Republicans who set out to skewer Health and Human Services Secretary Kathleen Sebelius got off on the wrong foot. First off, some of the first speakers on the House Energy and Commerce Committee started with the Wizard of Oz theme. Sebelius is the former governor of Kansas. “We’re not in Kansas any more” was used on several occasions, to no avail. Their theme simply didn’t fit into the day or its events.
Sebelius disarmed her attackers by immediately opening up with the following statement:
“Access to HealthCare.gov has been a miserably frustrating experience for way too many Americans,” she said in her opening statement. “So let me say directly to these Americans: You deserve better. I apologize. I’m accountable to you for fixing these problems. And I’m committed to earning your confidence back by fixing the site.”
Sebelius had not included that statement in her advance testimony so some lawmakers were caught unaware. Obviously Rep. Blackburn didn’t hear what she said because she went on the attack, accusing Sebelius of blaming others. From the Washington Post:
“You’re now blaming it on the contractors and saying it’s Verizon’s fault,” said Blackburn after Sebelius outlined some basic facts.
“Let me be clear. I’m not pointing fingers at Verizon,” Sebelius said. “We own the site.”
Blackburn pressed Sebelius to tell her who led the team overseeing the project, and when Sebelius provided it, Blackburn pounced. “Michelle Snyder is the one responsible for this debacle?”
“Michelle Snyder is not responsible for the debacle,” Sebelius said. “Hold me accountable for the debacle. I’m responsible.”
Basically, it appeared that Sebelius was treated rudely by some of the lawmakers and their staff. Some took pictures of her on their cell phones and some congressional staffers lined the walls and laughed and applauded when their bosses seemed to score gotcha points.
Sebelius overall appeared poised, knowledgeable, and in control. She gave every impression of leadership. According to the Washington Post:
She bluntly refused their requests to fire one of her deputies (“I will not, sir”), to make enrollment voluntary for the first year (“No, sir”) and to hand over enrollment numbers (“No, sir”). She answered mildly even as a red-faced Rep. Billy Long (Mo.) and a furious Rep. Cory Gardner (Colo.) demanded that she drop her health-care coverage and join an Obamacare exchange (she pointed out that the law wouldn’t allow it). She did not respond to Blackburn’s contention that Obamacare had deprived people of having a health plan that is “a Ford, not a Ferrari” or a “red Solo cup and not a crystal stem.”
What was the point of it all? Apparently the House Republicans wanted to play a good game of gottcha. Some of her accusers were probably somewhat thrown off after her opening statement and her cool demeanor. Sebelius didn’t shy away from taking the blame nor did she throw others under the bus. It will take more than a tornado to dislodge this modern-day Dorothy.
“I’ll get you, my pretty, and your little dog, too.”
There was no getting yesterday. Kathleen Sebelius walked out with her head held high, Toto in hand. She might have even splashed a witch or two with a bucket of water. She was definitely in a monkey court.
She also skewered herself with her “Whatever” comment. Watch for this to become the new “What difference does it make” soundbyte that will be put to great effect, if only to motivate the opposition base.
50 stupid remarks made by the inquisitors and you hone in on one “whatever?”
I actually felt sorry for her. She has nothing to defend, defending the undefendable at every level and nothing positive to counter it with – nothing. Oh, she was served all right – no question about that – from the failure of the site, testing the site, security issues – to include dumb stuff like requiring all your privacy information before being allowed to “shop.” Stupid stuff like shopping without cost and deductible information. It sent a chill to evey American that is not deeply into the Church of the living Obama.
BTW, as a political appointee and former Gov of Kansas (?) why would she be exempt from Obama care. She could not be vested as a public employee could she?
Blue, just what privacy information did you have to give? None. No medical information was requested. I don’t know why you pitied her. I pitied some of the people asking incredibly dumb-ass questions thinking they were winning at “gotcha.”
She is not eligible to go to any plan other than her government plan except for Medicare. As long as she is employed, she stays on her current plan. She is ineligible to shop for any policy not part of Medicare.
