Much mud has been slung at President Obama since he walked into the press room last Friday and spoke extemporaneously about growing up black in America. Some folks said too little too late. Other people said that he was race baiting. Then there are people like me who think what he said was just right.
Much goes in to our own identities. We start with our race, our gender, where we live, our region, our parents, and our physical attributes. Not much changes with those identifiers unless we move or get adopted. Even then, our genetic code does not change. Our place in time is also important and that does not change.
Yet, I feel some are attempting to deny the president his birthright—that being who he is as a bi-racial man. For starters, I really don’t think white folks get to evaluate this. How can I possibly address what it’s like to be a bi-racial man as a white woman? I can’t. Nothing in my DNA makeup gives me that right.
For many years, well in to my lifetime, your main identity depended on your race. One’s race determined where you went to school, where you could eat, where you could go to the bathroom, where you could even get a drink of water, whether you could vote, where you could sit in public establishments and on public transportation.
This didn’t happen in obscure backwoods parts of the south. It was common custom many places. One of the hardest under-the-arm-pinching I ever got in my life happened when I was little and growing up in Charlottesville. I had asked my mother in one of those screeching loud child voices why all those people were sitting in the back of the bus and could I go sit there too. I still remember the pain and the scolding I got when I got off that bus. I was never to ask questions about people’s race in public again and I was NOT going to sit in the back of the bus. White people didn’t sit in the back of the bus. (I still want to go sit on the back row of a public bus, btw.)
Barack Obama, had he been a little older, wouldn’t have had a choice either, even though he is bi-racial. As a child he would have been eyed with suspicion with his mother. If he were a teenager and had been on that bus with Little Moon, he would have gone right back to the back of the bus. It wouldn’t have been an option for him. He couldn’t have pulled the white card and sat where he wanted. He looks black therefore he IS black, at least for social purposes.
So why are some people trying to deny him the right to speak to what he knows? Do some white people think he was kidding about hearing car doors lock and seeing white women (he left off the word ‘white.’) clutch their handbags a little closer? He has lived those things and witnessed such behaviors first hand. I don’t even think he was saying these are bad behaviors. He wasn’t. It really fit into the category of JUST IS.
The playing field is not level. A black kid wearing a hoodie is now an icon for something that makes us grip our purses and lock our car doors in white America. Maybe the President just wanted us to recognize it. Hoodies are not the uniform of crime.
Meanwhile, he has every right to speak to this issue from a first- hand point of view and I am glad he did. Some people have tried to deflect attention to inner cities and in particular, the President’s adopted town, Chicago, where a disproportionate amount of black youngsters die annually. What happens in the inner cities of America cannot be compared to the Trayvon Martin case.
Trayvon Martin was an unarmed black kid just walking home in a middle class neighborhood with some skittles and an ice tea. It doesn’t matter that he was wearing a hoodie. All kids wear hoodies. It’s the style. He had traces of weed in his system. How many kids do weed and drink? More than most people want to admit, especially when talking about their own little angels. Regardless, that shouldn’t get you killed and should have nothing to do with this case.
Trayvon Martin’s death sent a riveting message to black people that their children were not safe, regardless of where they move. A young man was left as a John Doe for several days with no attempt to contact his parents. No one was charged even though the shooter was there at the time the police arrived. The shooter eventually was acquitted.
All of that sent a message that African Americans found unacceptable. We need to listen to them regardless of how we feel about the outcome of the trial. They feel something, rightly or wrongly, that we white people cannot feel. I think we need to be empaths on this one. Maybe we need to feel their pain and simply admit we do not and cannot know how they feel.
Thank goodness the President spoke out. He needed to.
I am a big critic of the President on this whole affair. I’ve already made my case about how injudicious it was for him to more or less take a aide on an open case that he had no particular knowledge of. As with the Gates affair, Obama’s desire to find the “teachable moment” trumped his ability to be fair and to rstrain himself.
I think he’s a pompous jerk. Anyone who drones about a “teachanble moment” but who sees himself as in no such need of being taught, is a jerk. Obama failed to learn from the first incident, and jumped right in on Zimmerman.
