Is Obama just posturing or do these types of sanctions have influence on countries like Russia? Will our NATO allies flex with us or impose their own set of sanctions?
How many different times will Ukraine be the whipping boy of Russia?
It appears that Obama is meting out a little whup-ass to Putin’s pals. Good. Maybe they won’t like it and will convince their bully bud to rein in what appears to be his reign of terror.
Peterson, what would make you feel better about the situation, in the short-term? Should Obama start riding around shirtless on horses?
This whole thing is at heart about Russia’s fear of the Ukraine becoming part of the European Union. And it’s going to play out economically.
As to Romney’s editorial – http://online.wsj.com/news/articles/SB10001424052702304747404579445170801186310?mg=reno64-wsj&url=http%3A%2F%2Fonline.wsj.com%2Farticle%2FSB10001424052702304747404579445170801186310.html – among all his name-calling and finger-pointing, he says that we only have “unacceptable” options.
This is similar to the way he sees America. It and a lot of the people in it are “unacceptable” to him.
Since Mr. Romney finds America’s place in the world unacceptable, perhaps he should sit down and shut up and let the grown-ups deal with it. Go form another Bain Capital, put on your magic underwear, and shut the f*** up.
Rick. Damn you. I just wasted more Baileys than I wanted to waste. ARRGGHHH Computer screen. sputter.
Too funny.
@Rick Bentley
What would make me feel better about the situation?
Perhaps Obama should sit down and shut up and let the grown-ups deal with it. Go fill out another NCAA bracket, take off his mom jeans, and shut the f*** up.
I like his mom jeans. Let’s see yours. Do a selfie. We will judge. I am betting you wear mom jeans.
Obama is paid to NOT to sit down and shut the f*** up.
What could he have said that would please you?
The level of contempt that Romney shows for this country is striking to me.
Big talk from this tan-skinned douc*ebag who has hardly ever made an honest dollar in his life. And whose foreign policy experience consists of running the Olympics.
All in all, a disgraceful nominee.
The Republicans’ previous nominee, Senator McCain, is making a real ass of himself these days as well. Even some loyal FOX News viewers at my job were cracking jokes about how out-of-touch he looks these days, angrily calling for war.
@Rick, That word is allowed. In fact, remember the old video of Groucho Marx when the duck dropped down out of the ceiling? You just won the prize.
I think that if I had to pick between the two men though, I’d take McCain. At least he did real things in his life. He may be a maniac, a contrarian, and a diva. He may even be going senile. But at least he is not some entitled brat born into wealth, who never did anything real, and whose main achievement in politics was his ability to change every ostensibly core value he claimed to have over time, as the winds blew. For such a man to be standing up shouting about how weak the President is, is a disgrace.
Yea, McCain at least has his POW street cred. He wasn’t so sterling when he got back but oh well…things change.
But between McCain and Obama you would take Obama…? Because he has done real things in his life? Got it… smoke week, snort coke, be a senator for 140 days = REALLY doing something in life.
He is a good father and husband. Not everyone can make that claim. He was also a state senator and he worked with poor people. Not everyone can do that.
How many people his age have never tried weed?
I think trying to feminize Obama by referring to his pants as “mom jeans” is actually pretty far out. I know that FOX News is leading the charge in this, but I think it’s sexist, and also fairly strange behavior.
Peterson, Obama’s lack of experience in 2008 was a shortcoming to me. However, he didn’t come off as an entitled douch*bag the way Romney does. I’m sure I’m a huge hyprocrite for calling him that after taking exception to the “mom jeans” thing. But I’ll leave it in there. It’s the common vernacular for “an entitled person who is loud and brash about their entitlement, and has a lack of self-awareness about it”. You know, the kind of person whose son would say he wanted to hit another man in the mouth for daring to run for office against his father.
@Rick Bentley
Yeah, the mom jeans was the only thing I could replace the religiously intolerant “magic underwear” comment with to match your statement.
Also, he throws like a girl 😛 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lJGkPf9gZzM
And YOU are saying someone else is intolerant? (Throws like a girl?)
You asked for it, here it is… my latest selfie: http://www.kiss925.com/files/bp4.jpg
Would you think me rude if I said you apparently don’t know the difference between your ass and your face? How am I supposed to see mom jeans.
@Cargosquid
Obama inherited a $1.2 Trillion dollar deficit – before he was President.
http://www.factcheck.org/2010/02/a-texas-size-whopper/ –
http://www.cato.org/blog/dont-blame-obama-bushs-2009-deficit
Before he was President was was the debt at? What is it now?
Irrelevant what it was then and where it is now. Totally effen irrelevant.
I would venture to guess that a TON of people ‘tried’ weed. But keep in mind he didn’t just ‘try weed’ (I noticed that you left out the cocaine use). He did ‘drugs’ enthusiastically, in his own words.
This isn’t related but it always makes me laugh when I hear it: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DTdyMklPv3g
I never comment on people’s cocaine use. I think it is a stupid thing to do, especially for kids.
