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Apparently the GOP’s next magic trick just isn’t producing results. Where is the alternative plan? Repeal with no replacement is not a plan.
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88 Thoughts to “GOP Reveals Alternatives to Obamacare”
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Their alternative plan has always been the market place. If you think the Feds being involved in health care is intrusive, it should be remembered that the last thing an insurance company want to do is pay a claim. Medical claims as well as pre-authorization requests are intensely scrutinized by insurers, most often using registered nurses and nurse practitioners.
If one reads the Heritage Foundation plans from way back – it includes many many many of the same approaches as Obamacare – Mandate, tax penalty, Medicaid reform/expansion etc. Anyone who argues that it differs from the HF initial work has not read it. http://thf_media.s3.amazonaws.com/1989/pdf/hl218.pdf They were for exchanges before they were against them. Newt, Mitt, Gillespie, Bush 1, Dole, Hatch, Grassley, Lugar. Funny how a Conservative idea is not flipped to the Conservative opposition.
Many of the complaints of today are the same exact complaints of every year over the past 20 years – increased premiums, restrictive doctors, doctors not available in plan, deductible increasing, etc.
The benefits – no more pre existing conditions, no caps (why is my life worth less than the CEO), no health check to get coverage, etc.
Why would anyone want to repeal the good parts – yes, they come at a cost. But with good comes some bad. I did not want the mandate, but after learning why, came to understand why the Heritage Foundation was correct.
Like I keep asking, where is the GOP when it comes to saving the lives of sentient human beings and not fetus’s? I guess you are only pro life when it comes to abortion but denying people affordable health care access is ok?
@Elena
Elena, it is really worse than that. It is just plain simple Anti-Obama no matter what the issue is.
Putin invades Georgia – no response from Bush (not even sanctions)
Bush extends medicare part d enrollment – no issue
12 Consular and Embassy attacks 60 deaths – no issue and no increase in security measures
Deficits of over Trillion Dollars – no issue
Two Wars – no issue
Cruz born in Canada – no issue for that white man
If Obama could turn snow into Gold, they would complain about the decreased value of Gold.
You are right Pat, I know. It’s like the hatred for Clinton only on hyperdrive. It’s astonishing and depressing all at once.
It is one of those things where you have to shake your head. President G.W. Bush, taking a cue from an idea his Father’s Administration had, proposed a plan that did not overall the whole system, but provided for ways to bring costs under control, and provisions for improved tax deductions for medical expenses (versus the current formula on Schedule A). Went nowhere.
At the same time, then Senator Tom Daschle, back in 2008 came out with his book “Critical: What We Can Do About The Healthcare System”. Good book, except for his idea of a single-payer system which is problematic. Many of his points though were on track with President Bush…imagine that…a Republican & Democrat working together! Alas, his ideas also went nowhere.
@Pat.Herve
Totally excellent response!!
@Pat.Herve
Putin invades Georgia – no response from Bush (not even sanctions)
He also didn’t draw any lines…thus talking big while not being able to do anything.
Bush extends medicare part d enrollment – no issue
Well…except for the out cry of the actual conservatives and the beginnings of the conservative revolt.
12 Consular and Embassy attacks 60 deaths – no issue and no increase in security measures
Also no cover ups like at Benghazi or lies about “demonstrations”…. which is the biggest complaint.
Deficits of over Trillion Dollars – no issue
Again…except for the beginnings of the conservative revolt and the Tea Party.
Two Wars – no issue
Nope. Because we believed that they were necessary. And that we includes democrats.
Where the issue was ….the war fighting policy and the creation of DHS. If you’re going to go to war…go big. None of that Rumsfield policy of small footprint.
Cruz born in Canada – no issue for that white man
Really? Because I’ve seen quite a few conservatives say that they need the definition of “natural born” clarified. Also…he didn’t try to hide it, or delay answering about it, or hide records, or lie about it……unlike the current office holder.
Hahahahaha! Cargo, are you a secret birther? Who lied about what again?
I did not know you were a birther!!!
@Pat.Herve
It was a bad idea when the Heritage Foundation presented it and its a bad idea now.