Basically, she answered questions and explained what was happening, and said the buck stopped with her. What more can she do.
What was apparent is how little members of congress really knew about the plan and about technology.
@Moon-howler
What is apparant is how little SHE knows about the plan or how the website was developed. I thought the members did good given their seething anger at the lack of any detailed responses. This is important stuff and its all good the behind the curtin crap needs to stop.
I agree she has federal benefits now – while employed – duh, but she could have simply said that and noted that she would be elegable once that appontment ends. She refused any response.
What question did you hear an answer to.
Their seething anger was all posturing and mostly stupid questions were asked.
Blue, that’s why they hire out those things… you know, to IT experts and software designers. Did you really expect her or Obama to know the technicals?
She isn’t eligible for anything on the exchanges because she would have to get Medicare which is not on the exchanges. Why won’t you believe me? She turned 65 May 15, 2013. She couldn’t say that because she won’t be eligible. duh yourself.
What was the real objective of the entire meeting? The Republicans wanted to draw a little Democratic blood. That was fairly obvious.
I am deciding which one got the ridiculous award…the dude from Texas or the harpy from Tennessee who had the gall to point her finger at Sebelius like she was talking to one of her servants.
Oh. I get it. She’s from Kansas. Like Dorothy. Huh huh. Funny.
That’s the one that will make it into the soundbytes, get parodied on SNL, and comments from John Stewart. I’m not honing in on it. The media is.
“She might have even splashed a witch or two with a bucket of water.”
While we are on the subject of water, you seem to be carrying quite a bit of it for her. The rollout is a “debacle”. Her words. She said “hold me accountable for this debacle”. The only reason she’s still part of the admin is she’s acting as a heatshield for the President. When folks realize the enormity of this disaster goes way beyond a poorly-designed, un-tested, malfunctioning website, extending to skyrocketing premiums and an estimated 93 million policies getting canceled, forcing people to replace them with more expensive options, there’s going to be a lot of heads rolling. 100% of them Democrats, as they own this 100%. The only thing that saves them is the GOP leadership will probably botch the opportunity to get maximum leverage, or, the next circus/crisis distracts the people from the issue. Still, when premiums go up 30-40% and you can no longer see the doctor of your choice, people will remember this. All the water in the world can’t put this fire out.
Blue, there is a huge difference in the technicals of setting up a complex website and knowing about the finances in doing so. It wasn’t one company, it was done by multiple companies. There was no cronyism, that is rumor and gossip. Your comments are unfounded, unsubstantiated and simply nasty.
and how about the cupcake shop and deli in NYC that the Obamacare website has listed phonenumbers for, to get health insurance? Really, this bunch could screw up a one-car funeral procession.
I know nothing about that. all I know is that multiple companies were involved and they had to make something like 151 different sites communicate with each other.
It should be fairly easy to track down what you described and fine whatever company was responsible for that snafu if it wasn’t a typo.
Had all gone as planned, the states would each have their own website with Fed money. Virginia is one who said no.
Frankly, I am blaming Virginia for not doing its own. It doesn’t surprise me that something as huge and behemoth as a federal website isn’t working right.
So what do we do to ensure that most people have health care? Do we all agree that currently the number of uninsured is creating a huge financial mess and that the rest of us are paying for it?
No you are wrong Moon. It was a no bid contract awarded to a friend of Michelles. Really you need to get out more and off MSLDS. And while the performance of subs is an important issue, its clear that contract oversight was also missing. Can you imagine having an importnat program like this and not sitting down with the major players and being breifed; to include going live. Yes, I guess I can too, She did not do her due dilegence and for that alone should be fired.
No Blue, I am not wrong. You can’t just come breezing through here making these pronouncements. If you want to make libelous claims, then I insist you name the cronies involved and their relationship to the first lady.
I have no idea what it is you think I need to get off of.
Obviously you weren’t around for medicare D. Things didn’t go so well with that either. Now people love it. So yes, I can imagine.
You are having a real hard time backing up most of what you are saying.
