. And his government centric, larger and larger government approach has meant that we have 15 million more people on food stamps, 23 million people out of work or stopped looking for work, or underemployed. We have had 43 straight months of unemployment above 8%. And my view is the right approach for the nation is not to adopt a government centered approach but instead a free, free people, free enterprise, free market consumer driven approach and that will build the strongest economy for ourselves and for the coming generations.”
Great article Steve, thank you!
I simply cannot imagine people defeding Romney on this point. He is an embarrassment as a presidential candidate.
DUH, working poor! But lets just dismiss all those people while you collect 50 grand a frigging “plate” for a fundraiser, more than the working poor make in a year 🙁
Oh, and please, let’s not forget, are seniors a drain on the government? Are they the parasites Romney makes THEM out to be?
@Elena
Let me ask you, do you believe that we too have a responsibility to prepare for our futures or do you believe that the government is our keeper in the latter days? Sort of like the ASOP fable of the Ant and the Grasshopper – or can we all be grasshoppers.
Also from Steve’s article:
There are some not-so-poor outliers, like the 7,000 millionaires who paid no federal income taxes in 2011. But for the most part, when you hear “The 47%” you should think “old retired folks and poor working families.”
I guess Blue would like these people to “man up” and work….
@Cargosquid
I don’t believe Romney has “what it takes to ignite our economy,” but I do enjoy watching him self-immolate and in the process torch his own campaign.
Moe, I feel sorry for him. He looked like he had been ridden hard last night when he gave his press conference. I bet that poor guy just wants to go camping and forget this whole thing. I think he set his ambitions a little high. He just isn’t presidential material I was wrong about him. I will admit it.
When has Romney ever called seniors “parasites” or those on unemployment “scum?” Unemployment is an insurance program that we all pay into while working and are “entitled” to benefits based on our contributions when needed. It’s not welfare. In this Obama economy many, many people need the insurance benefits for which they’ve paid premiums for so many years. Nowhere has Romney or Ryan suggested abolishing the unemployment insurance program.
Likewise Social Security and Medicare. Both were supposed to be programs into which we paid while working to EARN the benefits when we retire. They are threatened with bankruptcy because the benefits have been expanded so dramatically regardless of the contributions people have made. Politicians love to promise “something for nothing” to gain votes regardless of whether we can afford to pay for what they promise.
Romney and Ryan want to reform the programs so that those who have paid in get at least something when they retire. The course we’re on now puts both in bankruptcy. Benefits received should reflect an actuarially determined amount based on contributions paid while working.
I want the benefits for which I have paid and earned over the past few decades. I am not “entitled” to anything I have not earned, and no one owes me anything. I have a small business that I started myself without use of Small Business Loans or any other government support. Yes, I built it myself with no help from the government or anyone else, and have paid my fair share of taxes to fund the roads and other infrastructure that serve us all.
Just because others helped fund the road that leads to where my business is does not mean that they had one iota to do with building my business. I funded it, I built it, I’ve worked twelve hour or longer days and weekends, and it’s mine. Moreover, I have to offer my clients value for their money. If I don’t, they can choose to go elsewhere and I go out of business. That’s why a free market is the best system ever devised to serve people’s needs. If I don’t strive to figure out what people need and want, and then deliver it for a fair price, I go out of business. I don’t have the power to tax people to raise revenue if no one wants what I’m offering. That’s all what the government-centric people, including President Obama, don’t understand.
You call it Obama economy, I call it the Bush economy. I’ll stop if you stop.
Its OUR economy and neither president owns it.
No one said Romney or Ryan called anyone parasites or scum that I am aware of.
Quick question, NTK. Did you put the road in leading up to your office? How about those over and under passes? Did you go to private school without any public school?
I believe that is what the President was referring to. None of us is an island and we don’t get where we are today without some help from others and the infrastructure already in place.
I am going to give Romney a pass on his Palestinian remarks. I don’t agree with him that they don’t want peace. I am sure they do but they also want their fair slice of the pie. however, Romney does discuss some important aspects of that peace.
As tongue tied as he gets, I’ll give him a pass there. Are you willing to do that with what started off being Elizabeth Warren’s remarks?
Blue,
There are many people who work for minimum wage. I believe we are more than how much money we make, we are our deeds, and our personal behavior, we are how we treat one another.