Good parts? Any good parts are contaminated by the majority of the bill. Like a barrel of sewage with a couple of pints of beer thrown in.
The gov’t mandate is NOT a conservative idea. Period. It is unAmerican.
Cargo,
Not very expansive in your responses. President Obama never drew a line near Crimea. What do you propose we do in Syria? come on, since you are the expert, what should we do?
What outcry from conservatives regarding medicare part D? I watched the entire debate on CSpan, there was no outcry.
Iraq, what a debacle and tax cuts to boot. How did we pay for that war again? Oh yeah, we didn’t, it was all supplementals in the budget.
I cannot believe anyone but Rumsfeld and Cheney would still support the two wars. Again, where were those weapons of mass destruction?
I would go so far as to say that the Iraq war was immoral. As far as Democrats go…they backed it because they were told a lie. A huge lie.
@Cargosquid
cargo – I cannot see through those Rose Colored glasses enough to respond.
@Elena
He was drawing a line about Ukraine by talking about how bad the sanctions are going to be for Russia.
I’ve mentioned what we should do in Syria. Keep out and let the bad guys keep killing each other.
The out cry on Medicare D was not on CSPAN. It was on conservative political blogs.
We haven’t paid for anything. Including the TARP, ANY of the deficits, etc. THAT’s the point. Why aren’t you complaining about Obama doubling Bush’s spending if Bush was so bad? Why is it okay to NOT pay for Obamacare and the “stimulus” packages?
60 deaths in 12 embassy and consulate attacks under Bush II is utter misleading nonsense. I’ve seen that list, which was put together by some lib blogger who either hasn’t a clue about the subjects of terrorism or mission security or was just plain BSing through his teeth. The list was repeated by other equally ignorant liberal bloggers. One of the attacks listed (in Saudi Arabia) wasn’t even against an American mission. Only one of the attacks succeeded in a brief breach of the mission perimeter security via a truck bomb and a small group of armed attackers. A couple of local mission employees were killed or wounded in a crossfire, but the attack was stopped by local military guards long before the terrorists even got close to any American personnel. I tore that list to shreds many months ago on Novatownhall.com. The security worked. There was no need for an “issue.” The guy who posted the list at NVTH during a Benghazi debate then acknowledged how inaccurate the list actually was. You’ve got to be careful about falling for that kind of stuff on the lib blogs.
The attack which was truly a fatal breach happened under Clinton. Nairobi in 1998. Funny about that one. Susan Rice was then the Assistant Secretary for African Affairs. The Ambassador in Nairobi, a Clinton appointee, asked for enhanced security and eventually a move of the mission to a safer location. Her requests were turned down. It was only when she got through in a direct communication to Secretary Albright that the mission got some enhancements. Not enough. Al-Quaeda truck bomb in an alley right behind the building. Boom!!! American and local dead all over the place. I believe the mission has since moved to a more secure location.
Apparently you gage a presidency by the number of terrorist attacks or is it just embassy attacks?
Are we going to include the Marine barracks in this discussion and 9-11 itself?
I think terrorist attacks is a pretty foolish benchmark to set.
That “white man” Cruz is ethnically half-Cuban I believe. The paternal half. The half that first fought with Fidel Castro after being tortured as an opponent of the Batista regime. Then that half got out of Cuba when he found out that Castro was really a commie and a brutal one at that. It looks to me like Cruz has self-identified mostly as Hispanic —- as in, for example, the first Hispanic Solicitor-General in the history of the state of Texas. But, all said and done, nobody I know cares a crap that the guy is half “brown.” We are equal opportunity conservatives.
Most of the Cubans I know aren’t brown.
I don’t care if Cruz is purple. He is an opportunistic jerk.
Cargo,
I have no idea what you are talking about. Blogs didn’t even exist when Medicare Part D was debated. There was no outrcry, in fact, the GOP was 100% behind Bush. The extended debate was seen as highly unusual, especially because pharmaceutical lobbyist were actually actively lobbying in the halls of congress during the debate.
I was behind it also. Mr. Howler needed drug money!!!!
yes, our congress is too busy debating imagined IRS conspiracy theories as opposed to formulating and getting behind Obama on sanctions. I guess you would suggest we send military troops? What are YOU advocating? I have never seen such obfuscation of basic facts then the GOP behavior, who’s only mission is to do the EXACT opposite of whatever Obama suggests.