Strategically, there was never any endgame here. Zimmerman was always likely to be found Not Guilty. Why would Obama help to legitimize the idea that this one particular case should be a national cause? It was irrational; it was the usual bad leadership that we should come to expect. A smarter man would focus on a case where the shooting victim wasn’t apparently on top of the other guy beating him while he screamed for help at length.
And now Obama, looking for the endgame, wants to focus on eliminating racial profiling. WE JUST HAD THIS DISCUSSION 13 YEARS AGO. In the 2000 campaign, Bush and Gore each stated that they wanted to end racial profiling. I think they shook hands on it during a debate. After election, Bush had Ashcroft drafting up orders that would make profiling illegal. then, 9/11 happened. We the people, to include black and white, collectively agreed that racial and other forms of profiling should be available as tools to law enforcement. Now Obama wants to revisit this issue again, until the next terror attack? He’s leading people around in a sad sick circle. he’s the opposite of a leader.
If there’s a teachable moment here, Obama is not capable of finding it, or of teaching anything.
If someone wants to teach white America what it feels like to be viewed with inherent suspicion, that’s a noble cause. To jump in and use the power of the Executive Branch and the Presidency to try to lynch a guy in a controversial case is NOT the way to do it. It is the kind of reckless, compuilsive action that can only polarize people further.
This man’s a charmer, not a leader.
@Rick Bentley
I feel that we live in alterate universes on this subject. I never heard the president trash Zimmerman.
You and I heard very different things. I heard someone speaking honestly and without accusation. I saw no finger pointing nor did I hear any indictments.
I also never got the impression that ending racial profiling was the President’s main object in his impromtu speech.
The one thing I walk away with is that we are much more divided as Americans than I previously thought.
I agree with Moonhowler on this. What I heard was a man who spoke from the heart about a matter that has captured this nation’s attention. He said up front that the jury had spoken – it had rendered its verdict – that they did their job – and we would abide by that verdict. He then spoke about what it is like to be a young black male in America from firsthand knowledge. Finally, he spoke of the need to fix it.
Just because two old white men “had this conversation 13 years ago” doesn’t mean the problem magically disappeared. Just because legislation is in place to prohibit racial profiling doesn’t mean it is no longer a problem. Case-in-point: murder is illegal, yet it has not disappeared. Theft is illegal, yet it still exists. In order for unsavory behavior to disappear, there must be a culture change.
Oh, yeah, and BTW, the President’s speech wasn’t about “this conversation” of racial profiling. He was being human – people like that.
Speaking from your heart is not always appropriate when you’re President. He has taken a “side” on Zimmerman over and over again, including now by pretending that the case is open in some nebulous way … “we’re gonna get this guy”. Just as he took a side on the gates incident. His bias lead him to presume what happened, and speak injudiciously.
On the “problem” of racial profiling – I think most Americans understand that it’s flat out wrong to judge an individual based on a stereotype. But “racial profiling” as a law enforcement tool – which is what Obama speaks to when he talks about Holder exploring options – we had this diccussion in very recent memory. Confused, if you want to pretend that this is something real, that Obama is not just leading us in a circle, that’s your right. Enjoy the charade.
It’s one thing to “be human”, it’s another to be biased, and another to be pompous. I doubt that people in the center like Obama’s role in this trial; I know I don’t. Most white people are not really willing to express an opinion on “black” issues, so he could probably go in any direction and not get a lot of grief about it. The left loves everything he does, the right hates everything he does. But beyond my belief that he’s injudicious, I urge you to look at what passes for leadership these days. No new ideas; no real ideas. His whole Presidency has been a slick marketing campaign.
Bottom line on the whole larger matter is this, to me. We live in a post-racial world, in terms of rules and solutions.
There are people who exhibit prejudice, and there is bias in institutions. However, we are basically a well-integrated society. We are integrated to the point that you can’t craft some meaningful proposal that will affect one “race” without affecting the others similarly.