“if only to motivate the opposition base”
They can become more motivated? What’s the next step, molotav cocktails?
@Steve
Good thing it was her and not me because
“whatever” would not have been what I said back to a couple of those people.
I would have gone out in a blaze of glory and not been the least bit sorry.
Easy. Exercise the Commerce Clause of the US Constitution and pass a Federal Law stating any Health Insurance company can sell their insurance in any state. This would increase competition beyond the current 2-5 average per state. This would lower costs and encourage more companies to offer insurance as part of their benefits packages. Provide a 100% taxdeductability for the cost of health insurance on Federal income taxes. Expand Medicaid slightly to provide coverage to those who have low incomes, with heavy emphasis on preventative care. Pass tort reform to lower malpractice insurance rates, which are passed on to the patient through higher fees and deductibles.
All IBM retirees will be losing their retirement health insurance. This will impact many folks in Manassas, including people in my family. ACA, Obamacare, whatever you want to call it, is as much a perscription for lowering the cost of healthcare, as is decapitation for a headache. Keep denying it, spinning it, minimizing it…but this is turning out to be one of the worst pieces of legislation ever passed in modern times.
I believe that the reason insurance can’t be sold across state lines now is states, not feds. I don’t think we have any guarantees that would lower anyone’s premiums.
Let’s hone in on IBM retiree insurance. Why is it dropped? Obviously IBM did the dropping. What was their reason and wasn’t is a contracted agreement with those who retired from IBM? Just out of curiosity, did those employees have to go on Medicare at age 65 or was it a forever sort of thing?
I would love to see health insurance tax deductible for everyone, regardless of long form or short form.
Too bad that wasn’t presented as a health care program about 10 years ago. Funny it never came up.
I have never said I thought the ACA was the greatest thing since sliced bread. I have always said reform was needed. I do like the idea of preexisting illnesses not keeping anyone off. The same goes for charging an arm and a leg for them. How would your plan keep that from being a problem?
Every time I go to agree with tort reform, I read about some hideous case of malpractice and I change my mind. Reform yes, to a degree. How do we compensate for some things? Not sure you can.
I have a friend with permanent vertigo because of intraveneous antibiotics given for a bone infection when there was no bone infection. Her life has been severely altered. She never even sued. I have no idea why. But that was pure sloppy medicine. How do you ever compensate a person for making them always feel like they are falling flat on their face. I wouldn’t want to be her for 10 minutes, much less the rest of my life.
@Moon-howler
“Obviously you weren’t around for medicare D. Things didn’t go so well with that either. Now people love it. So yes, I can imagine. ”
An entitlement program that impacted a fraction of society. ACA impacts the totality of our society.
Blue asked, I answered.
I am not sure it does affect everyone. It affects my family in a good way. I don’t know anyone it affects in a bad way. That’s not to say there are no negative sides. Perhaps I am being too middle class.
Here is a fabulous op-ed, although I may not totally agree with the underlying premise, I do agree with the objective fair approach to the similarities, at least in implementation of ACA to Medicare Part D.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/to-implement-obamacare-the-right-way-look-to-bushs-medicare-reform/2013/07/12/c2031718-e988-11e2-8f22-de4bd2a2bd39_print.html
@Moon-howler
“No Blue, I am not wrong. You can’t just come breezing through here making these pronouncements. If you want to make libelous claims, then I insist you name the cronies involved and their relationship to the first lady. ”
Um, Moon, Blue’s facts are closer to ground truth, than are your assertions. It was a “No Bid, Sole Source” contract, and the individuals Blue is referring to are Toni Townes, CGI Federal Executive and a college friend of Michelle Obama’s, and George Schindler, President of CGI Federal and big Obama campaign donor.
CGI was not the only contractor working on the plan. There were about 5 others.
So tell me, let’s talk about Toni Townes. Let’s follow the link from Michelle to Toni. They both went to Princeton, graduated the same year, and both belong to the association of black graduates. That hardly establishes a strong friendship. It doesn’t even mean they know each other. George Schindler also contributed to Republican candidates.