Might I make a suggestion and stick to the topic. What IS the alternative to the ACA? How do I get insurance if my husband loses his job? As in ME, personally, how could we afford private insurance with my MS? What would my life have looked like if my MS was ALWAYS seen as pre-existing? Give me your proven plan? And, FYI, “free market” between states doesn’t work without major government intervention and regulation. How do we treat people who can not afford insurance but don’t qualify for Medicaid? How do we treat people who CAN afford insurance but are so immature and stupid, they believe they will never get sick and end up with colossal medical bills they will never be able to pay them off? Do we just let those people die so that OUR insurance doesn’t increase to cover their costs?
Sure didn’t take this long to stray off topic. Too bad, could have been an interesting discussion but apparently no one knew what the Republican response to the ACA is/was/whatever.
Crickets…..
@Elena
What are you talking about, blogs didn’t exist?
I know people that have been blogging for over a decade. Heck, MY first blog post was seven years ago.
You keep conflating the GOP with conservatives. We’ve seen that they aren’t necessarily the same thing.
@Elena
IMAGINARY IRS conspiracy theories? So its imaginary that the IRS admitted wrong doing and Lerner is pleading the fifth, while the DOJ stonewalls the investigation? Okay then.
As for the medical plans…. I don’t have the expertise to answer your question other than to point out that your pre-existing condition problem is only one part of the problem. So, to fix that, we give control of our medical insurance and health care industries to the government?
We don’t even know what is in the bill, much less what the regulators are writing to implement it. The damn thing is STILL BEING WRITTEN.
Repeal it, salt the earth, and fire everyone that voted for it.
THEN, lets fix our health care system.
What am I advocating? Since its too late to protect Ukraine and we couldn’t do it anyway, we should activate NATO and start a military exercise with actual NATO members like Estonia, etc and protect them.
Sanctions don’t matter compared to losing Crimea and eastern Ukraine. Its up to Ukraine to protect itself. We can support that if we so desire.
Umm Cargo,
It passed in 2003, over a decade ago when blogs were NOT rampant like they are today.
I guess if the ACA is repealed, I hope you don’t know anyone that has any pre existing conditions or an serious health issues. Or if they do, they can get insurance through some corporate employer and be a slave to their insurance plan.
So, what is your plan for the Ukraine and Crimea, send military resources there?
It wasn’t Wolverine who brought up that fake terrorist attack list as part of a partisan jab against conservatives and/or Repubs. And with praise no less from the blogmeister for a “totally excellent response.” Anybody who tries to profit from false accusations like that better understand that a return volley of facts will follow, like it or not. And then the other blogmeister brought Clinton into it. Ergo the insertion of 1998 in Nairobi as a comparison. Rather much of a lack of verification for you all before condemnation.
And I think it was most impolite to suggest totally wrongly that I judge administrations only by terrorist attacks. That was to me an extremely foolish accusation. Back at you, blogmeister.
Neither the Marine Barracks in Beirut nor 9/11 were attacks upon US diplomatic missions. There was, however, a successful bombing attack against the US Embassy in Beirut in what was a very chaotic and dangerous urban civil war zone. Protection then and there was a whole different story with regard to intelligence collection and to technical planning.
I do not profit from this blog in any shape or form. Do you see a tip jar? There isn’t one. Do you see ads? There are none. I owe no one anything. We pay for the webhost and the domain out of our own pockets.
I did think it was a good response and said so. Did I accuse you or ask you? Big difference. What you should have gotten me on is bad English. Lack of subject/verb agreement. I will go fix it before I become the laughing stock of the blogosphere.
Well, whether you like his politics or not, Ted Cruz is only half-white (Irish/Italian on the maternal side.) I would say that knocks out Pat’s claim of “no issue for that white man.” On the whole, most Cubans, “brown” or whatever, can be considered Hispanic just as much as Puerto Ricans and Dominicans.
Most of the Cubans I have known consider themselves white. I am not going to get in a spitting contest over whether they are or aren’t. I always let people determine what they are.