We are long past the ability to identify a problem by race – i.e. black unemployment, black incarceration rate – and craft a targeted solution that can make it better. There’s just no way.
That’s hard for some people to accept. Black activists in particular want to pretend that marching screaming and giving speeches is going to “uplift the black race”. Well, we’re well-inegrated enough that there’s no particular way to help black people and not other people. Dr. King’s dream has come close enough to fruition that this is the case. Seems like progress to me.
The truth of what I say is borne out by the lack of “solutions” to perceived “problems”.
Personally, I’m an opponent of race-based thinking. I think it’s past time to get on with life and stop segmenting us into demographics that can be continually exploited politically. It seems to me we all get along pretty well in this country and see most things the same way, until politics and the two parties start to speak.
The great division in America isn’t between black and white. It’s between people who watch CNN and people who watch FOX News.
That leaves off an entire group of people.
And everyone is entitled to an opinion.
Rick Bentley – I won’t debate you – it’s your right to believe whatever you wish. But let me leave you with some facts related to your statements that “we live in a post-racial world, in terms of rules and solutions,” that “we are basically a well-integrated society,” that “you can’t craft some meaningful proposal that will affect one ‘race’ without affecting the others similarly,” and that “Dr. King’s dream has come close enough to fruition.”
I would argue that we do not live in a “post-racial world”.
People of color are approximately 30% of the population of the United States, yet comprise 60% of the prison population. Incarceration rates by race: 1 in 15 African American men, 1 in 36 Hispanic men … 1 in 106 white men.
Statistics bear out the fact that people of color are no more likely to use drugs than whites. African Americans comprise 14% of drug users in the United States, but 37% of all drug arrests are African American.
According to the US Sentencing Commission, African American offenders are sentenced to terms 10% longer than white offenders for the same crimes in the federal system. African Americans are also 20% more likely to be sentenced to prison.
This is not post-racial.
Yes, confused, thank you for your contributions to this conversation and for the facts.
“post racial world”????? Huh ?
https://www.moonhowlings.net/index.php/2013/07/19/tea-party-rally-you-cant-breed-secretariat-to-a-donkey-and-win-the-kentucky-derby/
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/05/31/cheerios-commercial-racist-backlash_n_3363507.html
I knew that donkey link would come in handy.
Great points Confused, thank for adding them to this very complicated “conversation” !
I think I have a solution for all sides, at least for the Zimmerman part of the equation.
George Zimmerman should legally change his name to Ben Ghazi. That way, the Obama administration and the media would never mention him again, and that entire thing would just disappear.
Problem solved.
No, the ideal solution would be for Zimmerman to shoot a white kid. Then all things will be equal.
@Rick Bentley Really???????
Howard Stern’s joke … I find it funny, few others seem to.
As Elena says, this is a complicated conversation. Lots of parts to it, each of which is capable of provoking a lot of conversation.
I would think that if we bear down into small, granular parts of this dialogue, most of us would probably have consensus on them. A lot of the difference between us is which parts of the overall dialogue we choose to emphasize.
My posit is that for purposes of crafting effective legislation, we’re in a post-racial world.
Black people do have every right that white people do in this country, and law is genberally enforced that way. From the standpoint of law and government, there’s nothing to “fix”.
@Confused
http://www.fbi.gov/about-us/cjis/ucr/crime-in-the-u.s/2011/crime-in-the-u.s.-2011/tables/table-43
Its not just prejudice that puts minorities in jail. For some reason, culture, background, whatever, urban black culture is promoting crime.
Example: Murder. 49% of all murders are by blacks. 13% of the country. from the ages of 13 to 39, blacks commit more than whites, males more than 5x the rate of women.
That means that about 5% of the country….perhaps even less of a %, based on age restrictions, is conducting the majority of that 49%.
Then add in robbery: 55%.
The percentages are hugely up compared to the population density.