Rude, not at all… just being cheeky
Peterson, that may bother you. It bothers me less than the fact that Bush was an alcoholic drove around drunk, then subsequently “choked on a pretzel”, and that his wife frequently appeared to be more hung over than Betty Ford (or Kitty Dukakis) on a bad day.
Me neither… unless they tell everyone about their cocaine use. Obama has openly talked about his cocaine use, he even said he did it enthusiastically
WOW! 81 posts so far! Seems like a popular topic!!
I actually align more with Kelly and Cargo and even Wolverine on this Obama/Crimea issue (the subject of this thread, remember?). Obama’s “sanctions” are ineffectual in the short term. If you want to get the attention of a thug like Putin, you have to hit him in the head, and the EU is too intertwined with Russia for the US to do what is needed without hurting them. On the other hand, the world is watching, and Obama’s continual setting of “red lines” and not backing them up is emboldening bad guys all over, possibly including big dogs like China. Putin has his major port (Sebastapol) secured and he will likely move to secure the coal mining areas in the eastern Ukraine now.
This is all bad for the non-Russian Ukrainians and for the EU, but think about it in terms of what if Russia was trying to get Mexico or Canada to align with them instead of the US? What would we do?
Waiting for a better solution than Obama’s. No one has suggested one other than hitting him in the head. Pretty tempting but not too realistic.
“the EU is too intertwined with Russia for the US to do what is needed ”
Um … this is the EU’s fight. I assume they remember that a few decades ago this very nation was attempting to chew them up into itself. It remains to be seen how feckless they will or won’t be …
Riiiiiight… 🙂 cause back then it was (according to Obama) unamerican. Now it’s… eh, irrelevant. Got it…
Very interesting academic guest discussion on the John Bachelor show tonight. Putin and the Ukraine. Who is watching all this very, very closely to see if Putin gets away with this blatant seizure of territory? China. The Chinese are already confronting the Philippines over control of large parts of the South China Sea and Japan over ownership of islands near Okinawa. If Putin wins and suffers no real consequences from the US, the EU, or the UN, will the Chinese be emboldened to pursue with even more gusto and determination a larger hegemony over the Western Pacific? And then there is a place out there called Taiwan — once considered an integral part of larger China. One conclusion was that, three years or so hence, we could be looking at a world geo-political situation which little resembles what we are looking at today.
Sort of reminds me of reading pre WWII history books……
What to do now? I have no idea.
@Pat.Herve
Yes…I’ve seen those posts. They are wrong. Obama SIGNED that budget. Period. He inherited nothing. He didn’t have to sign that budget.
As for what I want Obama to do…..SHUT UP about lines that other countries should or should not cross. If we don’t have a “big stick” then yapping won’t do a damn thing but make him look weak.
Want to hurt Russia for doing this? Go full out on producing petroleum products and become an exporter. And then undercut their market. Russia can only make a profit if the price of oil runs about $100 per barrel. Start setting up a natural gas export system. And then cut the EU a deal. Make Putin trade his economy for the Crimea. Reagan had the right idea. THAT is why we supported Saudi Arabia. Now…we don’t even need to do that. We have more oil, natural gas, and coal then they do.
Personally, I think Romney is right, regardless of Rick’s personal animosity towards him. All we have are unacceptable choices……right now. We can’t prevent Putin from taking Crimea. But if he has designs on….say….Estonia….. and I mention them because he has expressed “concerns” about the “Russian minority” in that country….set up some long term military exercises with Estonia. The Marines need some Baltic training and R&R.
Here’s the “concerns” from Putin.
http://www.reuters.com/article/2014/03/19/us-russia-estonia-idUSBREA2I1J620140319
As one commenter put it elsewhere:
Anonymous said…
So the Russians (Soviets) murder and exile native populations in neighboring countries, replace them with Russians, outlaw or marginalize native language and culture for 70 years. When these beleaguered nations regain their sovereignty they, out of the goodness of their hearts, don’t exile the Russian interlopers back to mother Russia, and neo-soviet Tsar Vlad uses their “plight” as an excuse to invade and re-subjugate his neighbors. sweet.
I don’t think anyone is disagreeing with the comment. I would probably disagree with the time span. Isn’t it more like 90 years?
I think the only differences in opinion might be about how to bring about change.
The Russians have, indeed, made recent mention of alleged bad treatment of the Russian-speaking minority in Estonia. The Baltic States, however, are all part of NATO now. I posit that any attempt by the Russians to get involved there as they are in Ukraine would be a far different matter. I suspect that may be what Vice-President Biden is saying on his current trip to the Baltics.
Henry Kissinger may have come up with a logical possibility in a recent NYT op-ed. He suggested that Ukraine ought to become the Finland of the 21st century — a nation of recognized strict neutrality between East and West as was Finland during the Cold War. As I recall, the Finns did pretty well in that situation in the Cold War years.