George — I saw something a week or two ago in the media (can’t recall exactly where now) that the Repubs have stated they are working on a counterproposal to ACA involving repeal followed by replacement. That suggests to me that they have recognized certain positive parts of the ACA which are acceptable to most of us (me included)and will probably include them in their replacement proposal.
I hope they decide to keep the closure of the doughnut hole. That never seems to come up in these discussions. Name me one person on Medicare that hates that component of the ACA.
Do you suppose men are taking Viagra and are on Medicare? Does that mean that the public taxpayers are paying for THAT? Lordy Lordy. Viagra yes. Contraception for poor women, no. Cognitive dissonance.
Is Viagra an abortifacient? Seems to me it could be quite the opposite. Simply a pill to correct a bodily function not performing as it did previously. Like most other pills. Well, mostly………
Whoa, Madame. “Profit” in my post had nothing to do with money or tip jars or blog ads. It was used euphemistically, this time for profiting by scoring points in a political debate using false data. That’s all. Sorry about the misunderstanding. I harbor no such pecuniary thoughts about Moonhowlings, I assure you.
@Elena
Yes… I know. And blogs were around in 2003. As was news….conservatives expressed concern about the costs.
@Elena
You may have forgotten or not known. My daughter is a type 1 diabetic, low thyroid, low platelet count, and will probably get other autoimmune problems.
As I said…. fix certain problems. A bill like the ACA is overkill.
BREAKING: Obama Administration Caught Giving FREE High Tech Military Equipment to Russia
Featured Story:
BREAKING: Obama Administration Caught Giving FREE High Tech Military Equipment to Russia
Published March 28, 2014 at 8:18 pm – Comments
Covered California Sends Out Voter Registration Cards Pre-Marked for Democrat Party (Video)
Posted by Jim Hoft on Saturday, March 29, 2014, 7:38 PM
Obamacare in action…
A California couple contacted ABC News 10 after they received a voter registration card from Covered California marked for the Democratic Party.
More evidence that the ACA is about politics and control and not healthcare.
ABC 10 News reported:
A local couple called 10News concerned after they received an envelope from the state’s Obamacare website, Covered California. Inside was a letter discussing voter registration and a registration card pre-marked with an “x” in the box next to Democratic Party.
The couple – who did not want their identity revealed – received the letter and voter registration card from their health insurance provider Covered California, the state-run agency that implements President Obama’s Affordable Care Act.
The repugs don’t have an alternative to the ACA.
Oh, did they tell you that personally?
Cargo,
I did not forget, that is why I am, to be quite frank, astonished at your willingness to do away with the ACA. There is a reason it is an entire “package” or nothing. Insurance companies HAVE to charge higher premiums for those of us with chronic illnesses because we cost more, period. Healthy people MUST sign up for insurance in order to allow insurance companies to survive financially or else there is no choice BUT to make insurance almost unaffordable for those of us who use it more. We are all in this together Cargo, your daughter who deals with a very serious illness and my daughter who is healthy (G-d willing she will remain so).
Cargo
You and I will differ on the lack of abundance on blogs in 2002 and 2003. Even the Wash Post wasn’t online yet so I really doubt that much was happening in the way of blogging. How do I remember this? I was very involved in a land use fight and all newspapers were still read via hard copy.
Wolverine,
Ignorance is never in short supply when it comes to birth control is it? Not surprising, a man would have no problem “arming’ the weapon that creates the unwanted pregnancy but somehow become squeamish when it comes to the woman preventing the pregnancy. Unless of course, you only intend for the recipient of the Viagra to function in private with only oneself.
@Elena
And yet…the gov’t…in fact the President himself, lied repeatedly that rates would drop, access would improve, and everyone would be covered. The reality is that millions lost their healthcare, millions have seen rates and deductibles skyrocket, doctors and medical systems are either not being added to the ACA conglomeration or they have left….resulting in less access, and finally, millions are still not covered. In fact, millions of the uninsured have not and do not want to sign up.