But the cause is NOT race. Rural black populations have the same crime rate as rural white populations. The problem is culture.
http://www.fbi.gov/about-us/cjis/ucr/crime-in-the-u.s/2011/crime-in-the-u.s.-2011/tables/expanded-homicide-data-table-2
Yes…we have a problem. We probably DO have a problem with sentencing. We also have a problem elsewhere, as shown above. My own opinion is that our “war on (some) drugs” is idiotic and we need to reform our laws. I wouldn’t have a problem commuting the sentence of non-violent drug offenders.
But in regards to the sentencing…. don’t do the crime……you won’t do the time.
As for walking in a hoodie….. Moon, you are absolutely right. That is not a crime. No one should be profiled by race, even though it will happen. It is human nature. It is risk assessment. Even Jesse Jackson admits to doing that.
But to bring it back to Martin, his actions were reported and even the police thought it was suspicious. NOT his race.
The problem is that the press continues to slant the stories, even presenting false information, in order to gin up outrage. I’ve see untold stories where not even lip service is paid to the facts as presented in the trail….facts presented by the prosecution.
The press continues to push a story that Zimmerman chased after a young boy, for no other reason than race, then got out of his car, stalked, and then shot Martin for no reason.
THAT is the narrative that I’ve seen and it has been repeated across the nation. The press is using it to continue to push for their agenda of killing Florida’s stand your ground law, pushing the false narrative that it mattered in this case and that repealing it would stop other such cases. Its another battle between the anti-rights side and the 2nd amendment side.
You repeated it – own it. Don’t deflect to someone else who might have said or repeated it. I don’t think you would have placed it in this forum unless you believed it at some level.
I wasn’t trying to run away from it Confused. I find it funny. i wish it were my joke.
Stern presented it in a gentler way, I made it more pointed.
I disagree. I am strongly in favor of 2nd amendment rights. I am also strongly in favor of background checks as a way to prevent violent criminals and terrorists from obtaining firearms. I see nothing in “the narrative” surrounding this instance that would indicate this was an attempt to “get the guns”.
Regardless of the color of his skin, the fact of the matter is that a young man … a CHILD … is dead. That is tragic. Not one of us completely understands the immediate circumstances that surrounded his death. There is no way for any of us to know if “the press continues to slant the stories” or is “presenting false information” – there were only two people at the scene and one is dead.
Back to Moon’s original post – the playing field is NOT level. I’m glad the President spoke out about it – race in America is a conversation we need to continue having in civil tones until true racial equality exists.
Cargo, great post. i agree with every word.
I’m going to play a little devil’s advocate, no pun intended, to draw out an issue that I don’t have a strong position on.
Confused, why do you say that the playing field is not level?
Rick, where did you grow up? I didn’t get the impression you were from the south when we met.
How will we know when we have a level playing field? The score of a game (so to speak) doesn’t have to be even for the field to be level.
I think asians beat whites at income level, don’t they? Does this mean that the playing field is tilted in their favor?
@Rick Bentley
i would agree with you on reality vs perception, Rick.
This is one of those you can’t legislate morality kinds of discussions. You can’t make laws to rule what is in people’s hearts (of all races).
@Cargo
Cargo said:
How on earth do you separate race from culture and vice versa.
Also, throw poverty in there. The amount folks can spend on lawyers vs public defenders has everything to do with jail time and conviction.
I don’t think you can dismiss race all that easily. When people can no longer see or hear differences in race, then perhaps. Until then, race plays a huge part…..
I will agree that gangsta music and resulting “culture” glamorizes crime….
@Cargosquid
Cargo said:
What police thought his behavior was suspicious? His behavior according to hom? Zimmerman? What the hell else do you think Zimmerman is going to say? He sure isn’t going to volunteer that he decided to stalk some kid walking along minding his own business.
I see kids outside their homes or walking around talking on cell phones all the time. They want privacy to talk kid talk. Truthfully, where I see it most is kids with lots of vehicles in front of their house, which leads me to think they have less privacy at home because of the number of people living there. That isn’t suspicious. Lots of them are wearing hoodies because kids wear hoodies.