@Moon-howler
1919 to 1991 Most of the damage was done by Stalin and Kruschev
I don’t think Russia has been nice guys since 1991. Let’s face it, regardless of name, its all Russia.
Oh, too funny. You know better than the facts.
I was going to read through all of this but fell asleep in the process. To those who want to bitch and moan about how good/bad President Obama is doing re: Ukraine/Crimea–walk a mile in his shoes. Or maybe drive up to DC, knock on his door and tell what your great idea is for getting out of this mess.
@Wolverine
Maybe, maybe not. Finland has had a stormy relationship with Russia for decades. It was a part of Russia for over a century and finally broke away while Russia was busy with the revolution. Then they fought the Russians during WWII, killing some 120,000 Russians but they lost something like 90,000 people. They may be “neutral”, but their “Cold War” with Russia continues with air and border incursions, lengthy lines at crossing points, high Russian excise taxes on Finish materials and so on. Putin will trump up something about abuse of Russian in the eastern Ukraine and those massed tanks and troops will be in Kiev before you can bat an eye. And NATO will probably be standing around, with us, wondering what happened. If that happens, NATO will be the eunuch that many believe it already is.
@Pat.Herve
The fact is that Obama signed that budget. One does not “inherit” what one signs. Nothing prevented him from vetoing that budget.
So, yes…..I’m right. They are wrong. They are merely using the fiscal year as the reason for calling it Bush’s. But Pelosi and Reid didn’t enact that budget until Obama signed it.
It was unprecedented.
Then the Democrats did not present another budget for years, to prevent being held accountable.
Interesting–On Friday, the Russian stock market dropped 3%. guess why. Sanctions.
The sanctions issued by President Obama are very much having an effect on the Russian economy.
There is more to come.
Who is laughing now?
They are.
Compared to losing Sevastopol and the Crimea….3% is a drop in the bucket. They expected repercussions. They don’t care.
And they’ll just raise gas prices….
I agree this is a positive development, but no definitive judgment can be made at least for a couple of months. Obama needs Putin to pressure Syria to cooperate on destruction of its chemical weapon stockpile and to follow through on the nuclear weapons accord. The Europeans need Russian oil and gas to flow unimpeded. So do not be surprised if some unexpected issues related to Russia’s cooperation crop up. We will see if Obama can stand fast.
http://pjmedia.com/spengler/2014/03/20/the-wests-ukrainian-folly/?singlepage=true
What he said.
What was that about sanctions?
http://www.theospark.net/2014/03/let-me-see-if-i-have-it-right-now.html
Ukraine buys almost all its energy (natural gas) from Russia. Revenues from natural gas sales are a primary source of income for Russia.
Because of the recent disagreement between Ukraine and Russia, Russia is raising the price of natural gas it sells to Ukraine.
Ukraine is almost broke and can’t afford the increase in the natural gas price because it would be forced into bankruptcy.
Obama (the USA) just announced the United States is giving Ukraine $1 billion to assist in paying for the higher priced natural gas it buys from Russia.
So, the United States is actually giving Russia $1 billion because the money is just passing through Ukraine.
The first question: Has Putin figured out a way to raise the price of his natural gas sales and make the U.S. pay for the increase?
Next question: Was he really in the KGB or was he a commodities trader?
If this analysis is accurate, Putin just got Obama (the USA) to pay him $1 billion by holding a press conference and trucking some troops across town from the Russian Navy base in Ukraine.
Who is the smartest guy in the room now? (Never was Obama, was it?)
Perhaps Obama is selling the natural gas to the Ukraine. Maybe we need a transatlantic pipeline.
Other people sell natural gas other than Russia. They had jacked up the price real high anyway.
Nope…not selling the gas to anyone. We don’t have the capacity to hurt Russia’s sales. It will take years to develop that.
Russia supplies 30% or more to Europe.
Not sure how you deliver natural gas in a cost effective manner. We have more than you can shake a stick at. We have been geographically blessed. How to get it there would be a problem. It would have to be liquified and then deliquified. By the time all this was done it would be as expensive as Russian gas.
Also the Asian market wants our natural gas. They are willing to pay bigger bucks for it.
From the WaPo:
There are also no promises that US natural gas is going to stay cheap.
@Moon-howler
That IS the problem.
But the secret to lowering Russia’s price is just putting more on the market…not just specifically to Europe, just as making more crude available would lower the overall price of oil.
You are right. There is no promise that US gas is going to stay cheap. The biggest danger is gov’t interference in the market. The problem will not be a lack of the resource.
Right now we are in the top five for coal, oil, gas, and food in the world. We SHOULD be number one in manufacturing and steel.
We need policies that make energy cheaper, makes us energy independent from the world, and reduces the cost of doing business in the US. We need policies that lowers the costs of raising children. We need policies that lowers the costs of growing food. Of course that cost is intertwined with energy costs. We need to have big ideas, whether they are done by gov’t or business…like learning to mine the asteroids.