You know as well as I do that the Democrats had no clue what was in the bill other than it would give more control to the government. The bill had not even been completed when they voted on it, using trickery and bribery. I’m waiting for a court case to go before SCOTUS to kill it because SCOTUS declared the penalty to be a tax. IF that is the case, then the bill, in this form, originated in the SENATE…..all tax bills must originate in the House.
Cargo, you are grasping at straws. Yes, the act needs tweaking. Same thing happens with all major legislation. Why do you always jump to using the word lie? Couldn’t he have been mistaken rather than lying?
Millions haven’t lost their health care. Where the problems seem to lie are with the states who insisted on doing it themselves. Now what does that tell us?
@Elena
As for blogs…they existed. There weren’t many.
Heck..Instapundit started in 2001 and he’s an aggregator. He had to be aggregating something.
Cargo,
I am not going to argue the semantics of whether they existed. The point I am making is that not even major newspapers were “online” yet so the depth of blogging was in its infancy stage.
There was NO major outcry, the senate and house was held by republicans, Medicare Part D passed in much of the same way the ACA did only there were no special committee meetings, no debate with the president attending.
I will continue to say this Cargo, the only republican who came to the table with any alternate plan was John McCain and his plan would have only covered an additional 3 million people.
Cargo, for the sake of people who live with chronic illness, who will be diagnosed with cancer, who will one day require insurance coverage, a massive change was required. Unless well people pay into the system, it was going to collapse on itself. You can’t have all these great changes that benefit people like me and your daughter without having changes we don’t like too. Life doesn’t work like that when it comes to large policy creation.
Change didn’t happen because everything was hunky dory.
Also you don’t get insurance when you get sick. You carry it long term in case you do get sick.
And the ACA is here to stay, way too many people are benefitting from the it. If you think there is way to keep just the stuff YOU like and repeal the rest you are kidding yourself. The deal with insurance companies WAS the mandate, was a guarantee that healthy people would offset the sick people.
Change happened because the Democrat party wanted to change the health insurance and health care industries of the US. There was no great demand for change outside of the Democrat party and their cheerleaders, the press.
The ACA NEEDS to be repealed. It is a drag on the economy, is too top heavy, adds too much gov’t control to health care. It is merely another leg for the Democrat party to steal votes with yet another gov’t program bribe.
The mandate is unAmerican. The ACA is an attempt to turn the insurance companies from an insurance industry into a 3rd party payer in lieu of the gov’t doing so.
If McCain’s plan would only have covered an additional 3 million..that is 3 additional million than is being covered than what the ACA has done. 6 million, according to the gov’t has signed up. The gov’t has not broken this number down in any fashion as to who these people are nor have they actually supported their statement with data. 6.2 million have lost insurance.
So far, that means 200,000 more people have lost insurance.
Plenty of people wanted change. Are you seriously trying to tell me the only people getting screwed were Democrats? Most people really don’t identify with political parties when they can’t get insurance because of pre-existing conditions. Most people aren’t political when they maxed out with medical expenses. Most people aren'[t political when they are frozen on a job so their child with leukemia stays covered.
Those are all very real things that happen to ordinary Americans.
@Elena
“There was NO major outcry, the senate and house was held by republicans, ”
You are right. There was no major outcry by the Republicans. You know..the same GOP that is being primaried by the Tea Party for supporting things like Medicare D. The GOP is NOT necessarily conservative. There was an outcry by conservatives. Remember, the conservative resistance was just getting organized with the realization that SOMEONE has to slam on the freaking brakes before the bus goes over the cliff.
It’s conservative by most people’s standards. Yes, there are a few moderates in it.
I cannot tell you the visceral dislike most people I know have of the tea party.
Cleveland Clinic CEO Dr. Toby Cosgrove told Maria Bartiromo on Sunday Morning Futures that three-quarters of ObamaCare signups have higher premiums.
“Well people who’ve signed up, about three-quarters of them, find that their premiums are higher than they had been previously with other insurance. What we do know it that it will have a major impact on healthcare providers. What we do know is that we’re going to get paid less for what we do.”
Yep….that President sure nailed the ACA in his description! Oh…wait…..no he didn’t. He lied to our faces.
Dr. Toby Cosgrove is speaking of all America? Perhaps he needs to stick to being a CEO.