So lets see, no one has established that there is cronyism and there are about 5 companies involved with the software development and website design of healthcare.gov.
Tell me again how I am wrong about cronyism? I went to school with a lot of people. Elizabeth Edwards, Toddy Puller, and Marion Blakey (former head of FAA under George Bush) were all at Mary Washington when I was there. Only Marion Blakey would probably even blink if she saw me. I didn’t know the other two. None of them were actually in my class but it was a small school.
Yes, yes….grab ahold of any previous piece of legislation that either created or expanded a medical entitlement directed at a narrow sector of our society, and say Obamacare is “just like that”… even though there wasn’t huge legal an public opposition to those previous programs
http://us1.campaign-archive2.com/?u=30a32513ae04f5445c95f3239&id=71674078e9&e=7d3cc860ba
Steve, I was asked the question and I answered about medicare D. We could probably also talk about the gap insurance also, although I am less familiar with its origins.
Medicare is fairly huge. Part D saved a lot of senior Americans from having to eat cat food in their old age, or, more to the point, having to take medicine every other day rather than as prescribed.
Democrats fought the part D left and right, probably because it was Bush’s plan. There were all sorts of reasons given. Check with Elena. She and I were not on the same side over D. My husband is older and was on a boat load of medication. I saw it as a huge relief to my family. Had my mother lived, it would have saved her a bundle also. She was paying huge amounts for fancy policies to cover her medications which were upwards of $1200 without coverage.
So yup, I was in the old George Bush camp on that one. We tend to like what benefits us personally.
The baby boomer generation is not a fraction of our society Steve, 13 % is pretty significant, and is only rising. in 2010 Medicare Part D served 49 million people.
I would agree that the totality of the ACA is clearly a much bigger undertaking. I thought the ignorance of some questions demonstrated a real lack of knowledge regarding the uninsured. When the congresswoman from Tennessee went all drama on us, she bemoaned those poor people that are on Medicaid now who may have to share limited services with those who would now qualify for Medicaid under ACA.
I was really surprised that Sebeilius did not come back with….. “so instead of figuring out how to provide health care to more people, we should just allow those who are at the margins to continue to go uninsured?” What a stupid question. Those people, on the fringe, aren’t getting health care now because they DON’T qualify for any assistance! They use the ER as their healthcare, and cost us all more money because they wait until they are really sick to seek help and then don’t have the resources to pay the exorbitant hospital bills.
The ACA isn’t perfect, my hope is that Republicans will stop behaving like children and instead focus their energy on improving the ACA.
Steve,
I watched the entire Medicare Part D debate. There was an overwhelming fight against the underlying premise of the legislation. Did the Dems whip up their base into a crazed frenzy. No. What they did was attempt to handle it legislatively. They attempted to offer amendments, like the ability to purchase from Canada. They wanted the government to do for seniors what they do for Vets, collectively bargain and bring down the prices of medicine. Republicans wouldn’t have it. The debacle of the passage is well documented. Between keeping the vote open long past the normal time frame, while republicans were bribed to vote yes, between threatening the Medicare actuary with being fired if he told the real cost of Medicare Part D, between Pharmaceutical reps being in the atrium offering financial support for subsequent elections, yeah, there was a lot of shenanigans occurring during Medicare part D.
I just find it amusing that amnesia has set in for this huge expansion of a government program that cost 1 trillion dollars.
@Elena
“Did the Dems whip up their base into a crazed frenzy. No.”
That is because it was an expansion of an entitlement program (which they like) that they thought should go farther (which they did not). If there was any segment that opposed it, it was the nascent TEA party. I was the GOP HQ chairman for that cycle, and I got an EARFUL from conservative Republicans who opposed this additional government spending.
“I just find it amusing that amnesia has set in for this huge expansion of a government program that cost 1 trillion dollars.”
Ha…Haha….Hahahahahahaha! Were it “only” going to add a trillion dollars to budget, We’d be lucky. However, the CBO currently scored this at around $2.6 Trillion. I gotta ask when did a Trillion dollars become a triffling sum? I guess that would make the $174 million the HHS paid CGI to develop a website that doesn’t work…a “rounding error”?