Walking, running in the rain, talking on the phone…what seems suspicious?
If Trayvon had been a white kid wearing a blazer and chinos, he wouldn’t be dead now. I think we probably all can agree on that.
@Scout
If Treyvon as a black kid had been wearing a blazer and chinos, he probably would not be dead. I think we can agree on that as well.
@ Rick Bentley: “However, we are basically a well-integrated society. We are integrated to the point that you can’t craft some meaningful proposal that will affect one “race” without affecting the others similarly.”
When was the last time you talked to any black person about how “well-integrated” we are as a society? I expect maybe never.
@ Rick Bentley: “Most white people are not really willing to express an opinion on “black” issues,”–I guess you are not one of those, “white people not really willing to express an opinion on ‘black’ issues…” since you seem to have many opinions about “black issues” or as you see then, “black non-issues”. I am not black, I’m lily white, except for a bunch of freckles and age spots, but I would not ever claim that we are a well integrated society. I honestly believe you have to be a part of a minority group in order to know whether we are “well-integrated”. One of these days in the not-to0-distant future, we whites will be able to get some idea of what it is like to be a minority and then we can have this conversation again. But maybe, just maybe, the new majority will have learned from their own experience and well let us off the hook. We will just have to wait and see.
We’re better integrated than most other nations on this planet.
We’re pretty close right now to whites not being a majority. And you can see the strategy in politics of using black and Latino voters to beat the GOP in every Presidential race. I’m not losing sleep over it. I’m not really seeing how anyone would think that white prvilege is in full effect at this point though.
George, I’ve got more black friends and family than white ones. That’s part of why I’m not at all shy about having an opinion. I think that I have a good understanding of both sides of the coin.
Did anyone else see Bill O’Reilly last night? He came out SWINGING about race, jaw trembling and using words like “scum” to describe drug dealers. He was not at all shy, or cautious.
I did not agree with every word he said, certainly not with all the dramatic rhetoric he employed (“we need to work with the good ones [blacks] to fight the bad ones”). But amidst the indelicacy he said a lot of true things. He made a point that rings especially true I think. If we want to reduce black poverty and reduce the black crime rate, the biggest thing we can/should do is staring us in the face. Discourage black females from having babies young. He quite rightly called for a national PR campaign to this effect. And quite rightly I think, called out the first black President foir failing to speak out more loudly on this issue.
He’s right. Pragmatically, it makes a lot of sense that the President and his wife should lead on that issue. But politically, it’s not palatable. Easier for Obama to speak the kind of stupid crap that he does speak to.
The same might be said about white and hispanic women.
I find it ironic however that Bill O’Reilly really hasn’t said much about contraception and is a firey opponent of abortion for any reason.
Well, let’s take Bill’s name and trembling jaw out of this.
And let’s not presume that the Obamas should target a message about teen pregnancy towards black people specifically.
Would you not agreee that it would make enormous sense for them to take some leadership on this issue?
Would it not make INFINITELY more sense than whatever uncentered and nebulous thing he is attempting to do with respect to the Zimmerman-Martin incident?
Kelly – your 2241 comment is fascinating – all the more so because you may be quite right. If you are correct, it means that Trayvon got killed because of a wardrobe misfortune. It also means that a white kid in a hoodie might have bought the farm that night.
I don’t find this at all reassuring about the quality of modern life in this country.
So one of the apologists for the GOP, Bill O’Reilly, suggests we discourage black females from having babies young, huh? Someone should tell the rest of the GOP, who are feverishlyy passing legislation across the nation to restrict access to abortion and birth control, about Mr. O’Reilly’s suggestion. I’m sure they’ll set aside their religious fanatacism long enough to jump on board with Mr. O’Reilly’s race-control tactics.
You said it, I thought it.
Can we talk about the idea without involving O’Reilly or the GOP?
Ok, but the fact remains that the GOP is actively working to block access to family planning for poor people, so if you don’t want “young black females” to have babies, you would need to start by petitioning the GOP to drop that effort.
Good luck- let us know how it works out…