My mom is damn hard worker, she has a college degree, she has always been in the social services and been paid chicken crap for salary. She works as state child care licensor and hasn’t had a raise in several years. She has a modest 401K retirement and will rely heavily on HER investments in social security and medicare.
I am disgusted at the narrative that all people who don’t pay federal taxes are blood sucking parasites on the government dime who contribute nothing to society, but drink, do drugs, live in tenament buildings, have multiple children, and are uneducated.
Furthermore, given the recent meltdown in the economy because of BLOOD SUCKING bankers, the most rich and affluent in our society, there are more people needing government assistance.
The drain on our society are not the most vulnerable, they are the most wealthy, who have access to our politicians, who influence our government policy.
NTK,
Government provides the society for all those things to happen that promote private industry. Maybe republicans should start looking at those countries where government provides very little framework and regulations. Pretty sure we have seen many of those countries in the news recently.
It is in the TONE of Romneys words that I find offensive. That seniors and working poor need to “be resonsible” and stop depending on government. You really don’t have a problem with that sentiment?
Medicare is running out of money because of skyrocketing health care costs. control health care increases you control medicare funding.
I think a bunch of people in that 47% are also students. They don’t make enough to pay taxes.
I hope no one thinks that all seniors are expempt from paying taxes. Hell, you pay taxes on Social Security, pensions and dividends and capital gains and 401k withdrawals. Those grab out 20% right off the top.
good one Moe!
“My job is not to worry about THEM” no, actually, your job is to worry about EVERY American and your conservative agenda is suppose to help them.
http://www.realclearpolitics.com/video/2012/09/18/scarborough_romney_sounds_like_a_plutocrat.html
@Moon-howler
Moon, three and a half years and it’s the Obama economy. Reagan and Clinton both inherited weak economies, especially Reagan, and had turned them around by the end of their first terms. I don’t agree with everything Clinton did, but he was far more growth, job creation, and free-market oriented than Obama. I agree with you that government is needed to provide roads, public education, national defense (subject to the limitations I’ve discussed in other threads), courts to enforce contracts, and a few other things. We all pay for that. Saying that government provision of such infrastructure is the source of economic growth or job creation, however, is false. It’s a necessary, but not sufficient, element of economic growth.
@Elena
I support government insurance programs such as unemployment, Social Security and Medicare 100%. All three are programs were originally created to provide earned benefits based on contributions paid in. Additionally, the disability and other parts of the programs provide for coverage in catastrophic situations. But, again, people have paid taxes in support of that coverage.
I don’t think we should have a society where anyone depends on the government. Reference my quote from Ben Franklin above. I don’t see any difference between what Franklin said in 1766 and what Romney said in 2012.
I don’t think we should have that kind of society either but we do. So how do we handle it?
As for Franklin vs Romney, FRanklin didnt rat himself out. No twitter, no video. I will be the first to admit things might look very different without tech devices to send our every word around the world.
I believe the election of Kennedy was the changing of the guard, so to speak. After he was elected, presidents had to start tanning and watching their mouths.
The issue of so many people not paying tax bothers me very much. We’re building America in the wrong direction.
Romney wasn’t addressing this in any meaningful way. He was pandering to a conservative crowd. What he says out loud is that 47% or so of America will not vote for him, so by capturing each and every independent voter he can win the Presidency. It’s beyond stupid. It’s out of touch with any reality.
Romney’s a dummy. I tend to favor Obama because, as thin as his experience is, he is more a man of substance than Romney.
It is important to remember that they’re both hacks – both charlatans who have coasted through life based on personal charm rather than any capability. Within that context, I lean towards Obama.
Where does that leave Bush and Clinton?
Maybe all presidents are charlatans. Personal charm helps. They have to deal with world leaders. Beats congress. They have no charm, personal or otherwise.
@Rick Bentley
The purpose of any non-public fund-raiser with key supporters is pander to them whether you are Romney, Obama, or anyone else. How I’d love to hear secret recordings of the discussions among Obama and the others in Bill Ayers’ living room.
I agree with Rick. I’m not exactly thrilled about standing with Obama, but I’m not going to fall for Romney.
I agree with NTK that fundraisers are a chance for candidates to pander for dollars. That’s why I think they should have to take an oath to tell the truth when they register to run just like we do when we register to vote.
I just want rid of Citizens United. What a joke that is. License to abuse the system.