But you are only looking at the costs to the federal budget. How much will this cost the US Economy in terms of reduced hours (full-to-part-time), businesses shedding employees to get under the Employer Mandate (delayed but still hanging out there), and hits to what little descretionary income the projected $2000-$3000 additional annual premium costs a middle-class family of 4 will pay in higher premiums? That’s $2k-$3K not being spent at restaurants and other goods and services. My company’s health insurance plan premiums went up 40%…and the deductibles up 60%. My clients, almost 100% Small Businesses, are telling me this is disasterous for their business, and will negatively impact their employees. I have family members who have lost their private coverage altogether. They liked their plan…but, contrary to what the President said, they weren’t allowed to keep it. Yep…this is just the perfect way to fix healthcare. The Democrats lied…and our healthcare system died.
From a management point of view, she’s the executive of the department that failed to deliver her boss’s signature program. She should resign or be terminated.
Yes – the hearing could have been a bit more professional – on both sides. However, a sitting Secretary testifying before congress should be able to pull something more polished than “whatever”. Honestly, that’s like arguing with a police officer. What did she think was going to happen?
I thought she was very patient, under the circumstances.
Of course, I have a very low opinion of most, not all members of Congress. I thought they were all posturing and grand-standing.
What did they really want to know? Nothing. They knew it all and wanted to draw blood.
Whatever has now taken on new meaning…in a good way for me.
Actually, I missed hearing it myself. I must have left the room for a minute.
I think you are confused. Tea Partiers and conservatives hold rallies, and pick up their trash when they leave. Occupiers throw things, and urinate or deficate on police cars.
You know, I was the bigger person this week, Steve, when I pointed out that the dude on the Daily Show wasn’t representative of all NC Republicans and was probably an outlier. You are pulling out a homeless person who probably had nothing to do with Occupiers and using him to represent all Occupiers. Judging from the looks of him, he probably had no idea what they were even about.
[stern look]
I think it is a sweeping generalization to say Tea Partiers pick up after themselves. They sure didn’t after vandalizing public property. Who took the barricades back to the monuments after they were dumped and piled up at the White House?
Come on guys,we all saw it. Let’s stop the extreme partisanship.
@Andyh
Andy, has anyone ever been fired in this administration, for anything? Nobody comes to mind. Fast and Furious? IRS scandle? Benghazi? ACA rollout?
When the Katrina response was botched, “Brownie” was toast.
I believe Brownie was allowed to resign.
The IRS woman resigned.
I see no reason for anyone to resign over Benghazi.
The house of cards and the house built on lies begins to fall;
“Obama ‘was sort of overlearning the lessons of Hillary Clinton’s time on health care. What destroyed Hillary Clinton’s plan was that people became convinced they were going to lose their health care,’ said Elaine Kamarck, who was a White House aide at the time and now heads the Brookings Institution’s Center for Effective Public Management.
“‘The one lesson that was learned about messaging was that you had to guarantee people that nothing will change,’ she said.”
The ends justify the means.
That Elaine came out with this is no small matter. She is nobody’s fool.
After a couple of years of stirring it up by the tea party, I don’t doubt that people did think they were going to lose their health care. I have read so much scare in the past 3 years that is difficult to separate fact from fiction.
Of course, that was the intent.
Moonie: I don’t disagree that the entire hearing was pretty predictable and, while I thought that the congress folk conducted themselves poorly, Congress was doing what they’re supposed to do and she should still be canned.
Steve: the city has never been reimbursed for the last “conservative” rally. Careful.
Medicare Part D was 1 trillion Steve.
@Andy,
The county has never been reimbursed for any of the rallies it ‘held’ I don’t think. It was very costly. We paid for it. So much for being a bellwether county. I see it as ker ching ker ching.
This would be a bad time to fire anyone. Dance with the one who brung ya…until it gets straightened out.
This was so macro, I wouldn’t know where to start firing. Maybe no one, maybe everyone.