Yes, Elena, I must agree that the ignorance of some about these things is most striking. However, I am confident that you yourself must surely know that these drugs are used by many males to correct a functional problem caused by a lack of adequate blood flow to those parts of the body. It’s a medical thing. If a woman has a problem with the male of the species being treated for such a medical problem, perhaps that woman wishes only to function in private by herself — – wink, wink.
The rest of your post makes little sense. Who is “squeamish” about birth control? What the Hell are you talking about?
Lots of people are squeamish about birth control. Many are squeamish because it implies that sex [gasp!!!!!] has taken place. Move the discussion to one’s parent or unmarried children having sex just to illustrate how really squeamish of a topic it becomes.
So erectile dysfunction is simply a medical problem? First off, I have no problem with ED being treated on any and all health care related policies. What women find amazing is the assumption that it will be treated and yet birth control for women is being questioned.
Let me be as blunt as possible. If the delivery system fails, then there is little likelihood that pregnancy will happen. The same standard of performance simply isn’t required for women to reproduce.
Let’s put it another way. If ED is indeed a medical condition and of course it is, then what is the consequence if it goes untreated? Do we only treat it if pregnancy is desired? Do we only treat for reproductive reasons? Of course not.
@Cargosquid
cargo – change happened because change needs to happen to get costs under control. The former system had no way of reigning in costs. We have tried no change for how many years? Time for a change.
The mandate is very American and there has been a mandate in the Maritime industry since 1798 when the founding fathers were still around – http://www.forbes.com/sites/rickungar/2011/01/17/congress-passes-socialized-medicine-and-mandates-health-insurance-in-1798/
A woman wants birth control so that she can determine her future (and possibly enjoy sex) and she is very publicly called a slut. A man wants viagra to treat his ED so that he can have sex and he is called what?
I think Pat just summed up the entire discussion rather neatly. That is the point.
@Wolverine
I am not sure what list you are talking about. Here is the Fox reference to an June 2002 attack on our Consulate in Pakistan – http://www.foxnews.com/story/2002/06/14/bomb-blast-kills-11-at-american-consulate-in-pakistan/ – where a Marine was injured. Notice the tone of the Fox report. It also references an earlier grenade attack where some Americans were killed.
@Wolverine
Yes, Cruz is half Cuban – that does not necessarily make him brown. His father also speaks out loudly that Obama should go back to Kenya.
My point is that you have a crowd that says Obama was born in Kenya (Kenyan Father, American Mother) and he should not be eligible – and the same crowd says that Cruz who was born in Canada (Cuban Father, American Mother) is eligible. The only difference is their skin color appearance.
@Pat.Herve
Rein in WHOSE costs?
The government’s? That phrase about costs keeps getting bandied about. So, whose costs are supposed to be lowered? Even here, I see that rates HAVE to rise to pay for other people. I see that taxes HAVE to go up to pay for other people. But, then I see that paying for other people at the ER is horrible. So whose costs are supposed to be lowered. We already know that Obama and the Democrats lied to us about lowering OUR costs and increasing access or even keeping what we like.
So…. if there needed to be change……fine. But THIS change was decided by the Democrat party and their enablers, the press.
@Pat.Herve
That article is interesting. The premise that the mandate is constitutional because the Framers set up that maritime insurance scheme is also interesting. Of course, the author skims over the part where he gets one thing wrong….and its a big thing.
His point was that no one HAD to become a sailor…and that tax was a requirement to do so.
Then he says: “Each of us has the option to turn down employment that would require us to purchase private health insurance under the health care reform law.”
The problem with that statement is that the current law is not based upon jobs. You must have insurance if you are breathing. There is no opting out.
Also…. his premise that the Framers knew what was “Constitutional” is flawed. Just look at the number of constitutional cases at that time. Remember, it was a Framer that passed and supported the Alien and Sedition Act…..
Therefore, TODAY’S version of the mandate forcing people to buy a product because they are alive is unAmerican.
@Pat.Herve
Forgot to add that you should go read the comments about that piece.
If you own a car, you are legally required by buy insurance. When human beings no longer have the instinct to live or be pain free, then you can opt of insurance and die.