Every time I hear about no bid contracts, my mind jumps to Halliburton. Now there is a case of billions and trillons.
Not to bring up other administrations……
Even though Secretary Sebilius is 100% responsible, firing her gets rid of the one responsible not the ones that dropped the ball. By firing her, you get to feel better, but it won’t change what happened in the least, and wouldn’t punish the hundreds of Federal overseers and hundreds of contractors that couldn’t bring the web site to the finish line on time. It seems that the GOP only want to terminate the guilty and the Dems only want to fix the site.
@Moon-howler
“Come on guys,we all saw it. Let’s stop the extreme partisanship.”
Wait…what? As a practical matter, ACA is a poorly written, poorly implemented piece of legislation, that was passed in 100% extreme partisan manner, and the very foundation of it predicated on what some would consider a lie; Average costs will go down, and you can keep the policy you have, if you want to keep it. This has been a partisan issue since its inception. You cannot unscramble this egg.
Of course the hearing would be high political theater. You have the chief adminstration official responsible for implementing the law, under oath. Of course its time for some payback. It gets rammed through the legislative process in partisan fashion, goes through a legal challenge, and now its real impacts are just starting to be realized, I think you may be asking a bit too much from those in opposition to this President’s agenda.
As far as the “Barrycade” incident, I thought those were veterans who tore them down and took them to the Whitehouse. Yep, pretty sure of it. I can send you some pics a friend took, if you’d like. However, if you’d like me to do a little research regarding what went on at the multiple Occupy rallies, I can provide you with much evidence that this was more than “a homeless guy”. If you can point out where workers had to clean up after a Tea Party/Veteran rally wearing Hazmat suits, I will conceed your point. My point (to Rick) is riots (molotov cocktails, damaging public property, smashing store windows) are not and have never been a tool of the right in this country, so his insinuation is insulting, and baseless. Just as baseless as his repeated claims of institutional racism within the Republican Party. The historical record directly refutes this.
@Moon-howler
“The county has never been reimbursed for any of the rallies it ‘held’ I don’t think. It was very costly. We paid for it.”
What rallies are you referring to?
@Andyh
“Steve: the city has never been reimbursed for the last “conservative” rally. Careful.”
Which rally?
@Andyh
I am sitting here thinking still, why fire anyone?
As we are a nation too quick to sue, we are also a nation too quick to fire. We let slugs sit on the job screwing up for years at the lower levels and often can the top. The top is often at the mercy of the ladder…who are always trying to cover their own little fiefdoms.
Its really a bad business practice.
@Steve Thomas
Not that you asked me, but I do know that the presidential campaigns don’t reimburse. McCain didn’t, Obama didn’t, and I doubt Romney did. Didn’t Hillary come to Metz? I bet she didn’t either.
@Moon-howler
“After a couple of years of stirring it up by the tea party, I don’t doubt that people did think they were going to lose their health care. I have read so much scare in the past 3 years that is difficult to separate fact from fiction.”
Unless of course someone actually loses their plan, forcing them into a more expensive plan sold through an exchange, or loses their healthcare associated with a retirement benefits package, forcing them onto Medicare and their non-medicare eligible spouse onto a more expensive exchange policy. Then there’s the whole matter of Small Businesses cutting full-time positions to part-time, and of course Small business premiums rising as they need to provide a certain “compliant” level of insurance. This isn’t the stirrings of some “Tea Partier”. I am telling you I have seen this first-hand.
LOL!!!! This thread is an example of exactly what people are sick and effing tired of – partisan “gotcha’s” and not much else. Ya don’t like what the ACA became? Where were your solutions and where was the effort to come up with a compromise package?
Let’s see….in 2014, what will the GOP bring to the table other than a bunch of whiny complaints about what the other party did? But more importantly, will it cost the taxpayers another billion or trillion of foot dragging shutdowns (or locally $70,000 on Pantygate), whining, or finger-pointing as solutions. Apparently it hasn’t done an iota of soul searching since the election of 2012.
@Steve Thomas
I am basing tea party on the number of flags I saw as well as some of the speakers. I think it is fair to say that was tea party destruction. I tend to not classify all vets as tea party. I have friends and relative vets who wouldn’t think of doing anything like that.
There were also a couple of vet groups out cleaning up trash. They did it out of the goodness of their hearts.
For the record, I think most legislation is poorly crafted.
As for occuply, I am not sure they were a leftist group at all. Who did I see embracing them? They were people who thought Wall Street got away with murder. I really think they are old news. No one really claimed them. It’s just convenient to call them a leftist group.
@Censored bybvbl
Actually this thread was an afterthought I threw up this morning while on the phone with Elena. She is innocent. I told her I was working on a post on Sebelious because people on the blog were getting along too well…not enough fighting. I was joking. She laughed. I laughed.
hmmmm maybe I was on to something.
Thanks for clarifying. I would agree that the campaigns rarely cover the costs of their appearances in part or whole. I do know whenever I have sought a permit for some gathering over a certain size, I had to provide funds for police security and Janitorial/clean-up if I were a public space, and sometimes even a rental fee…which we paid. When the MGOP holds its conventions, we pay for security, janitorial, and the use of the school.
Oh I didn’t mean to answer for Andy. I just thought that is what he was talking about. I know those political rallies can really set a locality back and there is no attempt to reimburse by either side. If the candidate is already a president, other rules go in effect. I don’t remember even though I was told.
PWC would charge both Dems and Repubs for building use also. You wouldn’t get in the door without the fee being paid first.
So now the Dems are responsible for people losing cheap health plans and companies dropping health coverage? NO – companies are responsible for throwing their employees to the wolves – just as they did with retirement plans. The lemmings rushed to private retirement funds because they’d all seen “Wall Street” and thought they were all Gordon Geckos who would rule the world. But now with some bear markets since their hero Reagan, they’ve suddenly awaken to a cold reality of having little in retirement. Now they’re bending over to accept their companies kick in the a$$ for health care policies as well. All the while bitching about unions. Oh, the irony…
I think everyone has seen the reality of what happens when pension funds get privatized and also what would have happened to retirement if everyone had invested their social security in 401Ks.
I have decided that the 401k is a real rip off anyway. They lure you in. Most of them have at least a point charged to fees and another to the remote possibility that you might want to annuitize your account. You look at your account and see all this money and no one reminds you that really, at least in Virginia, that only 76% of that money is yours. The rest goes to state and federal taxes. So no, you don’t have $100k. You have $76k. Thinking of it in those terms, it means you have given up $34 THOUSAND Dollars.
Then there is how much you loose in a down trend. The good news is, it is a way to get free money if you have a matching fund program. many people don’t. I did. You are crazy not to take the free money. However, give me a pension any old day. Actually, I will take both. The pension is forever, as long as you draw breath on this earth. The IRA or 401K runs out.
Just something for everyone to think about….be careful what you wish for. listen to Censored on this one.
@Moon-howler
You’re just the messenger. The hearings were typically filled with partisan raw meat thrown to their perspective sides. It’s the middle that is neither D nor R but the deciding voting block that’s sick of the gotcha’s. They don’t give a damn about the various time-wasting hearings but want to see something accomplished.
Politifacts rates Sebelius’ claim that it would be illegal for her get healthcare through an exchange as ‘Pants on Fire’.
The Washington Post gave Obama four pinocchios for his claim paraphrased as ‘you can keep your plan if you like your plan’.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/fact-checker/wp/2013/10/30/obamas-pledge-that-no-one-will-take-away-your-health-plan/
If your plan didn’t change from when the bill passed until the present, I suppose that is technically true. However, if the plan changed, then it can’t be grandfathered in.
Why would anyone like some half baked plan? Just asking….
Politifacts rates Sebelius’ claim that it would be illegal for her get healthcare through an exchange as ‘Pants on Fire’.
The Washington Post gave Obama four pinocchios for his claim paraphrased as ‘you can keep your plan if you like your plan’.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/fact-checker/wp/2013/10/30/obamas-pledge-that-no-one-will-take-away-your-health-plan/
Kelly, she can’t do it because people eligible for Medicare can’t use the exchanges. Why would she want to when Medicare is sitting right there? She has paid into Medicare her whole life.
This is really frustrating. She turned 65 last May. 65 is the magic age. I guess the Fact Checker didn’t put those two facts together.
At least we care enough to fight. Notice no one is fighting over Cuccinelli or his compass, even though the election is next week.
We aren’t making up crap about our local supervisors or anything like. We aren’t singling out local folks to pick on non-stop. Good on us.
I have no problem with his compass, but it’s a waste of time to argue about it here. Cooch views abortion as unconstitutional, which even Alan Deshowitz admits nothing in the Constitution even remotely supports choice as a federal right. So Cooch has a very mainstream view of the Constitution.
Cooch’s rhetoric is relatively mild compared to the people you mention except Mark Warner. McAuliffe has used much stronger language to describe his opponents. Mcauliffe was front and center in every Clinton scandal.
You roll out negative blog after negative blog on the Cooch. I know that you support McAuliffe but I would argue that whatever criticism you level at Cooch applies also to McAuliffe. However I am outnumbered here and cannot answer every charge.
Plus a lot of what you say about Cooch is true. I would have preferred that he did not go after Michael Mann or get so involved in abortion issues. Despite that, he has the capability to lead, compared to McAuliffe, who will be a disaster if he wins.
‘My candidate is not as bad as your candidate’ is not really a great slogan.
I take a decidedly private sector approach to these things. Project deliverable non-functional at twice the cost? Someone needs to go. The government rarely works that way and it is my view that the lack of accountability is a big part of the problem. Somebody needs to get canned: a hell of a lot of taxpayer money got wasted and that’s reason enough.
Are we to do the same thing and expect different results?
In any other organization — military, business, whatever — Sebelius would have been given her walking papers for (1) screwing up so badly and (2) not telling her big boss that he was about to be handed a bag to hold (if that part of her story is actually true). Fire her, for the love of Mike! Keep her incompetent hands off our health care,
That is a rather quick leap to judgement. What good would firing her do, just out of curiosity?
I don’t know that she did screw up. I also don’t necessarily think she would have been fired in private industry. The military–probably. But they have a rep for kicking things downstairs.
Members of Congress and some here either do not know what ACA or the website is all about or they are just grand standing to get attention.
Like the Congress man and pundits who constantly talk the HIPAA protections on the web site – there are none because there is no health data involved with the exchange.
Nobody needs to go to the exchange to get coverage. Sebilius qualifies for her government plan and for Medicare – why would she go to the exchange?
Currently, insurance companies are regulated by each state – if they Feds were to force states to allow policies to be across state lines – would the Feds not have to start regulating insurance companies??
The us has twice the per capita costs of healthcare compared to the rest of the world and worse outcomes – why does the status quo make sense to anyone.
ACA is much more than a web site. I am thrilled that pre existing conditions will no longer be a crutch for an insurance company to deny coverage. My son with asthma does not have to worry. The ability to deny coverage for things like rape, pregnancy, cancer and acne are gone.
Should Obama have told insurance companies that they could not drop or change plans – no. The plans were grandfathered in. The insurance companies decided to drop those plans – it happens every year. Not one person here has said that they are in the individual market – when you are in the individual market, the insurance companies have a field day. Drop plans, change plans, deny coverage, etc. Have you ever needed to get a plan – what does it cover is it adequate, compare it to another – are all things that were not possible to do before ACA.
This IS a market based approach that was created by the Heritage Foundation before Romney and Obama took it. Read the Heritage Foundation ideas – mandate, penalty via tax, enforcement by the IRS – all out of the Heritage Foundation.
If we want the US to compete on a global basis we need to fix our healthcare issues – and I have seen no attempts to fix it since HilaryCare.
@Steve Thomas
No one HAS to buy through the exchanges.
Ah…something worth reading. @PatH